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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 26 2009, 04:19 PM   #1
Norrin Radd
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Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Wouldn't it be pretty damn hard for any captain to have Jim Kirk under his or her command?

I mean, the guy has saved Earth and avenged Vulcan, so he'd basically be a living legend around the Federation. He would have likely accomplished bigger things than any living captain currently in command of a starship.

It would be difficult, I think, for him to be subordinate to anyone. Not because he wouldn't be willing to follow orders, but because his very presence could overshadow the authority of any captain on any vessel he served on.

Maybe they really had no choice but to therefore give him the big job because I think the only alternative would have been to drum him out of Starfleet. And that wouldn't do either.
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Old May 26 2009, 04:27 PM   #2
Opal1
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Maybe no captain wanted him as First Officer? Too much trouble...
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Old May 26 2009, 04:27 PM   #3
Jeri
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Yeah, I said in the original thread that nobody would want Kirk for an underling.

He'd be blasted out the airlock onto a frozen planet on every assignment.
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Old May 26 2009, 04:32 PM   #4
Hambone
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Even as an admiral (movies I-IV), he was more trouble than he was worth, causing constant headaches for Starfeet and the Federation. They had to bust him back down to Captain in order to keep him in line.
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Old May 26 2009, 04:51 PM   #5
darkshadow0001
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

You know what is funny about this is that in the previous films, Kirk was demoted from Admiral to Captain for his heroic efforts

So to see him promoted so quickly was actually a nice change of pace.
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Old May 26 2009, 05:22 PM   #6
Jeri
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Captain is his level of functionality.
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Old May 26 2009, 05:28 PM   #7
Islander
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Norrin Radd wrote: View Post
Wouldn't it be pretty damn hard for any captain to have Jim Kirk under his or her command?

I mean, the guy has saved Earth and avenged Vulcan, so he'd basically be a living legend around the Federation. He would have likely accomplished bigger things than any living captain currently in command of a starship.

It would be difficult, I think, for him to be subordinate to anyone. Not because he wouldn't be willing to follow orders, but because his very presence could overshadow the authority of any captain on any vessel he served on.

Maybe they really had no choice but to therefore give him the big job because I think the only alternative would have been to drum him out of Starfleet. And that wouldn't do either.
On that theory alone, he should have become Fleet Admiral or even President of the Federation.
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Old May 26 2009, 05:36 PM   #8
Norrin Radd
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Islander wrote: View Post
On that theory alone, he should have become Fleet Admiral or even President of the Federation.
Nonsense. He's displayed skills as an acting Captain, but never as an acting Admiral or President. That's the difference.
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Old May 26 2009, 07:26 PM   #9
FanFanatic
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

He was probably promoted because there were not that many candidates
to choose from. The ships that arrived at Vulcan prior to the Enterprise, were all destroyed, the cadets and officers on board. The remainder of the fleet was elsewhere. I am surprised at how many cadets still filled
the room when Kirk was made captain. (They could have been new recruits.) Even with all the events unfolding on the Enterprise, Chekov,(only 17!), was left in charge of the bridge on two occasions, and he left it to someone else when he ran to the transporter room. It is almost like playing "hot potato". As Spock said in TOS, he never wanted command, anyway. In this instance, I do not believe that Quinto/Spock has developed like the Nimoy/Spock as far as his sense of duty. In 'Jouney to Babel', Spock refused to leave the bridge to save his father's life because of his sense of duty. In this case, Spock left the bridge, during a 'red alert', for personal reasons, to save his mother and father. We don't really know, but Spock could have been offered the captaincy, but declined. It was not mentioned. Kirk showed he had what was needed in an emergency, and never gave up. Pike probably was instrumental in him actually getting the Enterprise itself.
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Old May 26 2009, 07:59 PM   #10
Omega_Glory
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

He's a whiny, immature, brat in this film. Starfleet must be a desperate organization to give such a crybaby the captaincy of the Fleet flagship.

Now, I'm quite a fan of Kirk...but NuKirk has a long, long ways to go. He's Lieutenant j.g. material right now....gushers be dammed.
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Old May 26 2009, 09:27 PM   #11
Peter the Younger
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Eh, I still think it was a stretch from a narrative standpoint, but I understand it as a business decision. All franchises are ultimately constrained by what the "casual fan" will understand/accept, and Paramount obviously decided that it's gotta be Captain Kirk by the end of the movie. Having said that, I wish the writers would have covered themselves with a bit of a fig leaf. Even if they hung a lantern on it, it would have made me feel better, like: "By special order of the Federation Council, you are hereby commissioned at the rank of Captain, and are ordered to report to Admiral Pike, as his relief." Basically just say, yeah, we know this is nuts, but this is a special case.

(And yeah, I know we can assume that is what happened, but this is a case where they could have bolstered the fan service a little without slowing down the film.)
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Old May 26 2009, 09:30 PM   #12
Phily B
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

President Kirk

I like it.
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Old May 26 2009, 09:48 PM   #13
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Opal1 wrote: View Post
Maybe no captain wanted him as First Officer? Too much trouble...

They'd run out of escape pods eventually...
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Old May 26 2009, 10:32 PM   #14
MarkKalz
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

I get to be feeling that Kirk, no matter what universe this is, be it mirror or prime or the dozens seen in TNG's 'Parallels', Kirk can only ever be Captain. The original movie series as much as proved that by focusing a great deal of drama over just how inappropriate it is for Kirk to be behind a desk.

Nero did everything to disrupt the Kirk life, but in the end, Kirk must be captain.
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Old May 26 2009, 10:54 PM   #15
Quo Vadimus
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Re: Consider this about Kirk's promotion...

Peter the Younger wrote: View Post
Even if they hung a lantern on it, it would have made me feel better, like: "By special order of the Federation Council, you are hereby commissioned at the rank of Captain, and are ordered to report to Admiral Pike, as his relief." Basically just say, yeah, we know this is nuts, but this is a special case.
Teddy Roosevelt did something similar in 1905, advancing John J. Pershing four ranks from Captain to Brigadier General. And boy did it piss off those 835 officers he skipped! Not quite the same, I know, but there is a precedent for advancement under unusual conditions.
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