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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old July 17 2014, 04:17 PM   #211
Franklin
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
There are howlers in most Trek episodes over all five series. Should we blush at those, too?
Are there any quite like the cold fusion one?
Genesis. Genesis trumps everything. That is the most far-fetched piece of science ever created in the Trek world. If we can buy Genesis, we should have no problem buying cold fusion or even red matter, for that matter.
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Old July 17 2014, 04:31 PM   #212
Ryan8bit
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Franklin wrote: View Post
Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
There are howlers in most Trek episodes over all five series. Should we blush at those, too?
Are there any quite like the cold fusion one?
Genesis. Genesis trumps everything. That is the most far-fetched piece of science ever created in the Trek world. If we can by Genesis, we should have no problem with cold fusion or red matter, for that matter.
The point was not about farfetched science though. It was about taking an existing science term and applying it wrongly to something. I can't think of too many deliberate instances of that in prior Trek because they used technobabble instead. I'd prefer that, and red matter is fine by me.
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Old July 17 2014, 04:40 PM   #213
Franklin
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
Ryan8bit wrote: View Post

Are there any quite like the cold fusion one?
Genesis. Genesis trumps everything. That is the most far-fetched piece of science ever created in the Trek world. If we can by Genesis, we should have no problem with cold fusion or red matter, for that matter.
The point was not about farfetched science though. It was about taking an existing science term and applying it wrongly to something. I can't think of too many deliberate instances of that in prior Trek because they used technobabble instead. I'd prefer that, and red matter is fine by me.
Meh. For all we know, the term "cold fusion device" was short-hand for something more technical or it was descriptive of what the device did: flash-freeze things and fuse them together.

Technobabble was an attempt to have one's cake and eat it, too. Try to sound scientific when what is being said is seventy-five percent or more pure nonsense and could sometimes grind a story to a halt. Technobabble was no different than saying "cold fusion device," I'd say, except it used a lot more words.
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Old July 17 2014, 05:10 PM   #214
Ryan8bit
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Franklin wrote: View Post
Technobabble was no different than saying "cold fusion device," I'd say, except it used a lot more words.
Red matter, Genesis device, etc, aren't really that many words. And there is a difference. One is deliberately made up, the other is taken from something real and used wrongly.
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Old July 17 2014, 05:17 PM   #215
Commishsleer
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Franklin wrote: View Post
Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
There are howlers in most Trek episodes over all five series. Should we blush at those, too?
Are there any quite like the cold fusion one?
Genesis. Genesis trumps everything. That is the most far-fetched piece of science ever created in the Trek world. If we can buy Genesis, we should have no problem buying cold fusion or even red matter, for that matter.
What about the Nexus?
Or even all the god-like beings in Star Trek?
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Old July 17 2014, 10:14 PM   #216
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Franklin wrote: View Post

Meh. For all we know, the term "cold fusion device" was short-hand for something more technical or it was descriptive of what the device did: flash-freeze things and fuse them together.
This is what I figured was going on. Even if they did just get it flat wrong, it's no skin off of my rear.
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Old July 18 2014, 03:44 AM   #217
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Dennis wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
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And what are these "things" he refers to that make "it" accessible to a "general audience"? My guess is that's bar fights and boobies.
Probably likeable, relatable characters and a complete lack of technobabble.
Exactly so.

Whatever they did obviously has made Trek accessible to a general audience, because these movies are the most successful Trek productions ever.
Just like the Phantom Menace made Star Wars accessible to a general audience, because it was the most successful Star Wars production EVA!
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Old July 18 2014, 04:21 AM   #218
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

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because it was the most successful Star Wars production EVA!
Not really. There's only about 120m that separates TPM and Star Wars, and they came out 20 years apart.

In adjusted, Star Wars is almost twice as high.

OTOH, ST09 is the most successful in both actual and adjusted.

So I'm not really sure what your argument is.
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Old July 18 2014, 04:27 AM   #219
Nerys Myk
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Alex1939 wrote: View Post
Dennis wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Probably likeable, relatable characters and a complete lack of technobabble.
Exactly so.

Whatever they did obviously has made Trek accessible to a general audience, because these movies are the most successful Trek productions ever.
Just like the Phantom Menace made Star Wars accessible to a general audience, because it was the most successful Star Wars production EVA!
When was Star Wars not accessible to the General Audience? SW has got to be one of the most accessible/popular franchises ever across several media platforms.
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Old July 18 2014, 09:03 AM   #220
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Franklin wrote: View Post
Ryan8bit wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
There are howlers in most Trek episodes over all five series. Should we blush at those, too?
Are there any quite like the cold fusion one?
Genesis. Genesis trumps everything. That is the most far-fetched piece of science ever created in the Trek world. If we can buy Genesis, we should have no problem buying cold fusion or even red matter, for that matter.
I never thought Genesis was any more far fetched than most things in Trek. Re-arranging molecules so they form life is no worse than the thing that has been used in nearly every episode and movie of trek for 50 years - the transporter.
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Old July 18 2014, 09:07 AM   #221
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Creating a whole world out of thin air wasn't far fetched?

Bones was right, it literally was Genesis.
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Old July 18 2014, 10:23 AM   #222
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Alex1939 wrote: View Post
Dennis wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Probably likeable, relatable characters and a complete lack of technobabble.
Exactly so.

Whatever they did obviously has made Trek accessible to a general audience, because these movies are the most successful Trek productions ever.
Just like the Phantom Menace made Star Wars accessible to a general audience, because it was the most successful Star Wars production EVA!
One was highly rated and well liked by audiences, the other not so much.

And as Nerys pointed out, SW has always been more popular than Trek.
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Old July 18 2014, 04:32 PM   #223
Set Harth
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote:
One was highly rated and well liked by audiences, the other not so much.
Both were highly rated and well liked by audiences at the time of release.

As opposed to complaining by internet types years after the fact.
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Old July 18 2014, 04:40 PM   #224
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

Set Harth wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote:
One was highly rated and well liked by audiences, the other not so much.
Both were highly rated and well liked by audiences at the time of release.

As opposed to complaining by internet types years after the fact.
No it wasn't. People saw TPM to satisfy their cursiosity only and almost immediately tore it to shreds via word of mouth. Only very young kids enjoyed it--because they didn't know any better--and adopted it as their generational touchstone for future unwarranted nostalgia. The ticket sales do not equate to audience satisfaction. Of course, studio heads don't care as long as they get your money.
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Old July 18 2014, 05:08 PM   #225
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Re: Orci talks about Star Trek 3

mos6507 wrote: View Post
Set Harth wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote:
One was highly rated and well liked by audiences, the other not so much.
Both were highly rated and well liked by audiences at the time of release.

As opposed to complaining by internet types years after the fact.
No it wasn't. People saw TPM to satisfy their cursiosity only and almost immediately tore it to shreds via word of mouth. Only very young kids enjoyed it--because they didn't know any better--and adopted it as their generational touchstone for future unwarranted nostalgia. The ticket sales do not equate to audience satisfaction. Of course, studio heads don't care as long as they get your money.
The Phantom Menace made the most money of all Star Wars movies which makes it the best of the Star Wars movie and made Star Wars more accessible to general audiences. This is the logic used for the new Star Trek movies, so how can you say it's true for nuTrek and not true for Star Wars?
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