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Old January 2 2012, 11:10 PM   #2941
sonak
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

captrek wrote: View Post
Did Bruce break his rule against killing his enemies in the first film?

Raís was on the train. Bruce sent Gordon ahead with the Batmobile to destroy part of the track. Meanwhile, Bruce engaged Raís in combat, which kept Raís from becoming aware of the gap or extricating himself from the situation.

How is that not killing?


This is what frustrates me about the part where he goes out of his way to rescue the Joker from falling at the end of TDK. I mean, he didn't do that for Ra's in BB or Harvey at the end of TDK.

He caused Dent's death directly. Yes, it was to save Gordon's son, but it was still killing, just not murder. The situation with the Joker would have been self-defense as the Joker had Batman pinned, and given his nature, might very well have killed him.


one of the things I liked about the Burton movies was that Batman was pragmatic about killing. He didn't go out of his way to kill criminals or kill them in cold blood, but he could kill when he had to.

If Nolan were really interested in "comic book realism," he'd have Batman kill occasionally, as a vigilante in his situation would probably have to do.
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Old January 2 2012, 11:20 PM   #2942
Flying Spaghetti Monster
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Another thing I hated about him saving the Joker was how physically impossible it was. Quite a lucky shot for the grapple to catch him (either his waste, leg, or ankle) but it would be impossible for any man to have the strength to pull the joker up without something to offer physical counter-balance. Of course they show him in a successive shot using a girder for counterbalance but there is no way for Batman to have positioned the grapple around the girder.

Nolan is a good filmmaker who somehow always covers his ass of a myriad of sins by clever and rather sneaky editing. Most of the last hour of the Dark Knight felt like a montage rather than a film comprised of scenes that actually play out.
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Old January 2 2012, 11:45 PM   #2943
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Broccoli wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Bruce probably killed a dozen or more people in Batman Begins. He could have also killed a lot of cops during the car chase in the end, we never saw what happened to those poor guys.
Wasn't there a line on the TV news report that said something such as "nobody was hurt"? Hand wave fix, no doubt, but I thought I remember hearing something like that.
That scene had Alfred ripping into Bruce about the whole thing. Basically telling him that he took things too far and he was lucky nobody was hurt.
I always looked at it as part of the growing pains of becoming Batman. Sometimes he's going to push things too far.
Alfred served the purpose of a reality check, keeping Bruce in line.
Lucius served the same purpose in The Dark Knight in regard to the sonar device.
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Old January 3 2012, 01:45 AM   #2944
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
Nolan is a good filmmaker who somehow always covers his ass of a myriad of sins by clever and rather sneaky editing. Most of the last hour of the Dark Knight felt like a montage rather than a film comprised of scenes that actually play out.
Truth.

jbny67 wrote: View Post
Broccoli wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Bruce probably killed a dozen or more people in Batman Begins. He could have also killed a lot of cops during the car chase in the end, we never saw what happened to those poor guys.
Wasn't there a line on the TV news report that said something such as "nobody was hurt"? Hand wave fix, no doubt, but I thought I remember hearing something like that.
That scene had Alfred ripping into Bruce about the whole thing. Basically telling him that he took things too far and he was lucky nobody was hurt.
Yep! That's it.

Still a hand wave, though.
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Old January 3 2012, 11:26 AM   #2945
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

http://www.moviehole.net/201251206-b...-speak-clearer

^ You can work it out from the title. If the story is to be believed (though it's somewhat suspect, I reckon), Nolan has succumbed to studio pressure and tidied up the sound so Bane is now more comprehensible.
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Old January 4 2012, 01:58 AM   #2946
JD
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

There was a story about this on Blastr, and the update there says WB is denying that.
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Old January 4 2012, 02:38 PM   #2947
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

The funny thing about the Bane situation is that if there was ever a time for ADR, this seems to be it. You don't even have to worry about lip-sync!

sonak wrote:
He caused Dent's death directly. Yes, it was to save Gordon's son, but it was still killing, just not murder.
sonak wrote:
If Nolan were really interested in "comic book realism," he'd have Batman kill occasionally, as a vigilante in his situation would probably have to do.
You seem to contradict yourself.
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Old January 4 2012, 02:45 PM   #2948
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

I think this whole "Nolan doesn't want ADR" is misreported. It came up during the production of TDK, when Heath Ledger died and they couldn't do any ADR for the Joker anymore, and Nolan said they don't need to because the sound in his takes was good enough.
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Old January 4 2012, 07:24 PM   #2949
sonak
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Set Harth wrote: View Post
The funny thing about the Bane situation is that if there was ever a time for ADR, this seems to be it. You don't even have to worry about lip-sync!

sonak wrote:
He caused Dent's death directly. Yes, it was to save Gordon's son, but it was still killing, just not murder.
sonak wrote:
If Nolan were really interested in "comic book realism," he'd have Batman kill occasionally, as a vigilante in his situation would probably have to do.
You seem to contradict yourself.

no I don't.
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Old January 4 2012, 09:13 PM   #2950
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

sonak wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post
The funny thing about the Bane situation is that if there was ever a time for ADR, this seems to be it. You don't even have to worry about lip-sync!

sonak wrote:
He caused Dent's death directly. Yes, it was to save Gordon's son, but it was still killing, just not murder.
sonak wrote:
If Nolan were really interested in "comic book realism," he'd have Batman kill occasionally, as a vigilante in his situation would probably have to do.
You seem to contradict yourself.

no I don't.
I donít see a contradiction here. It says first that Bruce breaks his ďI donít kill my enemiesĒ rules, and second that itís not realistic for someone in his position to keep such a rule. So if youíre going to kill, kill, and stop saying youíre honoring some personal rule that you never kill your enemies.

Although Bruce often claims he refuses to kill his enemy, Batman Begins initially introduces a weaker and more realistic version of the rule, when Bruce states simply that he wonít be an executioner.

Dentís death is by no means an execution. Itís the collateral damage from saving the little Gordon. The only alternative to killing Dent is sacrificing the hostage. In that situation, by all means, kill!

Raísís death is more morally ambiguous. Bruce derails an occupied train, has an opportunity to extract the passenger and deliver him to police, but chooses to leave him there to die. That looks an awful lot like an execution.
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Old January 4 2012, 10:04 PM   #2951
sonak
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

captrek wrote: View Post
sonak wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post
The funny thing about the Bane situation is that if there was ever a time for ADR, this seems to be it. You don't even have to worry about lip-sync!



You seem to contradict yourself.

no I don't.
I don’t see a contradiction here. It says first that Bruce breaks his “I don’t kill my enemies” rules, and second that it’s not realistic for someone in his position to keep such a rule. So if you’re going to kill, kill, and stop saying you’re honoring some personal rule that you never kill your enemies.

Although Bruce often claims he refuses to kill his enemy, Batman Begins initially introduces a weaker and more realistic version of the rule, when Bruce states simply that he won’t be an executioner.

Dent’s death is by no means an execution. It’s the collateral damage from saving the little Gordon. The only alternative to killing Dent is sacrificing the hostage. In that situation, by all means, kill!

Ra’s’s death is more morally ambiguous. Bruce derails an occupied train, has an opportunity to extract the passenger and deliver him to police, but chooses to leave him there to die. That looks an awful lot like an execution.

good summary
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Old January 5 2012, 04:15 AM   #2952
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Conan O'brien just made fun of the whole Bane dialogue situation

It's official the whole thing has become a pop culture trend.

*Awaits fan parodies with Batman and Bane and neither one understanding each other on funnyordie or college humor*
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Old January 5 2012, 06:13 AM   #2953
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
*Awaits fan parodies with Batman and Bane and neither one understanding each other on funnyordie or college humor*
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Old January 5 2012, 06:32 PM   #2954
Samurai8472
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
*Awaits fan parodies with Batman and Bane and neither one understanding each other on funnyordie or college humor*

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Old January 5 2012, 06:48 PM   #2955
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Re: The Dark Knight Rises Anticipation Station

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
*Awaits fan parodies with Batman and Bane and neither one understanding each other on funnyordie or college humor*
That would be funny if not for the fact that we could understand what they were saying the entire time, until it became necessary to the joke for them to speak in gibberish.
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