A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

A Foreshadowing, a 15-minute tease for season 4 with new footage (lots of stuff that's not in the trailer), cast interviews and Q&A (looks like they got the questions from Twitter). They are doing a pretty good job of not spoiling the big moments for the Unsullied, though they kind of skirt around some of them. Some of the actors give away a couple of minor spoilers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5iS3tULXMQ

It looks fantastic. And, to my Sullied eyes, very faithful to the books, with some expected and logical changes, such as

Spoiler: A Storm of Swords/A Feast for Crows

Bronn taking Ilyn Payne's role as Jaime's sparring partner (this had already been speculated, because of Wilko Johnson's terminal cancer and the need to give Bronn something to do) and Jamie having more scenes with Tyrion than in the book.

Hopefully the season will be that good as it looks based on this...

The Entertainment Weekly article that reported this said that there are 29 regular cast members going into season 4. There are 24 from last year (without Richard Madden, Oona Chaplin and Michelle Fairley

Spoiler: A Storm of Swords

who is unlikely to appear until late in the season, and is more likely to be a Special Guest Star, so I don't think they counted her)

and Joe Dempsie has not been confirmed for season 4, so we don't know if he's in this season. So, let's guess who has been made a regular for season 4?

I think Gwendoline Christie (Brienne) definitely is, and probably Iwan Rheon (Ramsey) and Gemma Whelan (Yara Greyjoy). The others are probably one of the following: Ian McInnerny (Barristan Selmy) - if he's not, they'll definitely make him a regular in season 5, Diana Rigg (Olenna), or Michael McElhatton (Roose Bolton), depending on how big his role is this season (but he's more likely to become a regular, if he does, next season).

 

^You might want to edit your post, because your spoiler tags are not working properly!

Awesome 15 minute teaser - SOOOO stoked for April!

Q2

 

About three weeks ago Martin's UK publisher tweeted that The Winds of Winter is "almost certainly years away", then deleted that tweet but let one stand saying it certainly won't be published this year. Since the TV producers have said they're aiming at a seven- or eight-season show and there won't be any production slowdowns to allow the books to catch up, it's pretty much a done deal that the TV show will finish before the book series.

 

His last update on the TWOW progress was during some interview last March, when he said it was about 1/4 done. There were no updates on his blog for more than a year. I'd be very surprised if it comes out before 2016.

Considering the quality of the last two books, I'm OK with the TV show finishing first.

 

That's what happens when you start doing a movie/show based on a novel series that is still not done yet. You get the hype of a popular book series that hasn't finished yet, but you have to eat the risk that the movie/show will overtake the book in terms to story in a few years.

That constantly happens in Japanese anime. Show writers have to constantly write crappy filler episodes that has nothing to do with the books, until the books have enough new material for the show to animate. Filler has be known to get shows canceled.

Obviously you can't do that with GOT.

 

I'd rather read the books first but I have no problem with HBO finishing the series first. If the threat of having the TV show finish before the book series couldn't motivate GRRM to move his ass and stop reveling in world-building, that's his problem. HBO is not going to coddle him like this publishers and editor have.

 

Question is, are they going to go it on their own or are they going to write it with the support and blessing of GRRM?

 

Probably a combination. They know in broad strokes where GRRM intends to take all of the various storylines. They'll likely deviate from the books to an increasing degree, while hitting many of the key plot points GRRM has laid out. Quite how much they veer away from the books will be very interesting to see.

Here's a new trailer for season four that's just been released:

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=d2ZNaLQD60Y[/yt]

 

The way he writes means that he has chapters written for the last book already, and some storylines for the next book are already in place waiting for the rest of them to be finished so they can be polished up together. If he is on a roll with one character he just keeps writing them, even if it means getting far ahead of the rest of the PoVs. Some already written chapters have also been pushed back to later books, so by the time they have to start writing scripts for the 5th or 6th season he will have at least a patchwork of the next book he could make available to them.

 

The major storylines will be available to the producers, yes, but we're going to hit a point where those storylines, albeit in perhaps heavily modified form, unfold on screen before they're published. And that may happen sooner rather than later since it looks like they're going to go through Feast and Dance in a very speedy fashion.

 

It's unlikely the book series will be finished in their own right so it might end up that the final books (if they are written) are taken from the TV series instead of the other way round.

 

I doubt it. Martin knows where the books are going, he just has issues connecting the dots after letting the story get larger than he originally intended. He may be inspired by certain moments or the use of certain characters in ways he didn't originally imagine, but as an avid opponent of fan fiction I suspect he may actually just skip the last couple seasons lest he borrow anything accidentally and suddenly find his sole authorship of the series questioned.

 

If the TV show outstrips the books, I will watch the story unfold on the screen and then read the books when they are available.

I like how the trailers are revealing parts of the story while making viewers think something else. The 1st trailer makes it look like Dany is talking about the Lannisters and the 2nd one makes you think that Tyrion is talking about Jon's desire for justice.

The production values seem to go up and up.

 

I do hope we at least get Winds of Winter before the series overtakes the books. We should have at least 1 or 2 more seasons after this at the most before that happens. Although at the speed that some of the storylines have been moving (out of order from the books), it may not be more than a single season before catch-up happens.

 

I'm fairly confident we'll get The Winds of Winter before the show overtakes the books. It's probably just the last book that might get passed over. If that does happen, I'll wait to read the book before I watch the end of the show.

 

I think there's a very good chance the show will get into at least some material, if not a whole lot of it, from Winds before it's published. It looks like they're going to massively condense and speed through Feast and Dance. I think Dany will be in Westeros by season 5.

That could be a long wait. If GRRM takes five or six years to get each of the sixth and seventh books out that would lead to the final book being published sometime between 2021 and 2023, while the show will end in 2018 if it runs for eight seasons.

 

And, God forbid, there may be the possibility if one of GRRM's manuscripts gets too long, he'll split it up like he did before, only complicating matters even more.

 

I'm not worried about it. I read the first three books all the way back in 2002. I'm used to waiting. The books are the main appeal for me, not the show (although I do love the show). I don't want however the show ends to color my opinions of however the books end.

 

The writing of scripts for season six, which will be partially if not largely equivalent to The Winds of Winter, is now less than a year away. Martin's UK editor said recently that the book itself is "almost certainly years away." Barring an unprecedented increase in his writing speed or a delay for the TV show (which I've heard the producers have already ruled out), the show will overtake the books very soon. I'd say there's some (increasingly slim) chance that The Winds of Winter will be published before the season based on it airs, but the episodes will almost surely be written and filmed without access to the finished book.

 

^^^
Yeah, I posted about the UK editor's tweets a little way back. That's what spurred this part of the discussion.