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Trek Tech Pass me the quantum flux regulator, will you?

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Old July 9 2014, 12:54 AM   #226
Ithekro
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

As pointed out by the Phase II/New Voyages production staff, they had a hard time finding sources to get the actual colors for the TOS bridge, Especially the carpet, as the lighting of the day makes it look very different than its actual color. Thus if one used VHS tapes of the day, you'd not get the right color for the floor unless you knew exactly how they lit the set, which would require more research than one can spend time on for a weekly produced TV show if you are only going to build a partial set for one episode when the first plan was to do it all with blue screen.

Also it is easy to note that the image of the bridge when first seen, is identical to the USS Enterprise, as it is the USS Enterprise in a shot from an existing episode. Only after the actors get into the limited set does it shift around as they didn't have enough set to work with for the detail hounds. In looking at an overhead view of what they had to work with you can tell the short cut off section of railing was suppose to be the start of the bit that was to Kirk's left side, and that the camera angle the set was designed for was to focus on the Engineering station, rather than the Captain's chair. Looks like they improvised based on the director's whims and what pieces they got in terms of the helm and captain's chair.

Basically I can ignore the errors in the set due to the establishing shot of the Bridge as being the real thing.

Last edited by Ithekro; July 9 2014 at 01:08 AM.
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Old July 9 2014, 06:24 AM   #227
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Ithekro wrote: View Post
Basically I can ignore the errors in the set due to the establishing shot of the Bridge as being the real thing.
Exactly.

In "All Good Things..." in the past scenes where Picard has just taken command of the ship: there are several differences between the bridge set for these scenes and the actual bridge set from season one. Are we to assume that based on these minor differences, that Picard actually was on the bridge of another Galaxy class ship with coincidentally the same name? Of course not.
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Old July 9 2014, 06:37 PM   #228
Mytran
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Nah, he was clearly in a parallel universe/timeline. There was discontinuity between the the time zones, remember? Q probably had to rope in some of those near-identical quantum universes mentioned in Parallels for his Evil Plan to work efficiently. One of those near-identical differences was that the Season 2 Bridge module got installed early, that's all

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Old July 9 2014, 06:51 PM   #229
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

^While I acknowledge that you're being facetious here, I still want to point out that it was supposed to be the same ship
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Old July 9 2014, 06:54 PM   #230
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

I agree - it was the same ship (more or less).

With regard the recreation of the Enterprise bridge that Scotty asked for, there is one extra feature which definiently distances itself from the TOS Bridge - it has TWO exits!
The main one and one used by Picard (from this page)

Interestingly, the second exit seems to be more or less next to Spock's station. Maybe someone should start a thread about that...
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Old July 9 2014, 07:00 PM   #231
Ithekro
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

The Animated Series USS Enterprise has two turbolifts as well.

Though Picard might be using an entrance on the ship, as he was coming in via the holodeck doors, which can be anyplace, really.
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Old July 9 2014, 09:13 PM   #232
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
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No, its the whole point of the discussion. From the very start...
The very start was here, where I pointed out to you that discussions of "ships named Enterprise" rarely if ever specify that they are referring to Federation ships named Enterprise. Scotty didn't, and neither did the DTI agents. Even the E-D's dedication plaque doesn't specify that.
Sorry, but no.
No what? If they didn't say it, they didn't say it. It thus remains entirely possible that NON-Federation vessels exist with the name Enterprise that consistently slip under history's radar (NX-01 being the most obvious example).

Is there something about that you're not comprehending or are you disagreeing just to be disagreeable?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
Do we really know whether the ship's computer has holodeck programs of Enterprises prior to the TOS Enterprise?
Yes we do, as seen in "These Are the Voyages" which supposedly takes place barely a year after "Relics."

We also know it has a simulation of a 19th century Enterprise (as seen in Generations), which was also excluded from the list.

Fact is that the computer doesn't even ask him which NCC-1701 bridge he'd like to see and delivers him the only program available - it's not even the Bridge of the Enterprise but just a Constitution Class Bridge, basically an approximation, but Scotty seemed grateful that he got that, at least.
The Enterprise computer being what it is, I almost think Scotty could have talked the thing into showing him the TMP version or even the "No Man" version if he was added more detail to his request. In this case he was limited to just the "featured" search results and (obviously) didn't get the full list of results for "bridge of the Enterprise."

The point being, that leaves quite a bit of room for "forgotten Enterprise" designs to slip through the cracks. We know FOR A FACT that NX-01 is on that list, as it is 1) definitely in the holodeck's database and 2) not listed for Scotty or anyone else for that matter. Something similar may have happened to whatever ships existed in the years between Enterprise B and C or -C and -D. The names were given (or at least reserved) for active starships that either never went into service or never served for the Federation itself.
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Old July 9 2014, 09:27 PM   #233
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Ithekro wrote: View Post
The Animated Series USS Enterprise has two turbolifts as well.
And that's the only one Picard could have used, since the door he comes through has a red alert light next to it. Actually, I'm pretty sure it's the same door Scotty came through when he entered the bridge, but I haven't seen that episode in a while.

Frankly I'm leaning towards the "Generic Constitution" bridge since the holodeck has never in the past been depicted to have 100% fidelity in its recreations. Nothing as serious as dead pixels or washed out textures, but it doesn't always put things in the right place or the right order (and sometimes when it's REALLY glitchy, switches its characters' handedness).

This particular simulation wasn't really meant to meet up with the standards of someone who had actually BEEN on the TOS bridge (they're all dead by now) and even if it had, Scotty hasn't seen the TOS bridge module in 30 years.
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Old July 9 2014, 09:56 PM   #234
Mytran
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Ithekro wrote: View Post
The Animated Series USS Enterprise has two turbolifts as well.
Except that the TAS secondary exit was located port side of the main viewer, and Picard (and Scotty) entered mid starboard.

As for alternate Bridges, the original Ent may have had at least 4 different designs, but the Ent-D had a Bridge in season 1 too. Would the computer have mentioned this option if Scotty had selected "D" or simply shown the most popular "standard" configuration?
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Old July 9 2014, 10:25 PM   #235
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Crazy Eddie wrote: View Post
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Crazy Eddie wrote: View Post
The very start was here, where I pointed out to you that discussions of "ships named Enterprise" rarely if ever specify that they are referring to Federation ships named Enterprise. Scotty didn't, and neither did the DTI agents. Even the E-D's dedication plaque doesn't specify that.
Sorry, but no.
No what? If they didn't say it, they didn't say it.
But they did say it. I don't know why you keep ignoring onscreen material and insisting that they didn't.
It thus remains entirely possible that NON-Federation vessels exist with the name Enterprise that consistently slip under history's radar (NX-01 being the most obvious example).
As long as they aren't Federation starships named Enterprise then it works. But since the issue from the very start was about Federation starships named Enterprise, well...
Is there something about that you're not comprehending or are you disagreeing just to be disagreeable?
That's my question to you.
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Old July 9 2014, 11:26 PM   #236
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

Another ship named Enterprise, outside the existing NCC-1701 structure would have to be either:

A: A non-Federation starship (or at least not one at the start)

B: Not a "starship".

C: Not in Starfleet service (thus could be a starship that serves the Federation, but is not in Starfleet and thus would not normally be counted) There are plenty of ships and boats in civilian hands named Enterprise. VSS Enterprise comes to mind in the present, as well as the test orbiter Enterprise that is presently in a museum.

Type in "Enterprise" in Wikipedia and you'll find a lot more ships than one would think. They aren't "USS Enterprise", but are named Enterprise. 15 for the Royal Navy alone. Seven for the US Navy. 13 others as ships or boats. Plus two balloons, three spacecraft, and a naval building. And 23 town like places.
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Old July 9 2014, 11:36 PM   #237
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

The subject wasn't even relevant, really. Had Scotty (or anyone else for that matter) wanted to see an Enterprise that wasn't a Federation starship, it would have been a simple matter of asking the computer for it.
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Old July 10 2014, 12:19 AM   #238
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

I found the scene if one wished to view it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2Rv2wZrj-0

In retrospect, the computer makes a lot of assumptions as to what Scott wants by specifying there have been five Federation starships with the name "Enterprise" when all he asked for was the bridge of a ship named Enterprise. Though he did say "my ship", so maybe computers are more clever in 275 or so years. Or he got lucky on the Google search as that it the most requested thing on the NCC-1701-D when the name Enterprise is used.
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Old July 10 2014, 03:15 AM   #239
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

I don't think it was so much an assumption on the computer's part as more of a default selection by its programmers. There have been instances before in which someone asked the computer something, was given a selection, and then had to be more specific.
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Old July 10 2014, 05:09 AM   #240
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Re: Was NCC-1701 active for 40 years?

So, why was it the set designers couldn't match the set they built with the image from the establishing shot? Seems like a big production fail to me.
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