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View Poll Results: Grading
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Old July 26 2010, 02:53 AM   #301
JacksonArcher
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

No words.
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Old July 26 2010, 03:00 AM   #302
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

^ It got overlooked

Samurai8472 wrote: View Post
Inception trailer spoof funny!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrYPJ4Yc31g
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Old July 26 2010, 03:01 AM   #303
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Inception topped the box office for a second week with $43 million, beating the debut of the Angelina Jolie blockbuster Salt which opened in 2nd place with a mediocre $36 million.

That's only a 30% drop for the film which is very good. The film has already earned $143 million domestically and $84 million overseas, having already earned back its budget. The film is a fantastic success and positive word-of-mouth and continued strong business will likely push the film way past $200 million domestically at the box office.
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Old July 26 2010, 04:43 AM   #304
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Exactly. And he didn't tell them because had he did, they might have not gone on the journey/mission with him, and he desperately needed to do this so he could complete the mission for Saito and return home for his children. He was willing to not only endanger his life but the lives of others because that's how completely and utterly desperate he was to see his children again. That makes a lot of sense to me.
I dunno, if that were true I would have expected the other members of the team to act a lot more outraged than they did. I didn't get much of a sense of outrage from anybody in that scene; you'd think at least one person would have questioned him about whether he knew this all along and was keeping it from everybody. To me, it just seemed like an arbitrary way of raising the stakes when it was already established that no one can die in their dreams.
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Old July 26 2010, 04:47 AM   #305
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
I'm sorry, I just don't buy it. They aren't real dream boxes, they would be as unreliable as anything else in a dream If I dreamed of a computer hooked up to the internet, and I was on the computer Googling something, I'm not actually on Google.
It's a movie.

Disbelief.

Suspend it.
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Old July 26 2010, 05:14 AM   #306
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Level 2 Diagnostic wrote: View Post
I dunno, if that were true I would have expected the other members of the team to act a lot more outraged than they did. I didn't get much of a sense of outrage from anybody in that scene; you'd think at least one person would have questioned him about whether he knew this all along and was keeping it from everybody.
One of them did. I'm trying to remember who, but one of the characters was so pissed off that Cobb lied about that that he was actually going to sit out the rest of the job until it was pointed out that he still couldn't wake up voluntarily because of the strength of this batch of drugs, and he'd be just as screwed if he got shot by the defensive projections on this level as if it happened on a lower one.
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Old July 26 2010, 05:16 AM   #307
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

^I believe it was Tom Hardy's character.
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Old July 26 2010, 05:25 AM   #308
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
I'm sorry, I just don't buy it. They aren't real dream boxes, they would be as unreliable as anything else in a dream If I dreamed of a computer hooked up to the internet, and I was on the computer Googling something, I'm not actually on Google.
It's a movie.

Disbelief.

Suspend it.
So if I made a movie where someone revived a character who wasn't breathing by massaging their feet, and you couldn't believe that, I could just say:

"It's a movie.

Disbelief.

Suspend it" ?
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Old July 26 2010, 05:26 AM   #309
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

It would depend on the context of the foot massage.
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Old July 26 2010, 05:26 AM   #310
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

I had a question that was most likely answered. What did Cobb do to convince Fischer to go into the level 3 dream (snow level)? I remember Brooking telling Cobb that he was responsible for the kidnapping. Was that the projection of Brooking from Fischer's subconscious or was that Eames pretending to be Brooking?
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Old July 26 2010, 05:42 AM   #311
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
I'm sorry, I just don't buy it. They aren't real dream boxes, they would be as unreliable as anything else in a dream If I dreamed of a computer hooked up to the internet, and I was on the computer Googling something, I'm not actually on Google.
It's a movie.

Disbelief.

Suspend it.
So if I made a movie where someone revived a character who wasn't breathing by massaging their feet, and you couldn't believe that, I could just say:

"It's a movie.

Disbelief.

Suspend it" ?
If the story, drama and context is good sure, go for it.

How does the device work? Who cares? That's not the story.

Why does the device work the way it does? Who cares? That's not the story.

It's called a plot device. Sometimes they work, for the plot that is, sometimes they don't. Take, for example, Voyager's deflector dish and Seven's nanoprobes or any other technobabble solution. They're stupid, silly, plot device ways to end the story with a nice little bow. "How do we solve our problem with the week? Well, with our techno greebles, of course!"

Compare this to, say, a TNG episode like "Deja Q" or "Matter of Time" where a technobabble solution is used to solve the crisis the Enterprise is in (the planet's "falling" moon and the enironmental disaster on the planet respectively) but it doesn't matter because those things aren't the story it's just the back drop to frame around the story (Q dealing with humnanity, the crew dealing with the time traveler/Picard with making choices).

This movie is the latter. The movie isn't about how the dream-machine works, how well the logic of the dream-stuff holds up or any of that. Hell, it's not even about their mission! It's about Leo's character's struggle with his demons, regrets and guilt as well as being about the concept of ideas, symbolism and what really matters in life (for Leo's character, his kids.)

The dream stuff, the machine, all of that is just a backdrop to tell the story so it doesn't matter how it works.

So if someone can make a story that works and sells its drama but it's ability to work hinges on someone being able to perform CPR through feet knock yourself out. But just putting it in their randomly "because its a movie" won't work.

Just like solving a crisis because the deflector dish or Seven's nanoprobes can do anything doesn't work.

The dream machine has to be able to do what it does so we can have the story and not only that make it engrossing and interesting enough to pull you into it as well as thrill you. No, it doesn't make sense when scrutinized. By the movie's own logic, yeah, they should've been in free-fall/negative-gravity from the second level on down. Yeah, maybe the dream-machine in the dreams shouldn't have worked the same way as the real one but none of that matters because none of that is the real story.

The real story is about Leo's character and his inner struggles and his journey so all of the nonsense gets a blank check to not make sense.

Something can't make sense for the sake of not making sense, however, you have to sell it and to sell it you make a good reason for it to not make sense like a good story.

How did the Enterprise stop the falling moon? Technobabble. Doesn't matter. The story was about Q learning about humanity and getting back into The Continuum through "finding his inner humanity" and comitting the selfless act.

How did the Enterprise correct the global warming problems on the planet? Technobabble. Doesn't matter. The story was about the crew dealing with this man claiming to be from the future, the doubt he was causing in all of them about their mission and, more importantly, Picard realizing how important Choice is even when faced with a way to not have to make a choice. Being in control of his destiny.

How does the dream machine work? Doesn't matter. The story was about Leo's character.
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Old July 26 2010, 05:54 AM   #312
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Agreed. The dream machine works because it works. That's all we need to know. How they get into someone's dreams isn't important; it's what happens after they do it that matters.
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Old July 26 2010, 06:00 AM   #313
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

I would agree. For the most part anyway.

But in any story, believeablity is important. The props, premises and conceits don't have to make perfect sense, but they do have to work enough to be believable. I don't think the dream boxes, an important story element, is not believable. People are giving Nolan a pass on this because he is, well, Nolan!

Despite Nolan's intentions, Leo's story isn't all that captivating. Mal seems so out of place in every scene that she's in. That may be intentional, but at the same time, she isn't a character, and the whole plot with her and Leo feels like something worse than a bad romance novel. People complained about Leo/ Winslet in Titanic.

Personally, I was far moved by the Murphy plot where he tries to reconcile with his dad.Unlock the Leo story, it wasn't as overwritten or as melodramatic. The Leo subplot was not nearly as powerful.
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Old July 26 2010, 06:04 AM   #314
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote: View Post
I would agree. For the most part anyway.

But in any story, believeablity is important. The props, premises and conceits don't have to make perfect sense, but they do have to work enough to be believable. I don't think the dream boxes, an important story element, is not believable. People are giving Nolan a pass on this because he is, well, Nolan!
I agree about believability. I don't believe that the dream boxes could work in our world. However, I do believe that the dream boxes can world in the world of Inception. That's why they call it fiction.
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Old July 26 2010, 06:40 AM   #315
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Re: Inception (Christopher Nolan, Leonardo DiCaprio) Grading & Discuss

bigdaddy wrote: View Post
Trippy wrote: View Post
I think if all the participants believe the dreamboxes are real, they are real.

Duh!

I'm sorry, but isn't that the whole fucking point of the movie?!?! You don't know what is a dream and isn't a dream after awhile.
By that logic, you can only be shot in a dream if you believe the bullet is real. So if you never see the gun or the person shooting at you, and you have no reason to believe anyone would be shooting at you, how could you be shot? And yet we see several people being taken out from long distances with sniper rifles.
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