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Old July 2 2011, 03:36 AM   #1681
JD
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

JonnyQuest037 wrote: View Post
JD wrote: View Post
Well, Thor never really had a secret identity, so nobody had to figure anything out.
...Ever hear of Don Blake? Sigurd Jarlson? Eric Masterson? Jake Olson? Thor's had more secret identities than most.
I meant in the movie.
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Old July 2 2011, 03:38 AM   #1682
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Secret identities are boring anyway.
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Old July 2 2011, 03:47 AM   #1683
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

JonnyQuest037 wrote: View Post
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There is also that the Marvel characters are "out of mask" a lot while in costume in addition to a secret identity that really isn't secret.
At this point I want to see a superhero film where the hero manages to keep his secret identity secret for the entire movie. Just for the novelty.

Seriously, what was the last superhero movie where nobody found out or figured out the hero's ID before the end? I don't see every single comic book movie out there, so I'm genuinely asking.
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Old July 2 2011, 03:51 AM   #1684
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Skywalker wrote: View Post
Secret identities are boring anyway.
I disagree with that. I think if you do them right, they can be pretty cool. And they are a convention that's pretty unique to the superhero genre. I just find it interesting that about the only story that movies know how to tell with secret IDs is them getting revealed.

Bringing it back to Cap, does anyone think that Steve Rogers' drill sargeant Sgt. Duffy might make an appearance in the movie? A scene or two with him could add some cute comic relief as Steve pretends to be an incompetent soldier.
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Old July 2 2011, 04:01 AM   #1685
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

I think it depends on how it is done. Sometimes it is arbitrary where the identity is revealed because they didn't know what else to do. The early Batman films are good examples of this.

Other times, it is revealed as part of the adaptation process. The Spider-Man movies are good examples of this (MJ knows in the comics as does Harry).

Then, there is the middle ground when the identity is revealed/figured out by another character (typically a villain) for the sake of tension in the climax, but then the villain is quickly killed before the information does the hero any major damage.
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Old July 2 2011, 04:22 AM   #1686
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

JonnyQuest037 wrote: View Post
Bringing it back to Cap, does anyone think that Steve Rogers' drill sargeant Sgt. Duffy might make an appearance in the movie? A scene or two with him could add some cute comic relief as Steve pretends to be an incompetent soldier.
From all appearances, Steve in the movie won't have a secret identity. Good idea, because that setup never made the slightest bit of sense anyway.
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Old July 2 2011, 04:39 AM   #1687
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

I liked the fact that Carol Ferris figured out GL's secret just by not being dumb as a stump.

I thought John Byrne had the best solution to not having people poking around trying to find out your secret - his Superman never let on that he spent time "undercover" in street clothes to begin with.
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Old July 2 2011, 05:31 AM   #1688
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

The 1990 Cap movie is being released on DVD July 19.
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Old July 2 2011, 06:11 AM   #1689
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Great! Now we can finally watch Cap either run away or get his ass handed to him in pristine DVD clarity!
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Old July 2 2011, 06:33 AM   #1690
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

JonnyQuest037 wrote: View Post
JD wrote: View Post
Well, Thor never really had a secret identity, so nobody had to figure anything out.
...Ever hear of Don Blake? Sigurd Jarlson? Eric Masterson? Jake Olson? Thor's had more secret identities than most.
I assume he was talking about in the movie.
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Old July 2 2011, 03:53 PM   #1691
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Oh, the humanity.

Next thing we'll see is just prior to the Fantastic Four reboot someone is going to release that Corman version.

"The film you thought that was burned and destroyed rises again"
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Old July 2 2011, 07:04 PM   #1692
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

AvBaur wrote: View Post
I really like the new trailer but I still think this film will have a very hard time on the international market. I've been following discussions about it on German sf/f forums and almost everybody's extremely sceptical if not downright hostile towards it. I don't personally know anyone who doesn't roll their eyes at the mention of a Captain America movie, except for some people who are big Marvel comics fans in the first place.

Then again, Germany is a country where any kind of patriotism has been frowned upon for decades. Maybe other countries won't have as much of a problem with it.
I still think people are overthinking such things. The international market just wants splosions and the content of the movie doesn't much matter. Just look at how well that Transformer twaddle does internationally. The foreign BO often makes up for a movie that's a domestic flop because it's deeply flawed in some way - Tron Legacy for instance. The same phenomenon will probably rescue the critically panned Cars 2. Sometimes I wonder if audiences are just seeing movies for the air conditioning. I guess it's pretty miserable in Nairobi this time of year.

I remain unconvinced that the subject matter of a movie counts at all when you look at international box office. What counts is not having a lot of confusing backstory and characters to catch up on. That's what keeps Star Trek at well over 50% domestic in the box office, whereas for most blockbusters, the domestic/foreign split is flipped. Event though Abrams did his best to keep Star Trek XI context-free, there's no way to divorce it utterly from its history the way movies like Avatar or the Transformer series can be.

Germany is just one market and maybe the fact that the Germans are the bad guys will inhibit box office in that country, but they won't give a flip about that stuff in Indonesia etc and that should more than make up for any shortfall in one nation.

Keep in mind that a lot of the international box office comes from people for whom WWII isn't really a part of their history, or even if it is, the audience - whose parents weren't even alive during WWII - isn't going to care. WWII is just some exotic fictional milieu, and why would it be more or less attractive than an alien world, virtual computer environment, giant kid's toys come to life, or mythological dieities tromping around on Earth? None of these mean anything to the audience outside of the theater and they are all equally valid backdrops for action and splosions.

Of course if the international box office does fall short for this movie, all it means is that they are stupidly depriving themselves of the best summer blockbuster of the year. Either way, I plan to enjoy the heck out of seeing Captain America. I haven't bothered with any of the other summer movies - this will be the first one I see this summer, and if Conan turns out to be a shambles, it will also be the last. Unlike the international audience, I am a tough sell. And San Francisco has natural air conditioning.
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Old July 2 2011, 07:20 PM   #1693
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

or maybe we just enjoy movies for what they are and don't fucking angst over it or expect high art all the time.
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Old July 2 2011, 08:29 PM   #1694
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
Germany is just one market and maybe the fact that the Germans are the bad guys will inhibit box office in that country, but they won't give a flip about that stuff in Indonesia etc and that should more than make up for any shortfall in one nation.
As I said, the fact that the Nazis are the bad guys is not the problem. On average, Germans probably hate Hitler more than most people. (Which might be the reason why Inglourious Basterds was a big hit here.)

It's the (American) patriotism that people tend to be appalled at. Showing pride in your country is something that became frowned upon in Germany after WW2. Other countries will not have that same problem, but they're still likely to react badly to phrases like "Heroes are made in America" and the fact that Cap runs around dressed as the star-spangled banner. American politics and wars are not a popular topic in most countries. People may be able to forgive shitty stories, but will they flock to see a film about a topic that they basically find offensive?

Of course, it's entirely possible that none of this will matter in the end. Maybe I'm overestimating the whole thing. I certainly would like the movie to be successful. (At least if it's as good as I hope.)
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Old July 2 2011, 08:50 PM   #1695
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Re: CAPTAIN AMERICA-shooting July 2010:Casting, Rumors, Pics till rele

Temis the Vorta wrote: View Post
I still think people are overthinking such things. The international market just wants splosions and the content of the movie doesn't much matter. Just look at how well that Transformer twaddle does internationally.
Bay certainly sets the standard for mindless flag-waving and fetishization of the US military, but that's not something right there in the title.

I don't think a Cap movie is unsaleable by any means, but it's a more difficult sell than the concept might otherwise be; calling it The First Avenger in many countries is an acknowledgement of that, and I expect the adds for those locales will downplay those aspects of the character (who has otherwise a very universal story and appeal). In general, heavily patriotic displays have highly limited appeal outside of the particular country they originate from; in this case, really muscular American patriotism is heavily associated with a worldview and set of policies that is highly unpopular in the rest of the world. To the extent that that matters, it probably does help a lot that Bush is no longer president.
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