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Old July 24 2010, 12:47 AM   #16
T'Baio
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Re: Pirate of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

hyzmarca wrote: View Post
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I kinda' thought that was embarrassing for Johnny Depp.

For all the anti-commercialism of his youth, he really has turned into quite the shill, hasn't he?
Pirates of the Caribbean is a great series, though.

In his youth he made good movies. He still makes good movies.

I trust Johnny to make good movies.
I'm unsure of where you saw me make a judgement on the quality of the movie?
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Old July 24 2010, 01:42 AM   #17
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Re: Pirate of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

T'Baio wrote: View Post
I kinda' thought that was embarrassing for Johnny Depp.

For all the anti-commercialism of his youth, he really has turned into quite the shill, hasn't he?
I don't see how it's being a shill to want people to go see the movie you're making, and to interact with fans. He hasn't signed up for Transformers 4 just yet.
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Old July 24 2010, 01:52 AM   #18
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

It seems shill-ish to me the way he's pausing for presumed applause, and it's embarrassing when there is none. Also being in character while referring to his co-stars by their real names...the whole thing was awkward and embarrassing to me. That's my opinion on it. *shrug*
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Old July 24 2010, 01:57 AM   #19
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

T'Baio wrote: View Post
It seems shill-ish to me the way he's pausing for presumed applause, and it's embarrassing when there is none. Also being in character while referring to his co-stars by their real names...the whole thing was awkward and embarrassing to me. That's my opinion on it. *shrug*
I agree. I think doing a fourth movie was a mistake, especially considering it honestly seems like a cash grab. Most of the supporting cast is gone, a new director is being brought in... I'm trying to think of good fourth installments and none spring to mind. Unless you want to consider X-Men Origins: Wolverine...
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Old July 24 2010, 01:59 AM   #20
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

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I'm trying to think of good fourth installments and none spring to mind. ...

STAR TREK IV: THE VOYAGE HOME.

(Aka, "the one with the whales.")

There are people who really like THUNDERBALL, too, although, personally, it's not my favorite Bond movie . . . .
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Old July 24 2010, 02:06 AM   #21
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
I'm trying to think of good fourth installments and none spring to mind. ...

STAR TREK IV: THE VOYAGE HOME.

(Aka, "the one with the whales.")

There are people who really like THUNDERBALL, too, although, personally, it's not my favorite Bond movie . . . .
See, I never got the appeal of that movie. It didn't even really feel like a Star Trek movie to me. It's kind of light-hearted fluff, which is not what I look for in a Star Trek film.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:11 AM   #22
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Greg Cox wrote: View Post
JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
I'm trying to think of good fourth installments and none spring to mind. ...

STAR TREK IV: THE VOYAGE HOME.

(Aka, "the one with the whales.")

There are people who really like THUNDERBALL, too, although, personally, it's not my favorite Bond movie . . . .
See, I never got the appeal of that movie. It didn't even really feel like a Star Trek movie to me. It's kind of light-hearted fluff, which is not what I look for in a Star Trek film.

It's fun, charming, and incredibly watchable. And, up until the new movie, the most commercially successful Trek movie to date . . . probably because it's the one that's most accessible to non-Trekkies.

By coincidence, I was actually talking to Catherine Hicks about this at Shore Leave a few weeks ago. She also thought that it was a STAR TREK movie for everybody . . . including friends and family who don't usually watch STAR TREK.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:20 AM   #23
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Greg Cox wrote: View Post


STAR TREK IV: THE VOYAGE HOME.

(Aka, "the one with the whales.")

There are people who really like THUNDERBALL, too, although, personally, it's not my favorite Bond movie . . . .
See, I never got the appeal of that movie. It didn't even really feel like a Star Trek movie to me. It's kind of light-hearted fluff, which is not what I look for in a Star Trek film.

It's fun, charming, and incredibly watchable. And, up until the new movie, the most commercially successful Trek movie to date . . . probably because it's the one thats most accessible to non-Trekkies.

By coincidence, I was actually talking to Catherine Hicks about this at Shore Leave a few weeks. She also thought that it was a STAR TREK movie for everybody . . . including friends and family who don't usually watch STAR TREK.
I feel it was the most commercially successful because it was a sort of dumbed down version of Star Trek. That's not to say that the original series didn't have light-hearted episodes of its own ("The Trouble With Tribbles", for example) but I guess I prefer a little bit more substance in my Star Trek.

I can get behind the new Abrams movie because I feel like even though it's more space opera than what Star Trek usually is, I still feel like it was a more accurate representation of what Star Trek is than The Voyage Home.

Then again, I don't view "accessibility" as a measure of success, mostly because sometimes I question the value of accessibility when it comes to audiences. People have no problem enjoying the Transformers movies, for example, which in my opinion is brainless drivel. The same can almost be said for the Pirates of the Caribbean movies. The first movie was harmless fun, but the sequels were over-bloated exercises in needless over-commercialization. I feel like the fourth film is continuing an old-fashioned Hollywood trend: milking something for all its worth. I guess I wouldn't mind if the quality was up to par, but after the last two Pirates movies I have little desire to see a fourth.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:25 AM   #24
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

I always thought First Contact was a huge hit with fans and casual movie goers alike...anywho it isn't a 4th film of the franchise.

I never got the appeal of these movies...Johnnie Depp is of course bringing alot to it but still.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:28 AM   #25
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

Jetfire wrote: View Post
I always thought First Contact was a huge hit with fans and casual movie goers alike...anywho it isn't a 4th film of the franchise.
I see it more like the second film in a series, if you consider Generations the first in TNG's film series, and usually second films are generally pretty good. Considering Nemesis then was the fourth film and...

I never got the appeal of these movies...Johnnie Depp is of course bringing alot to it but still.
I think had Depp refused to do this movie it wouldn't have happened. I have a feeling they'll continue making these movies so long as they make money and so long as Depp plays Sparrow.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:34 AM   #26
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

^
I guess so. And The JJ movies are yet a new chapter...

About Depp...I can see them doing 2 more after this to make the total 6...then the PoTC franchise can be up there with Star Wars.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:37 AM   #27
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Greg Cox wrote: View Post
JacksonArcher wrote: View Post

See, I never got the appeal of that movie. It didn't even really feel like a Star Trek movie to me. It's kind of light-hearted fluff, which is not what I look for in a Star Trek film.

It's fun, charming, and incredibly watchable. And, up until the new movie, the most commercially successful Trek movie to date . . . probably because it's the one thats most accessible to non-Trekkies.

By coincidence, I was actually talking to Catherine Hicks about this at Shore Leave a few weeks. She also thought that it was a STAR TREK movie for everybody . . . including friends and family who don't usually watch STAR TREK.
I feel it was the most commercially successful because it was a sort of dumbed down version of Star Trek. That's not to say that the original series didn't have light-hearted episodes of its own ("The Trouble With Tribbles", for example) but I guess I prefer a little bit more substance in my Star Trek. .
I wouldn't describe it as dumbed down, just lighter and breezier . . . like many popular episodes of TOS such as (as you observed) "Tribbles," "A Piece of the Action," "Assignment: Earth," etc. There's no rule that says that they can't do any comedy episode (or movie) once and awhile.

Certainly, as fourth movies go, "the one with the whales" was both a commercial and critical success. In my experience, it's one of the few TREK movies that actually made an impression on general audiences . . . and is still remembered fondly decades later.

We can only hope the fourth PIRATES movie will be as entertaining . . . .
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Old July 24 2010, 02:41 AM   #28
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
I wouldn't describe it as dumbed down, just lighter and breezier . . . like many popular episodes of TOS such as (as you observed) "Tribbles," "A Piece of the Action," "Assignment: Earth," etc. There's no rule that says that they can't do any comedy episode (or movie) once and awhile.
I'm not disputing that. I'm just saying those type of episodes or films are not my cup of tea and not what initially attracted me to Trek.

Certainly, as fourth movies go, "the one with the whales" was a both a commercial and critical success. In my experience, it's one of the few TREK movies that actually made an impression on general audiences . . . and is still remembered decades later.
I guess I begrudge TVH because it isn't a "traditional" Star Trek movie and I think general audiences enjoyed it because it was more light-hearted. It wasn't until Abrams' movie that I was convinced that general audiences could enjoy more of a traditional Star Trek film on a large scale.

We can only hope the fourth PIRATES movie will be as entertaining . . . .
Don't hold your breath. It's from the same writers as the last two films, which were pretty bad and over-bloated in my opinion.
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Old July 24 2010, 02:48 AM   #29
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post

Don't hold your breath. It's from the same writers as the last two films, which were pretty bad and over-bloated in my opinion.

Perhaps, although, like I said, I really loved the novel by Tim Powers. And I've seen comments from the TPTB that maybe they realize that that the previous PIRATES sequels were a bit "bloated" as you said. Hopefully, with the novel serving as a solid foundation, they can effect a course correction.

As for TVH, that's still the best example I can think of a fourth movie that, for most people, did not disappoint. To the contrary, it was actually more popular than any of the prior movies.

That may have had less to do with the fact that it was light-hearted than with the fact that you didn't need a degree in TREK history to understand the movie. Once you got past the opening bit with the Klingons, you had an engaging time-travel lark that didn't really require any prior knowledge of the STAR TREK universe . . . .
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Old July 24 2010, 03:01 AM   #30
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides Teaser

Greg Cox wrote: View Post

Perhaps, although, like I said, I really loved the novel by Tim Powers. And I've seen comments from the TPTB that maybe they realize that that the previous PIRATES sequels were a bit "bloated" as you said. Hopefully, with the novel serving as a solid foundation, they can effect a course correction.
Who knows. Besides TVH, I can't think of many examples of fourth installments that were any good. In fact, I can think of more bad fourth installments -- Batman & Robin, Superman IV: The Quest for Peace, Indiana Jones and The Kingdom of the Crystal Skull, Rocky IV, Terminator Salvation, and the list continues -- than I can good. Perhaps a new cast and director can liven things up for the series, but I'm going to remain cautiously optimistic.

As for TVH, that's still the best example I can think of a fourth movie that, for most people, did not disappoint. To the contrary, it was actually more popular than any of the prior movies.

That may have had less to do with the fact that it was light-hearted than with the fact that you didn't need a degree in TREK history to understand the movie. Once you got past the opening bit with the Klingons, you had an engaging time-travel lark that didn't really require any prior knowledge of the STAR TREK universe . . . .
Can you think of any other examples? I can't.
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