"Firefly" - when does it get good?

[broberfett]

My girlfriend is friends with all these Firefly fanatics that call themselves Browncoats. I tried watching the show, starting with "The Train Job", which is the first one they showed. I watched other episodes, but never really got into the show. Serenity didn't really get me fired up over the whole thing. I just don't like the show. I'd ask the Browncoats when it starts to get good, but I would probably get stoned to death(not in the good way).

[Deckerd]

Some people like it and some people don't. Is it really worth a whole thread about how boring some people find it?

[Tulin]

Actually it's been worth several over the years.

[Bob The Skutter]

Deckerd wrote:

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Some people like it and some people don't. Is it really worth a whole thread about how boring some people find it?

Talk sense woman, this is the internet anything and everything is worth a whole thread about how people don't like it. In fact, multiple threads.

[RoJoHen]

Tulin wrote:

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Actually it's been worth several over the years.

Indeed.

At least now most of the fans have calmed down and don't automatically condemn the people who dislike it.

[DWMarch]

The good episodes start at #6 with "Our Mrs Reynolds" and continues right through to 11/12 ("Trash"/"The Message"- some like "The Message" and some don't). "Heart of Gold" is hit-and-miss with some great moments but some stock cliches too. "Objects in Space" is absolutely excellent.

Some non-spoilery spoilers to keep you interested:

Our Mrs. Reyonds- "You're good." "You're amazing... who are you?"

Jaynestown- the bartender slapping the bottle out of Jayne's gaping maw. Simon finding an appropriate time to swear. Book's hair.

Out of Gas- Kaylee getting hired by Mal.

Ariel- the whole episode, particularly Simon getting a chance to do what he does best. Beware though- this episode has one very gory scene in it.

War Stories- Wash and Mal's conversation about Mal's feelings towards Zoe. "Screw you!" "Get in line!"

Trash- "Is there anybody there...? Anybody else?"

The Message- The way the actual message is used throughout the episode and how it ties in to the end.

Objects in Space- "I'm not on the ship. I'm in the ship. I am the ship."

[RoJoHen]

I'd say "Our Mrs. Reynolds" is definitely where the show gets most comfortable with itself. It also helps that the episode is hilarious.

[cultcross]

Gaith wrote:

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So I saw Serenity a few years back in my college theater, and found it decent, though I had a hard time relating to the characters.

Now I'm finally giving Firefly a try. After a rough first half-hour (I was starting to contemplate giving up), the pilot suddenly got good, what with the appearance of River and the shoot-out. I was stoked.

I think you may have an issue with the show that is more fundamental than waiting for it to get good, if I may be blunt. If you don't like the characters, you probably won't like the show - it's premise is the characters, essentially. And unlike the movie, that's all the characters, not just Mal and River. River is a 'slow brewing' mystery, a background interest to keep an arc going, she's not the focus of the series, despite being the focus of the movie. Her development is therefore slow, although Ariel and War Stories march things on a bit.
Basically, the River and Simon arc was set in motion as if Joss had all the time in the world, but concluded in a mad rush because he only had one movie.

The pilot episode is rather different to the rest of the show - if you'd just watched that, I'd say keep going, it changes - but if you watch past Our Mrs Reynolds and don't like it, it probably isn't for you.

Oh, wait - River can speak a mean Irish accent. Er, right.

That's a Cockney accent.

There's also been basically zero movement on the River plot. Lots of people thought HBO's Carnivàle moved too slowly, and there are certain stylistic parallels between it and Firefly, but even Carnivàle's slowest and worst episodes gave us some movement, either from the Brother Justin storyline, the Carnivàle/Ben storyline, or both. I don't think you can skip a single one and not notice something missing.

So, my question is... when, if ever, do Firefly's episodes start mattering to their immediate successors? Because this whole train robbery/Alliance capture/duel stuff just feels like filler.

Well if you're expecting a heavily arc driven serial, you'll be disappointed. It's an ensemble, episodic show. A dysfunctional TNG if you like. There are story arcs - River, Book, Jayne's past, Mal and Zoe's war history, the Alliance themselves, etc, but primarily, the show is episodic. It is most similar, I would say, to early Buffy in Joss' history - episodes that tie together but are still standalone, plot-wise. Compared to say, late season 7 Buffy where the episode breaks were more just places to put credits than actual story breaks.

[RoJoHen]

^I pretty much agree with all of that.

[Lindley]

RoJoHen wrote:

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Whether it would have eventually had a more focused story arc is impossible to say at this point.

It's a Joss Whedon show. I think we can infer from his previous efforts what the pattern would have been. Season 1 would have been establishing premise and characters; then a clear-cut arc (probably the Miranda stuff) would have taken shape in season 2, and thereafter each season would have its own arc with a slightly different focus.

Oh, and season 7 would have just ended last spring.....

[RoJoHen]

Lindley wrote:

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It's a Joss Whedon show. I think we can infer from his previous efforts what the pattern would have been. Season 1 would have been establishing premise and characters; then a clear-cut arc (probably the Miranda stuff) would have taken shape in season 2, and thereafter each season would have its own arc with a slightly different focus.

Oh, and season 7 would have just ended last spring.....

But would there be a spin-off? And who would it be about?

[Lindley]

None of the characters we saw really seemed suitable for spin-off status. Maybe Saffron, but that's iffy.

It'd be just like Joss to make the spin-off be about the Alliance. Maybe even about the Operative. Two shows, same universe----different sides!

[RoJoHen]

Saffron and Bester! Ooh, that could be fun.

[Ayelbourne]

Lindley wrote:

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Oh, and season 7 would have just ended last spring.....

Man...how I'd love to be in that parallel reality where that actually happened...

[cultcross]

It's weird to think it's that old.