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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old March 19 2015, 10:06 PM   #1
Grant
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Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Fix an episode----Requiem for Methuselah

Actually I kind of like the episode despite the absurdity that Flint is supposed to be all those historical figures.

The thing that bothers me the most is that after finding the properly refined rytalin McCoy stands around with Kirk and Spock and inspects the room until they find the android prototypes, then he yaks with Flint until Flint decides he won’t let them leave.

For cripes sake--3 crew member are dead MOST of the crew has the fatal disease and some are (by that point) minutes from death.

I know McCoy is important to Kirk’s psyche and his best human buddy, but it is just unconscionable that he doesn’t beam up the second he finds the medicine.

Beating a dead horse alert------the crew actually means nothing in season 3--so they figured the audience wouldn’t give it a thought.

That is all.

Flint has a flat panel TV--say whaaaaat???? He IS smart.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:17 PM   #2
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Maybe keeping McCoy on board to help the seriously ill crew would be a start. So many third year episodes just automatically beam down KirkSpockandMcCoy week in a week out that I decided why even bother with spacing? It was almost a miracle anyone else was consodered worthy to beam down.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:21 PM   #3
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Foxhot wrote: View Post
Maybe keeping McCoy on board to help the seriously ill crew would be a start. So many third year episodes just automatically beam down KirkSpockandMcCoy week in a week out that I decided why even bother with spacing? It was almost a miracle anyone else was consodered worthy to beam down.
You are right, McCoy should have been aboard.

But we have to be realistic--late season 3--it was 90% that the landing party was going to be K/S/M

And the episode had so much interaction between the 3 of them that was actually really good.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:24 PM   #4
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Plus, when Kirk is having a high old time dancing with the admittedly utility-belt-stirring Rayna Kapec, he seems to have forgotten the immediate crisis on the Enterprise.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:35 PM   #5
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

For me the only glaring error in this episode is Kirk falling for Rayna so hard and so fast.

Spock makes some reference to Flint engineering (manipulating) things to his purpose. He could have gone one line further with Kirk being manipulated in some way to engage Kirk's emotions so strongly and uncharacteristically.

Pheromones weren't in the popular lexicon back then, but that would be one way to rationalize Rayna's unusual effect on Kirk.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:43 PM   #6
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Warped9 wrote: View Post
For me the only glaring error in this episode is Kirk falling for Rayna so hard and so fast.

Spock makes some reference to Flint engineering (manipulating) things to his purpose. He could have gone one line further with Kirk being manipulated in some way to engage Kirk's emotions so strongly and uncharacteristically.

Pheromones weren't in the popular lexicon back then, but that would be one way to rationalize Rayna's unusual effect on Kirk.
Yes Kirk fell for Reyna "TV fast"---but there's no story without him falling for her, I suppose.

The script, actually had a ton of stuff cut--I read it a long time ago and there was a lot more Kirk/Reyna interaction.

As to the other point--Spock and McCoy are scientists and should have been worrying a lot more about the cure than the Brahms waltz and the "un-recorded Da Vinci's.

I think if McCoy had found the ritalyn and beamed up and gotten to work (offscreen) earlier we could have forgiven K/S for wasting so much time on Flint and Reyna--

but as it stands all 3 seem like they were pretty unconcerned--especially after the vivid description we get in the teaser of the disease!
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Old March 19 2015, 10:57 PM   #7
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

This episode caters to the Theatre of the Bizzarre to great effect! Therefore, I would not want to change too much about it. The worst offender in this episode, for me, is Spock's reminders to Kirk to quit screwing around, as lives are in danger. Kirk is sober-minded, insofar as we're allowed to know, so this reflects very poorly on The Good Captain, which serves to no one's end. I would just remove all references to that, as they are resigned to sticking around, anyway, while the Rytalin, or whatever it's called is whipped up. So who gives a toss what they're doing, whilst they wait?

A lesser offense in this episode, but one that really chafes my arse, is that Kirk & Leonardo da Vinci start the episode with a "show of strength." That should've been handled over the radio, probably, when the ship was in orbit. And finally, I wouldn't cap it with the "FORGET" mind-meld. Surely, this would've been Kirk's "secret" pain, had Sybok gotten around to curing him of it, decades later.

Among the things I really like a lot in this show are when Kirk beats the living shit out of all of these historical figures rolled up in one, to win the love of Flint's "handiwork." And when Spock tries to intervene, Kirk barks at him, "... stay out of this, Spock! We're fighting over a woman!" And Spock's all like, "No you are not. For SHE is not." Even Shakespeare would've signed off on that shit - it's good stuff! Otherwise, yeah ... this episode's such a novelty, I'd just leave it as-is, pretty much.
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Old March 19 2015, 10:57 PM   #8
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

It has some nice moments, I particularly like Spock in this one. He's very "emotionally" perceptive and and tries to shield/help Kirk as best he can. The bad: compare Kirk in this one to 1st season Kirk, while his crew is sick/dying, he is "thinking with his glands". Ugh. So if we could get around that somehow the episode would be much improved in my mind. Flint as past characters doesn't bug me. His first part with the zoom in and "...the rats..." bit was overdone though. A simple reaction shot to McCoy's " The effects are like bubonic plague" would have been more subtle. I like the creepiness in the discovery of the various versions of Rayna in the lab.

Emotions "killing" Rayna, hmm. How about she gets a "reboot" and becomes essentially an (emotionless) child. The literal "death by love" thing seems a bit trite, having her get reset is more realistic for an android and in a way even worse than dying.

A solution for our heroes delay in getting the ryetalyn and seeming unconcern, have a small part of the first batch be OK to beam back, enough to start treatment and delay death by a couple of days. McCoy's concern about the purity of the next batch requires him to stay and monitor things.
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Old March 19 2015, 11:01 PM   #9
Grant
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

HarryM wrote: View Post
It has some nice moments, I particularly like Spock in this one. He's very "emotionally" perceptive and and tries to shield/help Kirk as best he can. The bad: compare Kirk in this one to 1st season Kirk, while his crew is sick/dying, he is "thinking with his glands". Ugh. So if we could get around that somehow the episode would be much improved in my mind. Flint as past characters doesn't bug me. His first part with the zoom in and "...the rats..." bit was overdone though. A simple reaction shot to McCoy's " The effects are like bubonic plague" would have been more subtle. I like the creepiness in the discovery of the various versions of Rayna in the lab.

Emotions "killing" Rayna, hmm. How about she gets a "reboot" and becomes essentially an (emotionless) child. The literal "death by love" thing seems a bit trite, having her get reset is more realistic for an android and in a way even worse than dying.

A solution for our heroes delay in getting the ryetalyn and seeming unconcern, have a small part of the first batch be OK to beam back, enough to start treatment and delay death by a couple of days. McCoy's concern about the purity of the next batch requires him to stay and monitor things.

^I love that part.



But did someone say remove the Spock meld??

Oh no, that was awesome.

Last edited by Grant; March 19 2015 at 11:14 PM.
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Old March 19 2015, 11:05 PM   #10
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Grant wrote: View Post
Warped9 wrote: View Post
For me the only glaring error in this episode is Kirk falling for Rayna so hard and so fast.

Spock makes some reference to Flint engineering (manipulating) things to his purpose. He could have gone one line further with Kirk being manipulated in some way to engage Kirk's emotions so strongly and uncharacteristically.

Pheromones weren't in the popular lexicon back then, but that would be one way to rationalize Rayna's unusual effect on Kirk.
Yes Kirk fell for Reyna "TV fast"---but there's no story without him falling for her, I suppose.

The script, actually had a ton of stuff cut--I read it a long time ago and there was a lot more Kirk/Reyna interaction.

As to the other point--Spock and McCoy are scientists and should have been worrying a lot more about the cure than the Brahms waltz and the "un-recorded Da Vinci's.

I think if McCoy had found the ritalyn and beamed up and gotten to work (offscreen) earlier we could have forgiven K/S for wasting so much time on Flint and Reyna--

but as it stands all 3 seem like they were pretty unconcerned--especially after the vivid description we get in the teaser of the disease!
It isn't a stretch to think that all three--Kirk, Spock and McCoy--are being influenced by Flint. Hence their apparent lack of genuine urgency in getting the rytallin to the ship.
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Old March 19 2015, 11:12 PM   #11
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Once again an excuse for bad writing.

Much later pretend the writer was much more gifted and insightful and all we have to do is think about and it all comes to us.

When it comes to the ritalyn portion of the story and concern for the crew---

this episode blows it big time.

I like the episode, but it is a major flaw.

I think (not 100% sure) that even after McCoy finds the medicine and after Kirk and Flint are brawling---the rutalyn is sitting on the table in the room--not even being protected by McCoy from being knocked over in the fight.

Isn't it precious stuff that is needed to save 400+ lives?

"Shoot I wonder if Jim can beat this jerk--I'll just set the medicine down here as they throw each other around the room."

awful.
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Old March 20 2015, 12:19 AM   #12
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

It's a truth that even the best writers or directors can overlook something.
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Old March 20 2015, 01:02 AM   #13
Robert D. Robot
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

Warped9 wrote: View Post
For me the only glaring error in this episode is Kirk falling for Rayna so hard and so fast.

Spock makes some reference to Flint engineering (manipulating) things to his purpose. He could have gone one line further with Kirk being manipulated in some way to engage Kirk's emotions so strongly and uncharacteristically.

Pheromones weren't in the popular lexicon back then, but that would be one way to rationalize Rayna's unusual effect on Kirk.
I agree! Maybe Flint incorporated Elasian tear ducts into Rayna's design. Or whatever glands/ducts/organs that allow the Orion women to 'do their thing'. I know we are finding explanations after the fact for something not clarified in the episode, but that is the thing we do, right?
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Old March 20 2015, 03:45 AM   #14
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
This episode caters to the Theatre of the Bizzarre to great effect! Therefore, I would not want to change too much about it. The worst offender in this episode, for me, is Spock's reminders to Kirk to quit screwing around, as lives are in danger. Kirk is sober-minded, insofar as we're allowed to know, so this reflects very poorly on The Good Captain, which serves to no one's end. I would just remove all references to that, as they are resigned to sticking around, anyway, while the Rytalin, or whatever it's called is whipped up. So who gives a toss what they're doing, whilst they wait?
Because they have a sick crew, so getting distracted by a stranger (with tension right out of the gates) and his mysteries would waste precious time, or cause the landing party to not be as mindful of their mission. Spock was correct in trying to curb Kirk's interests.

And finally, I wouldn't cap it with the "FORGET" mind-meld. Surely, this would've been Kirk's "secret" pain, had Sybok gotten around to curing him of it, decades later.
...except there was no intention to revisit Kirk's personal issues at the time RFM was produced; the episode needed a sensitive conclusion for Kirk (which was a larger comment on his failed / lost relationships, culminating in the Rayna incident).

Among the things I really like a lot in this show are when Kirk beats the living shit out of all of these historical figures rolled up in one, to win the love of Flint's "handiwork." And when Spock tries to intervene, Kirk barks at him, "... stay out of this, Spock! We're fighting over a woman!" And Spock's all like, "No you are not. For SHE is not." Even Shakespeare would've signed off on that shit - it's good stuff! Otherwise, yeah ... this episode's such a novelty, I'd just leave it as-is, pretty much.
Yes, if you consider Kirk's breathy exchange with Spock, it can border on a delivery more appropriate for stage than TV.


Grant wrote: View Post
I think (not 100% sure) that even after McCoy finds the medicine and after Kirk and Flint are brawling---the rutalyn is sitting on the table in the room--not even being protected by McCoy from being knocked over in the fight.

Isn't it precious stuff that is needed to save 400+ lives?

"Shoot I wonder if Jim can beat this jerk--I'll just set the medicine down here as they throw each other around the room."

awful.
That's hardly a deal breaker for the episode. The focus was on the Kirk - Flint conflict, not something next to no audience member paid any attention. Even a moment of danger for the drug muddles the impact of the fight--why they're fighting just for a minor tease.
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Old March 20 2015, 03:49 AM   #15
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Re: Fix an episode---Requiem for Methuselah

HarryM wrote: View Post
Emotions "killing" Rayna, hmm. How about she gets a "reboot" and becomes essentially an (emotionless) child. The literal "death by love" thing seems a bit trite, having her get reset is more realistic for an android and in a way even worse than dying.
Maybe when Rayna got upset, Flint switched her off with the remote contol he'd been using. Spock was aware of Flint's deception, but went along with it as the best way to handle things and get Kirk to let Rayna go.

And the "miniaturization" of the Enterprise wasn't literally what happened. What we saw on the tabletop was a holographic image, and the actual ship was suspended somewhere but not reduced in size.

It's a fun episode for me. There's a fembot I'm very fond of, the 33-inch Enterprise model, and lots of good music.
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