Just an update. I'm spending what free time I have mostly catching up on episodes that had the engineering section in it. That way I can see how wide the engine room would be in the engineering hull as well as whether the "big vertical pipe" would be visible in S2/S3 from the manual monitoring room on the other side. So far my current thoughts are for two engine rooms with identical starboard sides as seen in the show. The primary hull one doesn't have the big vertical pipe while the one in the engineering hull does. The vertical pipe connects machinery below the deck to the engineering room in the deck above with the Energizer as seen in "The Alternative Factor". From there, the primary energy circuit then runs up through the neck to the primary hull engine room. For S2 engine room in the engineering hull, the Energizer is moved down and incorporated into the structure in the center of the room and the energizer room above is removed to make room for the taller engine room ceiling. Well, that's where I'm heading anyway. Everyone have a great Memorial weekend!
That's some interesting thinking regarding the engineering column and the oft-troublesome "Energizing Engineering", nice one! A thought - did the column not also contain crucial transporter circuitry? From Enemy Within (Scott looking at the phaser damage): To me, it always made sense that Engineering should be so closely tied to the Transporter systems - the Transporter is a pretty hefty piece of kit after all, with what must be massive energy requirements. Did you plan to incorporate any of that into your column as well? Or is it strictly an "energizer" column? Nice cutaway view BTW!
Thanks Mytran You are correct, the column would also contain the transporter circuitry as well since the engines seem to be also tied to the transporter's "velocity balancing". I think normally it is run through the main circuit but in that episode they were able to later bypass and tie it to the impulse engines so I would imagine that all the circuits are interconnected in someway. One thing I'm curious about now is upon viewing TMP/TWOK's engine room and the vertical/horizontal energy conduits is trying to figure out where "other circuits" connect to it? We see at the bottom of the vertical conduit what looks like the reactor. We don't really see what is at the top but assume it is thing for the impulse engine. The horizontal piece runs to the back to the warp nacelles. But we don't really see any pipes/wires/etc lead off it to connect to other stuff in the engineering section. So I'm a bit perplexed as to how that works unless the wires are inside the column supports for the horizontal conduit. Or leads come off the reactor at the bottom and we can't see that machinery. Hmmmm...
I've often wondered that myself - particularly with the way that Spock's "death room" is supposed to be tied into the main engines (somehow). The tube that Spock works with is pointing down - perhaps the decks below the main engine room are filled with offshoots from a massive reactor system that runs the length of the secondary hull? While we're on that general subject, how exactly does the ship go to warp with that giant isolation door in the way? There didn't seem to be a hatch or anything present when it came down.
You Thermions certainly have set yourself a monumental task. good luck. But seriously, great work so far, can't wait to see more!
@TIN_MAN - LOL @Mytran - my questions exactly I figured Spock's "death room" was part of the "mains", perhaps the "main energizer" where it has been bypassed due to radiation. It could be the equivalent of the energizer that houses the dilithium crystal in the S2 engine room. I mocked one up just for kicks Of course, the reason we've never seen it blast radiation out in TOS is because the Enterprise had never been so critically hit like that in TWOK. In TMP, it could be the energizer was on a different deck (like in TOS S1) and moved to where we see in TWOK and like you guess that there is alot of unseen machinery below decks, IMHO. I wonder about that big isolation door as well as it was down when Scotty took the mains off-line but we didn't see whether it was back up when Spock got the mains back on again. Could it be just a pressure door for people? and it is transparent to the energy conduit? Hmmm
Or we can take some creative license that the death room was more at the bottom of the shaft, tying into the base of the reactor. The dramatic intent is the same - it's down the long energizer shaft, in the bowels of the ship, in engineering. It doesn't NEED to be at the horizontal and vertical intersection (though that's what's on screen).
Just started on the S2 Engine Room. Using the Emergency Manual Monitor as a guide for the width of the engine room in the engineering hull. Still need to fine-tune some of the camera matching In this version, the big vertical pipe goes away. Definitely going to be an asymmetrical layout
Maybe the height of the EMM is throwing the view off. I always saw it as being about 5' off the ground, how high is yours? The support struts seem to be more or less dead on though. Just curious; how high (to the top of the arch) did you make the S1 and S2 engine rooms? Overall though, that is truly fantastic work. It's always a pleasure to see the next stage of your project.
@Mytran - Thx The EMM worked out to be the same height off the ground as the "2nd level" of the engine room that is above the wall monitoring panels. I'll see if I can put together some comparison pics and measurements between the two engine rooms.
@Mytran - just some quick numbers: S1 Eng Room height 5.12m (floor to top of ceiling) S2 Eng Room height 6.015m (floor to top of ceiling) EMM floor height 1.95m (floor of EMM to floor of engine room)
Thanks very much for these. Have you ever considered working in feet? Given that it's what they built the set with, it might make your marathon job a little easier!
So just finished watching "By Any Other Name" and got some more views of the EMM. There is a scene where we see Spock and Scotty climb down from the EMM and exit into a corridor which I'm going to guess is the one that runs perpendicular to the Engine Room entrance. However, the ladder I see in the EMM is on the right side which to me would eliminate it going to the corridor and instead go to perhaps the engine room itself. So, I added another ladder and a doorway to the corridor Hopefully when I get down to the lower level there will be enough room for the deflector control station as seen in "The Enterprise Incident" and "Elaan of Troyius"
Ah that "ladder access" corridor scene, quite a problem indeed! While the implicatation is that they've just climbed down it from the EMM, as you've found that obviously couldn't be the case! Regarding the EMM ladder providing access to the Engine Room however, the episodes tend not to support this - in I, Mudd Norman goes down the ladder and round through the main doors. In Is There In Truth Scotty follows the same route. In both cases the characters would have taken a more direct route, if they could (which suggests they couldn't). Perhaps that side of the Engine Room is blocked with equipment? An alternative solution is to have the EMM ladder keep on descending to the deck below the Engine Room - that way, it really can connect to the corridor!
@Mytran - thanks for the references to "I, Mudd" and "Is There In...". I think you're right in that the ladder on the right doesn't seem to have a direct route into the engine room. For now I'll just assume that the right ladder goes down and you could either go left to the exit by the left ladder or right and further into other parts of engineering I might also extend the right ladder further down as suggested, but perhaps into a room where there is more machinery (that would be under the dilithium energizer piece).
Trying to configure everything seen onscreen in that area sure is a problem. In "Elaan..", it was like this: http://tos.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/3x13/Elaan_of_Troyius_148.JPG Yet in "That Which...", the engineer walks into that same area and it is this: http://tos.trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=92&page=7 (much easier to see in the actual episode) Also, regarding that ladder from EMM, in "Mirror Mirror", McCoy walks to a yellow door that opens to reveal the ladder in an alcove, and Scotty ascends it to EMM. http://tos.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/2x04/TOS_2x10_MirrorMirror0221-Trekpulse.jpg The way in which he walks to the door would mean that that corridor would exist exactly where the 2 big machines are in Engineering. So you have to cheat a bit to make that fit. I ended up with this type of setup while working on the 1701 blueprints. Certainly not definitive, but may help you figure out how it'll all fit in your 3D creations. Looking forward to seeing how it all works out. Have you decided where in the ship you figure that S2 Engineering will reside?
@Wildstar - thanks for the suggestions and references. That would be a bummer that there is a scene in "Mirror, Mirror" that has them climbing up to the EMM But, it isn't a total loss as Mytran's suggestion could work where that corridor to the EMM ladder entrance could be the deck below As far as reconciling the layout, I'm taking the approach that the engine room is getting altered from short refits and/or Scotty's constant tinkering with his engine room. It's kinda like the constant bridge and engine room changing between the first 6 movies Eventually I'll post up a progression of changes that room went underwent over the 3 seasons. I think once I'm done with the engine room, I'll fix up my shuttlebay complex and then see where to put the engine room. Lotsa small steps
Minor update about the EMM as seen in "Mirror, Mirror". So far, "Mirror, Mirror" is the only episode that I know of that shows someone climbing up to the EMM. Obviously, that ladder position would put the outside hallway (and also seen in "By Any Other Name") in an awkward position as it would run through the engine room. From a story POV, "I, Mudd" would suggest (since we only saw him climb down the ladder) that the hallway should be on the same level as the engine room entrance based on Norman's route. I'm going to take advantage of a quirk in "Mirror, Mirror" though to make it all fit. The way the scene is presented, McCoy knocks out the guard and both Scotty and McCoy drag him into the ladder room to the side. Next there is a noticeable camera cut which presumably goes back to the same ladder but from a slightly different angle. Edit: But if you watch what Scotty and McCoy do prior to the camera cut, they go much further inside (to the right of the door) presumably to hide the body. I'm going to "creatively" say that there are two ladders (as in my previous render) and that guard's body was dragged back to the ladder that is furthest away from the hallway and the camera cut showed them at the 2nd ladder
That's excellent thinking blssdwlf and I may have to borrow it! While we're on the subject of Mirror Mirror, it is this episode that led me to think the EMM was lower to the ground, perhaps only 5 feet off it! When Scott first steps off the ladder, McCoy is just seen stepping forward onto it - as in, he was on the floor of the soundstage and just walked forward before ascending. At this point (before he starts climbing) his neck is nearly level with the floor of the EMM. It's hard to see because Scott is in the way, but how does it look to you? Ah, you mean the Antimatter bypass room? The way Scott is acting makes me think that this is brand new room and he is eager to get some use out of it. It must have been fitted following the events of Day of the Dove since that was the last time we saw Engineering in it's previous configuration (production order). Actually I'm glad that something finally got done with that space. For far too long that alcove had sat there, with a completely pointless door! But I digress. It's a good diagram, but weren't the big power units in S2/3 roated 90 degrees? I do like all that extra engineering space at the bottom left though! Might that be the dilithium room from Alternative Factor?