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Old June 1 2014, 02:47 AM   #61
Blamo
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Jax wrote: View Post
When will they stop collecting money and trying to expand on the game and get down to finishing what they already promised. I know he wants to make this great massive game but I can't help but feel this kickstarter fund the game is generating is doing more harm than good.
That's pretty much what they're doing now. The stretch goals now are mostly additions that'll take less than an hour to put together. Things like towels, an engine tuning kit, lore items. No more feature creep.
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Old June 1 2014, 02:54 AM   #62
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Yeah, I say it's time to start doing big tests and then push the game out the door. From what I've seen, it is packed full of features, and if they want to add something later, they can create an expansion.
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Old June 1 2014, 10:53 PM   #63
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

J. Allen wrote: View Post
Yeah, I say it's time to start doing big tests and then push the game out the door. From what I've seen, it is packed full of features, and if they want to add something later, they can create an expansion.
This, I think, is shortsighted. CIG is building a gigantic persistent universe -- EVE Online on steroids -- which includes a space-sim mode (including multiple stations aboard a ship), a FPS module (including boarding), Cargo Tetris, and God knows what else. Right now, they can't even get the space-sim mode with four ships working -- one of the critical bugs that stopped them from releasing Arena Commander last week was because the game crashed when enemy ships spawned.

Beyond that, there's still the Squadron 42 campaign, which they haven't even begun working on (and their script is over 2,000 pages ).

The additional stuff that gets unlocked, while being largely art assets, still requires a lot of work, particularly they're designing and building assets for hardware that won't even be out for two years. But let's talk about the stretch goals:

$46 mil - Updated Scanning Software: Coding, assets
$45 mil - Hadesian Artifact - Some sort of actual content
$44 mil - Stellar Cartography - Interactive star chart that will need to be coded
$43 mil - Bonus armor, so art asset
$42 mil - Bunch of stupid shit and a new fighter (and according to Roberts, a new fighter costs at least $100,000, so a couple thousand man-hours of work)
$41 mil - Procedural Generation of star systems and planets: Fucking this will never happen
$40 mil - Two entirely new systems with associated art, content, server support, etc.

The issue is, and always has been, timeline, budget and scope, all of which need to be kept in sync at any given time ... which has not been the case here. It's more like kids on a playground talking about their perfect game: "The game will never turn off and you can have multiple people running a ship and you can ram people and you can board ships and you can have battles on planets and you can trade stuff and and and and and." There's never been a point at which CIG has said, "For fuck's sake, no more, just get something done." And they aren't in a position to, because they have had no project management on this. They have their community manager developing the cargo tetris module, for Christ's sake.

Just look at the thrice-delayed Dogfight Module (we were supposed to have this in December, remember): What was originally just a core module that would feature a few ships is now a "game" that includes free flight, dogfighting, PvE, CTF, etc., and ties into the fucking game lore. If they had stuck to the original scope, it would have been out by now. (Maybe. Possibly. The PAX East presentation, where it crashed every four seconds, is still my favorite thing of the last few years.)

This whole thing is basically Peter Molyneux: IN SPAAAAACE.
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Old June 1 2014, 11:04 PM   #64
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Well, I can't argue with that. It's kind of like Duke Nukem Forever. I mean, it did come out, but holy shit, everything had changed in the meantime. This time, though, we get to watch it all play out as the stretch goals continue, but the core hasn't even worked out as it was supposed to. That's more than a bit disappointing.
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Old June 2 2014, 09:00 PM   #65
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

A new fighter model costs 100,000?

The year's salary of two 3D artists?
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Old June 2 2014, 11:05 PM   #66
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
A new fighter model costs 100,000?

The year's salary of two 3D artists?
Every new fighter includes not just the exterior model, but the interior as well, plus the cockpit, plus whatever new physics modeling needs to be done, plus ... well, hey, Chris Roberts himself said it. Many man-hours spread across many employees ... it adds up.
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Old June 2 2014, 11:52 PM   #67
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

What do you guys think about Elite Dangerous? Their 'dog fighting module' came out on schedule back in December and since then many of the game's features have been completed with it entering Beta last Friday.
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Old June 3 2014, 07:58 PM   #68
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Timby wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
A new fighter model costs 100,000?

The year's salary of two 3D artists?
Every new fighter includes not just the exterior model, but the interior as well, plus the cockpit, plus whatever new physics modeling needs to be done, plus ... well, hey, Chris Roberts himself said it. Many man-hours spread across many employees ... it adds up.
I do think that a well seasoned 3D artist (especially one that would be worth 100k a year) could churn out such a thing in less than a month.
Just look how fast Tobias Richter does his high poly meshes of all the Trek starships.
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Old June 4 2014, 01:03 AM   #69
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

J. Allen wrote: View Post
Well, I can't argue with that. It's kind of like Duke Nukem Forever.
Because that turned out so well

I give it another week before PSN offers to pay *me* to download the damn thing. There is such a thing as a digital bargin bin, and that game has always been in it.
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Old June 4 2014, 07:31 AM   #70
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Charlie Kelly wrote: View Post
What do you guys think about Elite Dangerous? Their 'dog fighting module' came out on schedule back in December and since then many of the game's features have been completed with it entering Beta last Friday.
Never played the original games so I have no connection to the series, but I do hope it does well.

The last reasonable big name in this space to release a game, X:Rebirth, was pretty poor. So it would be good to have something be a critical and financial success. The more success in the genre the more likely we'll see publishers take notice and maybe joining in. Pretty much want a Star Wars game in here is why.
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Old June 4 2014, 10:47 AM   #71
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
J. Allen wrote: View Post
Well, I can't argue with that. It's kind of like Duke Nukem Forever.
Because that turned out so well

I give it another week before PSN offers to pay *me* to download the damn thing. There is such a thing as a digital bargin bin, and that game has always been in it.
I've yet to play it, though I want to. I remember playing Duke Nukem 3D on my friend's badass superpowered Windows 95 machine. It was so real, like you were there!

Anyway, I do hope Star Citizen turns out to be a critical success. I'd love to play Freelancer on steroids, as I am a huge fan of Freelancer, even as limited as it is. I want an open universe, the ability to trade anywhere, maybe choose to be a pirate, or a goody two shoes I guess, and really enjoy the environment and the people in it.

This has so much potential. That's why I'm so worried, because I'm concerned it might be a money pit, and they'll never let Chris Roberts near another game again.
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Old June 4 2014, 11:50 AM   #72
Blamo
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

The Dogfight Module/Arena Commander is out now (and working).
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Old June 5 2014, 04:06 PM   #73
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

It does indeed work. It however broke my install and I had to reinstall the 15gb, or whatever crazy amount it already is, again. Got it working though and had a free flight and then tried the bots mode.

My computer is at the minimum level of requirements, maybe even a touch under, and I was ready for a stuttery play, but it actually doesn't run too badly. It does feel a bit sluggish, but apart from that I didn't get any momentary freezes or sudden jumps across the map. In fact it still looks quite good, though the cockpit hud is a bit crowded from my low screen resolution.

The combat is okay. Like I said, it was a bit sluggish and I was learning as I went in terms of how to fly and fight so I did a lot of esc out to look at keys. One problem I had was I didn't really get a feeling of motion so I couldn't tell if I was going fast, turning sharply, which made the inevitable turn fight I got into with the Vanduul fighter a bit tougher. Not to mention the targeting indicators confused me for a while so I sprayed a lot of fire around the place to no effect. I'm actually still not sure what the difference between the green circle and green diamond is.

All-in-all, it didn't blow me away but it was okay. Given its a pre-alpha I guess "okay" is probably what I should expect.
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Old June 5 2014, 07:38 PM   #74
Blamo
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

Jono wrote: View Post
It does indeed work. It however broke my install and I had to reinstall the 15gb, or whatever crazy amount it already is, again. Got it working though and had a free flight and then tried the bots mode.

My computer is at the minimum level of requirements, maybe even a touch under, and I was ready for a stuttery play, but it actually doesn't run too badly. It does feel a bit sluggish, but apart from that I didn't get any momentary freezes or sudden jumps across the map. In fact it still looks quite good, though the cockpit hud is a bit crowded from my low screen resolution.

The combat is okay. Like I said, it was a bit sluggish and I was learning as I went in terms of how to fly and fight so I did a lot of esc out to look at keys. One problem I had was I didn't really get a feeling of motion so I couldn't tell if I was going fast, turning sharply, which made the inevitable turn fight I got into with the Vanduul fighter a bit tougher. Not to mention the targeting indicators confused me for a while so I sprayed a lot of fire around the place to no effect. I'm actually still not sure what the difference between the green circle and green diamond is.
The green diamond is for when the gimballed weapons are locked on target and are auto adjusting for targets distance and speed. I personally find it's best to start firing within 700.

I'd also recommend trying the decoupled mode(by pressing caps lock). Think B5 Starfury, where you're able to turn around in space but still head in the same direction. Makes dogfighting both interesting and easier.
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Old June 6 2014, 05:03 PM   #75
Seventh White Boomer
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Re: Star Citizen - Chris Roberts' new game

^ I saw it mentioned in the key bindings but I wasn't quite sure what it did until I saw the short tutorial video they put up on RSI. Haven't been able to give it another go since the other day, but I'll definitely be trying it in decoupled mode.
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