RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,347
Posts: 5,502,488
Members: 25,119
Currently online: 671
Newest member: mahler

TrekToday headlines

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13

Sindicate Lager To Debut In The US Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

Rumor Mill: Saldana Gives Birth
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

New Line of Anovos Enterprise Uniforms
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11

Frakes: Sign Me Up!
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Trek Literature

Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

View Poll Results: Rate Tower of Babel.
Outstanding 15 23.44%
Above Average 29 45.31%
Average 19 29.69%
Below Average 1 1.56%
Poor 0 0%
Voters: 64. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 28 2014, 06:40 AM   #241
trash80
Lieutenant Commander
 
Location: UK
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

I enjoyed the book a lot, it had a definite campy prototype-TOS feel about much of it
trash80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28 2014, 12:28 PM   #242
Killie
Lieutenant
 
Killie's Avatar
 
Location: Scotland
View Killie's Twitter Profile
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Another enjoyabe entry in the series from Christopher and I am sure to read the next.

I posted the review here if anyone is interested.
__________________
A Star Trek Literary Adventure
Killie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 5 2014, 12:59 AM   #243
Paper Moon
Commander
 
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

My review:

This novel is a solid read. Beginning, middle and end? Check. Great world-building? Check. Good character work? Check.

But it doesn’t exceed the sum of its parts.

The novel was billed in some parts as essentially a primer on the Rigel system. And that it does pretty damn well. It felt like a lot of Rigel was told and not shown, and I would’ve enjoyed getting more from the colonials, but that’s all nitpicky stuff. Christopher has created a fascinating super-civilization and it promises many great stories to come.

But beyond describing Rigel, it felt a bit “by the numbers”. The plot had little momentum, and the character work was hit-or-miss. Nice stuff from Williams, Kirk and Trip, and some nice moments from Reed and Archer, but none of it is breathtaking. (I was frankly disappointed that it was another instance of a woman seducing Archer for duplicitous purposes. I realize Archer is being saved for Danica, but it just felt boring at this point. And Archer didn't spend that much time in hot water, as things go, so it didn't feel worth it in the end.) I appreciated the Sato-Thanien story, but it felt too quickly resolved, almost fable-like in its lesson. It's not that it's bad, it's that it's "only" nice.

The Three Sisters are interesting in an academic sense, but I don’t find them particularly engaging to read. I share Deranged Nasat's ambivalence about the Maras revelation, but I come down more on the dislike-end of the spectrum. I understand Christopher's concern about propagating misogynistic stereotypes, but I think he doesn't give himself enough credit. I think he could've navigated that balance quite handily. The problem arises when a sexually active female character is assumed to be unintelligent because she is a female, and a sexually active one at that. There certainly are unintelligent people out there, there certainly are sexually active women out there, and there certainly are individuals who are both. Setting aside, for the moment, the sex and gender components, there's a lot of untapped storytelling potential (especially in Trek) in situations such as the apparent one faced by Navaar: how do you deal with an ally, a friend, a family member, who is totally not on your level? That was an interesting component of the Triumfeminate's story, and I wish it could've been maintained.

Garos– he’s good. Really good. Very enjoyable to read. Looking forward to more of him.

The Saurian story is coming together very well. Christopher is definitely building to something huge with Maltuvis, and he's doing it very, very well. Looking forward to the story being continued.

The Federation's early years being characterized by threats from criminals and pirates is a good angle, and a nice contrast to the threats from 150 or 225 years later. I worry a little bit that stories will get tiresome, but I think Christopher will be able to keep it interesting.

I share the feelings articulated upthread that it sometimes felt like there wasn't much plot-driving conflict (outside of Williams/Kirk/Grev specifically and Sauria), but I don't think the solution would've been to make us fear for the characters lives. I'm frankly looking forward to enjoying (most) of these characters for some time now. In all of the Star Trek television series, exactly two main characters were killed off during the actual run of the show. Star Trek is not and never has been about telling stories in which you fear that your heroes won't survive. Yes, it happens sometimes, but it's best used very sparingly.

In any case, we’ll see how this book changes in the light of its sequels; it certainly wouldn’t be the first Trek novel to be improved by the stories which came afterwards.

And it’s not a bad book by any stretch. It wasn’t painful to read, and it was satisfyingly resolved. I think it’ll have good re-read value.

But for having such potential, it just didn’t quite bring it home. The themes articulated and issues raised are great, very timely and thought-provoking. It's a nice story that's enjoyable to read– which just makes me wish it could've been a little more.

From what he says on his website, it sounds like Tower of Babel had a bit of a rough writing process. (That card trick, Christopher!) ) That's a shame. I feel like this book was really close to being among the best TrekLit out there; it just needed a like more time in development.

Still, I did enjoy it and I can't wait for the sequels! Despite all I've said, the series definitely is in good hands.
Paper Moon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 5 2014, 03:15 AM   #244
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Paper Moon wrote: View Post
Setting aside, for the moment, the sex and gender components, there's a lot of untapped storytelling potential (especially in Trek) in situations such as the apparent one faced by Navaar: how do you deal with an ally, a friend, a family member, who is totally not on your level? That was an interesting component of the Triumfeminate's story, and I wish it could've been maintained.
Ahh, but that component is still very much in play, just not the way you thought -- since Maras is a lot smarter than Navaar or D'Nesh. They're nowhere near her level.


The Federation's early years being characterized by threats from criminals and pirates is a good angle, and a nice contrast to the threats from 150 or 225 years later. I worry a little bit that stories will get tiresome, but I think Christopher will be able to keep it interesting.
There are some more variegated threats ahead, I assure you. And bigger ones.




But for having such potential, it just didn’t quite bring it home. The themes articulated and issues raised are great, very timely and thought-provoking. It's a nice story that's enjoyable to read– which just makes me wish it could've been a little more.

From what he says on his website, it sounds like Tower of Babel had a bit of a rough writing process. (That card trick, Christopher!) ) That's a shame. I feel like this book was really close to being among the best TrekLit out there; it just needed a like more time in development.
Honestly, I'm not entirely satisfied with this book myself; I was too rushed and there was too much that I didn't work out in as much depth as I should. And I really have no one to blame for that but myself, because I made a point of arranging for plenty of time but then made poor use of it. I fell badly behind on the outline due to a health issue, and so it was kind of a cursory outline and not a good foundation to build the manuscript on, so I got very stuck on portions of the manuscript, and had to basically improvise new plot threads in a number of portions, with very little time left to finish them. I did what I could to clean it up in revisions, but I can't disagree with the comments that it's not all it could've been.

But it's motivated me to try harder to make Uncertain Logic a stronger tale.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 6 2014, 05:04 PM   #245
Braxton
Fleet Captain
 
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota, USA
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

The early years of the Federation, even the first 100 years, should be ripe with story possibilities. Maybe it's just me, but I feel that this part of the Federation's history should be more than capable of creating stories and making them interesting.
__________________

Braxton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 7 2014, 05:09 PM   #246
NX-01ftw
Lieutenant Junior Grade
 
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Will be picking this up soon. I am very excited to get to this one as A Choice of Futures is an excellent read so far. Christopher is a great writer.
NX-01ftw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 7 2014, 11:22 PM   #247
Cap'n Crunch
Captain
 
Cap'n Crunch's Avatar
 
Location: Knoxville, TN
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

While it's a good book, I still enjoyed A Choice of Futures more. I think that is because I really liked the exploration of the aliens (the Mutes and the ones in the Intrepid storyline) in the first book. While Tower of Babel certainly does a good job of exploring the Rigel system and it's cultures, I feel like it's not quite the same type of exploration, if that makes sense. I'm not sure I can explain it very well. I'm not saying I disliked Tower of Babel or anything, it's very good, I just liked A Choices of Futures more.
__________________
Some trees flourish, others die. Some cattle grow strong, others are taken by wolves. Some men are born rich enough and dumb enough to enjoy their lives. Ain't nothing fair. You know that. - John Marston, Red Dead Redemption
Cap'n Crunch is online now   Reply With Quote
Old June 8 2014, 12:00 AM   #248
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

^I get it -- it's not quite a "where no one has gone before" situation, it's just getting to know a neighbor better. Not to worry though -- there will be a number of strange new worlds in Uncertain Logic.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 8 2014, 09:33 PM   #249
Ronald Held
Rear Admiral
 
Location: On the USS Sovereign
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Christopher can you refresh my memory as to when "Uncertain Logic" is due out?
Ronald Held is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 8 2014, 10:42 PM   #250
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Ronald Held wrote: View Post
Christopher can you refresh my memory as to when "Uncertain Logic" is due out?
When I find out myself, I'll let people know. All I know is that it's for sometime in 2015.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 14 2014, 12:29 AM   #251
Cap'n Crunch
Captain
 
Cap'n Crunch's Avatar
 
Location: Knoxville, TN
Re: ENT: Tower of Babel by C. L. Bennett Review Thread (Spoilers!)

Christopher wrote: View Post
^I get it -- it's not quite a "where no one has gone before" situation, it's just getting to know a neighbor better. Not to worry though -- there will be a number of strange new worlds in Uncertain Logic.
Glad to hear it!
__________________
Some trees flourish, others die. Some cattle grow strong, others are taken by wolves. Some men are born rich enough and dumb enough to enjoy their lives. Ain't nothing fair. You know that. - John Marston, Red Dead Redemption
Cap'n Crunch is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
reviewpoll_v1

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:50 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.