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Old May 17 2010, 02:47 AM   #16
Servo
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

Christopher wrote: View Post
What I'd really like to see evolving from this universe is a Justice League show, anchored by Phil Morris.
Would you have Superman as a main character, or as a recurring one, or even on the show at all?

I know in reality it was due to licensing issues, but did the creators of the 90's Justice League pilot have an in-show reason planned for why Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman weren't around, should the show have been picked up?
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Old May 17 2010, 02:54 AM   #17
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Also, from my understanding, we've never had a theatrical version of the character with that one-word title as well (since Donner's movie was called Superman: The Movie, however I am not sure if it was credited during the opening title sequence as just Superman or not).
Technically, yeah, you're right. There was a 15-part serial from the late 40's that showed at movie theatres that was called "Superman", so there's been a theatrical version with that name, just not a feature length one.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:03 AM   #18
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

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Actually that was the official title of the 1996 Warner Bros. animated series that's more commonly known as Superman: The Animated Series.
I think you have that reversed. The title of the 1996 cartoon was always Superman: The Animated Series, but was often times simply shortened to Superman for promos and TV listings.

Interestingly, the show never showed its title during its run.

As an interesting aside, the show was then later retitled The New Superman Adventures when it combined with The New Batman Adventures.

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
(since Donner's movie was called Superman: The Movie, however I am not sure if it was credited during the opening title sequence as just Superman or not).
The title as displayed in the film was simply Superman.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:19 AM   #19
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

JacksonArcher wrote: View Post
Also, from my understanding, we've never had a theatrical version of the character with that one-word title as well (since Donner's movie was called Superman: The Movie, however I am not sure if it was credited during the opening title sequence as just Superman or not).
As with S:TAS, it's a case where the well-known promotional title differs from the official title. The Donner film was officially just Superman. (To Broccoli: IMDb says TAS was officially just Superman, though I admit I haven't corroborated it.)

What's interesting about the title Superman, though, is that it doesn't seem to need to be represented onscreen by those eight letters. Neither the '88 nor the '96 animated series ever showed the word "Superman" onscreen in its main titles, though the former did have it spoken by the announcer. And I believe the onscreen title to Superman Returns was just "Returns" over the S-shield. Batman Forever did the same, using the character's insignia as a sort of pictograph for his name, and Batman: TAS didn't have an onscreen title either.


Servo wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
What I'd really like to see evolving from this universe is a Justice League show, anchored by Phil Morris.
Would you have Superman as a main character, or as a recurring one, or even on the show at all?
Well, I'm not fully convinced Tom Welling could pull off Superman, and it seems he'd be reluctant to do it full-time, so a recurring guest presence might be the best way to go. Similarly, Black Canary would have to be an intermittent guest so long as Alaina Huffman's committed to Stargate Universe, and Kyle Gallner's film career would make Impulse appearances infrequent.

Anyway, I think Morris would make a stronger lead than Welling, and let's face it, Phil Morris deserves a show of his own, I don't care whether it's Justice League or John Jones, Metropolis PD.


I know in reality it was due to licensing issues, but did the creators of the 90's Justice League pilot have an in-show reason planned for why Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman weren't around, should the show have been picked up?
Probably they just wouldn't have acknowledged the existence of those characters. Most live-action superhero shows have historically treated their star heroes as the only ones in existence, even if they were based on characters from Marvel or DC where there were plenty of other heroes around.

Also, keep in mind the context. At the time that pilot was made, the comics' JLA had been without the big three for over a decade (or at least they had been until shortly before the pilot was made). So the pilot was based more on the era of Justice League International, which is why it was played for comedy and featured Martian Manhunter, Guy Gardner, Fire, and Ice on the team. It had been a long time since the JLA was expected to include Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman, so the pilot's creators would've probably felt no need to justify their absence.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:36 AM   #20
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

^ Ah, fair enough. I was unsure of their status in the comics at the time the pilot was made. I suppose it would be easier to get away with if it was a Smallville spin-off JL show. Again, no-one would expect Batman or Wonder Woman to be on the show, seeing as they never appeared or were mentioned in Smallville continuity. Superman could just be off doing Superman things, with the occasional appearance. Or have his absence be part of the story arc.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:42 AM   #21
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

Christopher wrote: View Post
As with S:TAS, it's a case where the well-known promotional title differs from the official title. The Donner film was officially just Superman. (To Broccoli: IMDb says TAS was officially just Superman, though I admit I haven't corroborated it.)
And you might still be right. It is just everything that I have read about the production of the series has indicated the opposite.

What's interesting about the title Superman, though, is that it doesn't seem to need to be represented onscreen by those eight letters. Neither the '88 nor the '96 animated series ever showed the word "Superman" onscreen in its main titles, though the former did have it spoken by the announcer. And I believe the onscreen title to Superman Returns was just "Returns" over the S-shield. Batman Forever did the same, using the character's insignia as a sort of pictograph for his name, and Batman: TAS didn't have an onscreen title either.
The in-movie title for Superman Returns was Superman Returns (although the S-shield was shown before it). In the trailers it just showed the S-shield and the word "returns".

When S:TAS was combined with The New Batman Adventures, the title was shown, however as The New Batman/Superman Adventures. But that is kind of a different case.

However, you are right. A character like Superman is so iconic, that all you need to do is throw up the S-shield and everyone will know what it is.


Kyle Gallner's film career would make Impulse appearances infrequent.
Yes...the success that that is...

I kid. I kid. Seriously though, many people online seem to want a Justice League spin-off. Personally, I don't think it is that good of an idea. I think the reason the appearances of other characters work in Smallville is that is given in limited amounts.

I suppose it would be like The Lone Gunmen. The characters in The X-Files were great and provided the comic relief when needed. On their own, they didn't really work.

Also, keep in mind the context. At the time that pilot was made, the comics' JLA had been without the big three for over a decade (or at least they had been until shortly before the pilot was made). So the pilot was based more on the era of Justice League International, which is why it was played for comedy and featured Martian Manhunter, Guy Gardner, Fire, and Ice on the team. It had been a long time since the JLA was expected to include Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman, so the pilot's creators would've probably felt no need to justify their absence.
The early 90s was a strange time for JLA in the comics. The Big Three were never a part of the team...unless they were needed for a story. Then suddenly, they were active members.

Of course that all changed in 1996/1997 with JLA launched under the direction of Grant Morrison where he brought the JLA back to their roots with the "classic" members.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:47 AM   #22
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

It's a shame really, because it'd be great to see a weekly Superman show on TV again. Plus, if I'm honest, I'd be much more interested in a TV show, than another movie at this point.
I agree. At this point, they could accomplish more on TV instead of having another big budget movie where Superman doesn't fight anybody.
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Old May 17 2010, 04:09 AM   #23
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

This is just my opinion and will get shot down...

I think a Superman TV series would work if it had a period feel...maybe post WW2...almost dream like. It is hard to fit Superman in with 2010 with out him losing some of the charm that makes the character great...look at Smallville...there seems to be this need to make him darker or the setting darker than just doing a Superman story. I would also turn away from making him a Christ like figure...like SR and Smallville has done...just make him a hero, everyone's pal...he doesn't need to appear/be God like...even though he is in the eyes of the public. The stories should be inspiring the best in humanity...not just some soap opera drama freak of the week non-sense. I am rambling an need to lay down...being sick sucks.
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Old May 17 2010, 04:24 AM   #24
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

I'd rather the show finally die and go off the air so that a few years from now, we could stand the chance of getting a real Superman story with some actually talented writers and main lead.
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Old May 17 2010, 04:45 AM   #25
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

Servo wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
On the other hand, I choose to think of the title these days as a reference to Lois's nickname for Clark (which, by the way, this show cribbed from Superman: The Animated Series, just as it cribbed Jimmy's "CK" nickname for Clark from Lois and Clark). So it's not a show about Smallville, Kansas anymore, it's a show about Clark "Smallville" Kent.
I suppose I never really thought about it like that.
A lot of people think of the show's title like that since the actual town doesn't figure so prominently anymore.

Jetfire wrote: View Post
I think a Superman TV series would work if it had a period feel...
The teaser for the 9th season finale had a very retro feel. That's the next best thing.

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Old May 17 2010, 04:47 AM   #26
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

RandyS wrote: View Post
As for Welling, if he doesn't want to do it, chuck him and get somebody else.
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I'd accept a re-cast character line-up if it was absolutely necessary to get a proper Superman show off the ground.
Ugh! No recasting.
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Old May 17 2010, 04:51 AM   #27
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
RandyS wrote: View Post
As for Welling, if he doesn't want to do it, chuck him and get somebody else.
Servo wrote: View Post
I'd accept a re-cast character line-up if it was absolutely necessary to get a proper Superman show off the ground.
Ugh! No recasting.
I meant if it was a Superman show that wasn't a direct continuation of Smallville. If you're going to connect the two, then keep the same actors (if possible). If it's a whole new Superman show, then feel free to re-cast. Just make sure that you either secure Allison Mack, or don't have the Chloe character at all.
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Old May 17 2010, 05:00 AM   #28
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

^ If it's unrelated to Smallville and Chloe is included, I'd recast her as well. Not doing so would be as distracting as in-show recasting.
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Old May 17 2010, 05:28 AM   #29
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

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^ If it's unrelated to Smallville and Chloe is included, I'd recast her as well. Not doing so would be as distracting as in-show recasting.
I agree. And lets face it, Allison Mack really isn't that good of an actor where no one will be able to fill her shoes.
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Old May 17 2010, 03:48 PM   #30
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Re: Re-branding Smallville as a Superman show (spoilers up to S9 final

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Kyle Gallner's film career would make Impulse appearances infrequent.
Yes...the success that that is...
I wouldn't know about the quality or popularity of his work, since I don't see many movies and I don't think I've seen any that he was in. All I know is that IMDb shows an awful lot of recent and in-production motion picture credits for him, which presumably explains his absence from Smallville. Whether or not his work is critically successful, he seems to be in demand with filmmakers.


Jetfire wrote: View Post
I think a Superman TV series would work if it had a period feel...maybe post WW2...almost dream like. It is hard to fit Superman in with 2010 with out him losing some of the charm that makes the character great...
I think eventually it'll be hard to do a version of Superman that isn't a period piece. I mean, print newspapers already seem to be a dying medium, phone booths have almost ceased to exist, and with advancing medical technology, there may come a time when eyeglasses are pretty much obsolete. Also, advances in facial-recognition technology would make it pretty easy to crack a superhero's secret identity. Not to mention what global warming might do to the climate in Kansas, possibly rendering it unsuitable for farming.


Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
^ If it's unrelated to Smallville and Chloe is included, I'd recast her as well. Not doing so would be as distracting as in-show recasting.
Has that ever happened before -- a character original to one adaptation of a superhero comic being adopted by another adaptation without having already been incorporated into the comic? Harley Quinn comes close, since she appeared as the featured villain in the Birds of Prey TV series only a few years after she was added to the comics continuity, but that still doesn't make the cut. Same with X-23, Wolverine's teenage female clone introduced in X-Men Evolution; she was added to the comics a couple of years before she made her first computer-game appearance.
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