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View Poll Results: Grade Iron Man 2
Excellent 60 36.36%
Above Average 67 40.61%
Average 29 17.58%
Below Average 6 3.64%
Terrible 3 1.82%
Voters: 165. You may not vote on this poll

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Old May 10 2010, 08:30 PM   #226
Chris_Johnston
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Captaindemotion wrote: View Post
I voted 'Above Average' but it was just above average. Quite disappointing.

The original was funny, witty, punchy and fast moving. This one started well but lost its way soon after Rourke escaped from prison, not picking up again until very near the end. Justin Theroux's screenplay was all over the place; who thought that the scene were Tony and Rhodey destroyed Tony's house was actually funny? Not me.

Samuel L Jackson was playing Sam Jackson, not Nick Fury; he was playing for laughs, not as a badass. And Sam Rockwell gave perhaps the first performance of his career that didn't have me wondering why he isn't a bigger star. IM was sidelined for much of the movie and Mickey Rourke spent most of his time soldering and tinkering. I was heartily sick of the Stark Expo by the end and Danko was disposed of much too quickly in the end.

And what happened to the AC/DC soundtrack? Two f*cking songs?!

This felt more like the typical muddled 3rd movie (X3, Spider-man 3, Blade Trinity) than the usual triumphant 2nd one (X2, The Dark Knight, Spider-man 2, Blade 2 etc). Some highlights made up for it, such as the IM-War Machine-Drones showdown, Scarlett in that outfit and the fight at Monaco, but all in all, not what I was hoping for.
I mostly agree with this, except that I'm not a fan of AC/DC, so two songs was plenty for me.
I voted Average.
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Old May 10 2010, 08:42 PM   #227
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

captcalhoun wrote: View Post
according to Favreau, a lot of Natasha's moves are actually from Lucha Libre. yes, as in the Mexican wrestling.
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Old May 10 2010, 10:39 PM   #228
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Hermiod wrote: View Post
My only issue with Natasha in this movie was the fact that she didn't drop the American accent when her true identity was revealed.
So if you could speak perfect Russian, would you start speaking it with an accent as soon as someone found out you were American?

People don't generally want to have an accent...
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Old May 10 2010, 10:51 PM   #229
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Natasha isn't supposed to have an accent. Master Spies usually don't. Whenever she has the accent it's because the writers aren't doing their homework or it's just played for laughs/camp factor (like in "Superhero Squad")
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Old May 11 2010, 12:11 AM   #230
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Saying this movie is an "F" is pure hyperbole. It's no-where near being one of the most terrible movies made. Is it the greatest? No. Is it mediocre? At worst I'd say "Yes." Is it F-Worthy like Batman and Robin or pretty much any movie ever featured on MST3K? No way.
Agreed that it's not quite an F. The mere presence of Robert Downey Jr. & Gwyneth Paltrow precludes that. However, even on my most charitable day, I can't see grading this movie above a C+. On an uncharitable day, it bores me to D- levels. It's sadly painful in its averageness and lack of plot cohesion.

The Tony Stark is dying plotline didn't have the weight it should have. I understand that they want to keep a sense of fun to the Tony Stark character, but I think it doesn't diminish his humor at all if we find out that it's masking a genuine fear of death. It's an interesting question: What would a superhero do if he knew he only had a year to live? Sadly, the movie doesn't explore that to any satisfaction. I would have liked to see how Pepper Potts would have reacted had she found out about Tony's illness before he was cured. Also, the temporary stop-gap treatments given to him by Black Widow took away from the urgency of the storyline.

In general, the Avengers elements of the film were a distraction. I would have kept their scenes down to a minimum. (BTW, when Nick Fury was in the donut shop, did anyone else expect Emil Blonsky to show up and try to rob it?)

As with the 1st Iron Man, the best part of the movie was watching Robert Downey Jr. be eccentric. I'm always up for more of this, but personally, I think it's more entertaining when he gets to play off of Jude Law & Rachel McAdams in Sherlock Holmes. In Iron Man, it seems like most of his quips are exchanged with a disembodied computer voice.

Gwyneth Paltrow was again entertaining as Pepper Potts, but I felt like, despite her promotion, they didn't really do anything new with the character.

I wish Terrance Howard had come back as Col. Rhodes. Don Cheadle is a great actor but he seems very out of his element in a superhero movie. He doesn't have the same kind of casual movie star swagger that Howard has. I could picture Howard carrying a War Machine spin-off. I can't imagine Cheadle doing that. I also could see a friendly chemistry between Howard & Downey that I couldn't see between Cheadle & Downey.

Scarlett Johansson makes a credible, sexy action hero but she didn't seem to display much of a personality on screen. Come to think of it, I haven't been particularly impressed with her performances in any movies that I've seen her in. It would have been nice if she had gotten to play more scenes with Tony Stark, seeing the two of them try to adjust to each other's personalities while Pepper is off being the new CEO.

Weakest of all are the villains in the film. I wasn't as annoyed with Justin Hammer's antics as some people were. However, since he was such a light-weight, it demanded that Ivan Vanko be an awesomely terrifying big bad. Instead, he was more like a punk-ass sidekick. When he was first introduced with his dying father, I thought that his character was going to build into something interesting. Instead, his character never progressed beyond that point. Nor is he particularly compelling from an action standpoint. He only appears in 2 big fight scenes, and in both of those, he gets pretty thoroughly pwned by Iron Man. There's no sense of jeopardy in any of the fight scenes, as opposed to the terrifying mismatch of Iron Monger vs. Iron Man in an underpowered chest piece at the climax of the 1st film.
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Old May 11 2010, 01:37 AM   #231
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Yeah, Cheadle is a great actor but he was out of his element in this movie. He's not a campy comic-book movie actor. He doesn't have that... range. If that makes any sense.

RDJ has enough range in his ability to do campy, to do action, comedy, serious, etc. Cheadle is straight drama, nothing wrong with that at all, he just seemed out of place here If they couldn't get Howard to come back (or didn't want him to, not sure what happened there) they should've found another black actor who has better experience and presence in movies like this.

Again, Cheadle is a great actor nothing at all wrong with him. He just brought too much of a "straight man" seriousness to this role. Watch the first movie and the "fun" Howard had with the role and his "next time, baby" when he looked at what (presumably) was to be his exo-suit. A lot of fun in it.
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Old May 11 2010, 02:19 AM   #232
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Yeah, Cheadle is a great actor but he was out of his element in this movie. He's not a campy comic-book movie actor. He doesn't have that... range. If that makes any sense.

RDJ has enough range in his ability to do campy, to do action, comedy, serious, etc. Cheadle is straight drama, nothing wrong with that at all, he just seemed out of place here If they couldn't get Howard to come back (or didn't want him to, not sure what happened there) they should've found another black actor who has better experience and presence in movies like this.

Again, Cheadle is a great actor nothing at all wrong with him. He just brought too much of a "straight man" seriousness to this role. Watch the first movie and the "fun" Howard had with the role and his "next time, baby" when he looked at what (presumably) was to be his exo-suit. A lot of fun in it.
And oddly enough, Cheadle occasionally can do funny character stuff, like in the Ocean's 11 movies. But comic book movies often require a delicate balance of bringing lots of naturalistic personality to a role that's written to be a near total cypher. Some actors, including many of the greatest actors in history, just aren't able to pull off a role that asks for a "movie star," not an "actor." (Oppositely, there are "movie stars" that can be incredibly successful, yet cannot work in more nuanced "actor" roles. Bruce Willis is an obvious example.)

As for why Terrence Howard isn't in Iron Man 2, I thought it had something to do with money. IIRC, Howard was getting paid more money on the 1st movie than Robert Downey Jr. (Why? Because Howard had a better agent and Downey was still recovering from his decade in the wilderness. Downey didn't really become "bankable" again until Iron Man came out.) By replacing Howard with Cheadle, they saved millions.

EDIT: BTW, I did like how they handled the Howard/Cheadle changeover in Iron Man 2. "Yes, it's me. I'm here. Deal with it."
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Old May 11 2010, 04:32 AM   #233
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Captain Craig wrote: View Post
lyb42 wrote: View Post
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I'd love to hear what the 7 plots were.
Holy crap, a lot's been said since I logged on last! I'm swimming in a sea of Stark. The "Seven Plots" review was on MSN.com:
http://movies.msn.com/movies/movie-critic-reviews/iron-man-2/
What a joke.
It turns out that the artificial heart/generator that keeps Tony Stark alive and powers his Iron Man suit is killing him (plot No. 1), but Tony forges ahead with the Stark Expo, a high-tech fair that's part of his complex relationship with his late dad (plot No. 2). Russian scientist/criminal Ivan Vanko (Rourke, less directed than unleashed, and not always in a good way) is building his own high-tech suit and searching for a way to punish Stark for past crimes (plot No. 3) even as the U.S. government and arms dealer Justin Hammer ([COLOR=#07519a]Sam Rockwell[/COLOR], playing Sam Rockwell) want to get their hands on the high-tech Iron Man armor (plot No. 4). A suit is even stolen by Stark's old friend Col. Jim Rhodes (Cheadle; plot No. 5), but with the help of new friends in the world of global espionage who want to assemble a team of talents like Tony (plot No. 6), Stark may be able to win the day, keep his heart beating and win the heart of his friend and co-worker Pepper Potts (Paltrow; plot No. 7).
These are called character arcs, not plots.
He is calling every character and their action within the movie its own plot. By that reasoning a movie with more than one charater has more than one plot.
Forget ensemble pieces anymore cause this critic is going to see any and all movies as having too many plots.
I didn't mind all the "plots" at all. Certainly kept the action moving right along. I was never bored or confused. Sure, the S.H.I.E.L.D. stuff seemed a bit shoehorned in, but that's setup for future movies. (Hmm, did that reviewer actually miss the S.H.I.E.L.D. stuff? That qualifies as more of a plotline than most of that other crap.)
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Old May 11 2010, 05:24 AM   #234
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

CaptainCanada wrote: View Post
StarTrek1701 wrote: View Post
Glaring stupidity of the movie is also something that couldn't pass my notice. So you are telling me that Tony Stark, the most brilliant scientist/engineer/developer of our time that made his highly modern and functional weapons platform in his fucking basement didn't have any safeguards from his suits being taken away?
When Fury and Black Widow are talking with Stark, she explicitly says that the suits do have safeguards, and asks why Tony hasn't activated them; the implication being that he was okay with letting Rhodes take the suit.
That's the way I understood it too. Tony is dying, he gives his company to Pepper and the scene where he says the suits don't allow unauthorized access but Rhodes is able to help himself, I thought meant that Tony had bequeathed the suits to Rhodes. He just wasn't expecting Rhodes to take one so soon!

I did enjoy the movie. I really hope for IM3 that Favreau dials back on his own role, that was too much - he was getting in the way in this movie. And please can Tony and Pepper manage to finish a sentence each? That got tiresome really fast!

Oh, and does Favreau have a shoe fetish or something? Both Gwyneth Paltrow and Scarlett Johanssen were wearing ludicrously high heels that neither of them could walk in very well.

RDJ and Mickey Rourke were fantastic though - and made the movie worth watching just by themselves.
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Old May 11 2010, 05:32 AM   #235
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

I voted above average. The first one was a little better, but overall it's pretty dam good. I agree, i'd like to see more actual Iron Man, but this was Tony's story. I loved how Shield got involved and the setup for Avengers. Sam Rockwell was awsome. I give it a B/B+ with the fist one bieng A. Dark Knight bieng A+. One thing I was hoping to see was Tony bieng captured and realy getting the shit kicked out of him. I bet we will see something like this in the 3rd one. Oh yeah the suit case was awsome, I want to see that agian.
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Old May 11 2010, 11:40 AM   #236
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

I think this columnist in Moviehole has a good grasp of what went wrong with IM 2 (though I disagree with his praise for Rockwell's performance):

http://www.moviehole.net/201024740-t...for-iron-man-2
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Old May 11 2010, 07:39 PM   #237
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

Captaindemotion wrote: View Post
I think this columnist in Moviehole has a good grasp of what went wrong with IM 2 (though I disagree with his praise for Rockwell's performance):

http://www.moviehole.net/201024740-t...for-iron-man-2
I was disappointed by the movie, but I can't say I had a problem with the number of characters of storylines in it. I thought the story was pretty easy to follow, and flowed pretty well for what it was.

My problem was that the story being told just wasn't that compelling. I didn't really care about Tony's battle with the Senate committee, I didn't find Vanko to be a terribly interesting or threatening villain, and Hammer was too wimpy and annoying to be taken seriously at ALL.

The only thing that did interest me was Tony's deteriorating health, but that was never explored or used in any meaningful way. It was basically just one more technological puzzle for him to figure out.
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Old May 11 2010, 08:39 PM   #238
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

HunterB5446 wrote: View Post
Dark Knight bieng A+.
Yawn. It's the 3rd best Batman film.
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Old May 11 2010, 08:42 PM   #239
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Showed him rubbing his ring
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Old May 11 2010, 08:49 PM   #240
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Re: Iron Man 2 - Grading & Discussion Thread (spoilers guaranteed)

RDJ is the only thing that saves this from being an F.

F+.
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