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The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old April 10 2014, 01:09 AM   #121
2takesfrakes
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
This is somewhat off-topic, but I've been on kind of a TNG kick the last few weeks and have been watching a lot of random episodes. I've been paying special attention to Season 2, which it seems I have mostly forgotten about. I remember not liking Pulaski very much, but this time around I enjoyed her well enough. It seems weird that she never came back, even for a random guest appearance once or twice.
According to what I've read, what it comes down to is that Diane M. had the misfortune of being in TOS when she was young and very cute. So ... naturally, she had a good time, then. Her experiences of those days coloured her experiences during TNG, where the vibe was very different. She did not feel that she fit in and, in fact, was under the impression that everyone was out for themselves. She was glad to leave and did not want to come back.
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Old April 10 2014, 10:06 AM   #122
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

The first season of TNG "tried" too much to be a clone of TOS and bringing in a TOS veteran for the second season, worse, to replace a fresh and young new face, didn't really suggest a cut of the "umbilical cord".

Curiously, Roddenberry had originally cast older actors as the ship's senior medical officers in the TOS pilots (characters of Boyce and Piper) and apparently that somehow didn't work. Why he did the same on TNG (knowing it wasn't such a great idea from previous experience) is a little beyond me.

Bob
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Old April 10 2014, 04:36 PM   #123
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
This is somewhat off-topic, but I've been on kind of a TNG kick the last few weeks and have been watching a lot of random episodes. I've been paying special attention to Season 2, which it seems I have mostly forgotten about. I remember not liking Pulaski very much, but this time around I enjoyed her well enough. It seems weird that she never came back, even for a random guest appearance once or twice.
According to what I've read, what it comes down to is that Diane M. had the misfortune of being in TOS when she was young and very cute. So ... naturally, she had a good time, then. Her experiences of those days coloured her experiences during TNG, where the vibe was very different. She did not feel that she fit in and, in fact, was under the impression that everyone was out for themselves. She was glad to leave and did not want to come back.
Do you have a link to the interview where she said this?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
The first season of TNG "tried" too much to be a clone of TOS and bringing in a TOS veteran for the second season, worse, to replace a fresh and young new face, didn't really suggest a cut of the "umbilical cord".

Curiously, Roddenberry had originally cast older actors as the ship's senior medical officers in the TOS pilots (characters of Boyce and Piper) and apparently that somehow didn't work. Why he did the same on TNG (knowing it wasn't such a great idea from previous experience) is a little beyond me.

Bob
Yeah, Roddenberry should be brought back from the dead and shot for daring to cast a veteran actress who actually gave the impression she could play a competent doctor instead of a featherbrain sashaying around the ship, whispering breathily into the Captain's ear.

Pulaski wasn't perfect; I found her bigotry toward Data distasteful. But she did make a good doctor, and brought interesting dynamics with the other characters (friends with Riker's father, friends with Worf, not afraid in the least to stand up to Picard, etc.).
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Old April 10 2014, 04:59 PM   #124
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
It always surprised me - with how important an actor's looks are - that Shatner let himself go like that
If you're not on juice or something (like Stallone) It's a lot of work to stay in shape as you get older. Shatner had a pretty long run, all things considered. A lot of men would have already been flabby and out of shape by the age he was in ST:TMP. Instead he was flashing his (now unwaxed) biceps in a short-sleeved shirt, and then he goes on to do a physically demanding weekly TV series (TJ Hooker) where he has to run-down thugs. He was pretty active for his age in the 1980s. He just slowed down by the 90s.
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Old April 10 2014, 06:13 PM   #125
Robert Comsol
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Timewalker wrote: View Post
Yeah, Roddenberry should be brought back from the dead and shot for daring to cast a veteran actress who actually gave the impression she could play a competent doctor instead of a featherbrain sashaying around the ship, whispering breathily into the Captain's ear.
Just for the record: I have no such issues with the Great Bird of the Galaxy, you seem to imply, I would just like to understand his reasoning if it were available.

Curiously, should I wonder why he replaced veteran actors from the TOS pilots (who actually gave the impression they could play experienced doctors) with a guy (McCoy) who seemed emotionally unstable most of the time and seemed to prefer lamenting over practising?

Bob
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Old April 10 2014, 06:19 PM   #126
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
There was also this scene cut from the beginning of the third season which explained Dr. Pulaski's departure.
I quite like Pulaski, but that was funny!
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Old April 10 2014, 06:31 PM   #127
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Haven't watched the clip...does it involve a tragic encounter with an airlock?
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Old April 10 2014, 06:41 PM   #128
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
Timewalker wrote: View Post
Yeah, Roddenberry should be brought back from the dead and shot for daring to cast a veteran actress who actually gave the impression she could play a competent doctor instead of a featherbrain sashaying around the ship, whispering breathily into the Captain's ear.
Just for the record: I have no such issues with the Great Bird of the Galaxy, you seem to imply, I would just like to understand his reasoning if it were available.

Curiously, should I wonder why he replaced veteran actors from the TOS pilots (who actually gave the impression they could play experienced doctors) with a guy (McCoy) who seemed emotionally unstable most of the time and seemed to prefer lamenting over practising?

Bob
McCoy had ample scenes where he practiced psychiatry, surgery, minor medical procedures, major medical procedures, helped non-ship personnel, delivered a baby, etc. and so forth.
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Old April 10 2014, 07:29 PM   #129
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post

Curiously, should I wonder why he replaced veteran actors from the TOS pilots (who actually gave the impression they could play experienced doctors) with a guy (McCoy) who seemed emotionally unstable most of the time and seemed to prefer lamenting over practising?
There's really no proof that either Boyce or Piper wouldn't have turned out the exact same way if they had been cast for the weekly series.
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Old April 13 2014, 01:28 PM   #130
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Armored Saint wrote: View Post
GalaxyX wrote: View Post
Why is it that so many people hate her character?
Wesley is hated by many people, Tasha isn't liked by many people. It's not the same thing.
I agree. Tasha didn't seem very believable to me. But, Wesley was just irritating!
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Old April 13 2014, 04:41 PM   #131
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

DonIago wrote: View Post
Haven't watched the clip...does it involve a tragic encounter with an airlock?
Close...think a little more Trek....

The clip was very funny...and I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who made a connection between Pulaski and the doctor from "Ethics".
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Old April 13 2014, 05:06 PM   #132
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post

Mytran wrote: View Post
For the protagonists, Sela's origin story is still full of unexplained mysteries.
Although apparently not for Worf. The Duras sisters try to seduce him:

LURSA: Join us, Worf, and usher in a new era for our people. WORF: An era where honour has no meaning? Where Klingons trade loyalties in dark rooms and where the Empire is ruled from Romulus.
SELA [on monitor]: Enough, Lursa. You failed. I need to know the strength and capabilities of the Federation fleet. I don't have time for this. Turn him over to the guard. B'Etor can have him back when they've finished with him.

Worf doesn't express any astonishment seeing Tasha Yar's alter ego on screen! Either he was incredibly cool or he already knew that Sela was behind all that...

Yet another issue Klingons don't discuss with outsiders?

Bob
I can't remember, did Worf ever actually see Sela face to face?

Even if he did, there's no way he could have known about what happened in "Yesterday's Enterprise", so he would have probably written it off as a coincidence. As far as he knew, Tasha never had a child, so therefore, he would never have any reason to suspect Sela's parentage.
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Old April 13 2014, 07:27 PM   #133
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
According to what I've read, what it comes down to is that Diane M. had the misfortune of being in TOS when she was young and very cute. So ... naturally, she had a good time, then. Her experiences of those days coloured her experiences during TNG, where the vibe was very different. She did not feel that she fit in and, in fact, was under the impression that everyone was out for themselves. She was glad to leave and did not want to come back.
I've heard about that too, and it just seems suspicious to me, because Denise Crosby left after a very tumultuous first season, where everyone pretty much thought they were going to be canned, and yet as of the third season, she was game to come back in any incarnation, as often as they'd have her.

Whoopi was new to the show in season 2 also, and grew into the cast quite well. Michele Forbes began as a guest actor, and came back to play Ro, who left & she reprised later. Dwight Schultz has always been eager to reprise Barclay. Wheaton reprised Wes. John Delancie, Suzie Plakson, Tony Todd, etc...

It seems the only person who had an issue with the environment was Muldaur alone. What does that suggest? It's not like TOS was all sunshine and roses anyway, given some of the internal drama that's come out since
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Old April 14 2014, 01:10 AM   #134
2takesfrakes
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

Timewalker wrote: View Post
2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
According to what I've read, what it comes down to is that Diane M. ... did not feel that she fit in and, in fact, was under the impression that everyone was out for themselves. She was glad to leave and did not want to come back.
Do you have a link to the interview where she said this?
There's really no need to crosscheck and verify. It's enough that I say it's so, isn't it? Trust in me. In the meantime, allow me to assuage your concern for historical truth ...

http://www.people.com/people/archive...130422,00.html
Legend of the Fall By Samantha Miller

Back on the scene, Muldaur scored two plum parts in the late '80s, as Star Trek: TNG's feisty Dr. Kate Pulaski and L.A. Law's power-hungry Rosalind.

She says she still gets "wonderful" letters from TNG fans—
"they've named their children after me," she marvels—but has not-as-fond memories of her year on its set. Everybody was out for themselves," she says. "I don't think they were happy to have me there."

Wikipedia expands upon these sentiments:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diana_Muldaur

"I don't think they were happy to have me there.""It wasn't what I hoped it would be. I thought it would be wonderfully inventive and wonderfully creative, and I found it was not any of those things. But it did give me Trekkies. I love Trekkies. I find them very dear."

mos6507 wrote: View Post
2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
It always surprised me - with how important an actor's looks are - that Shatner let himself go like that
If you're not on juice or something (like Stallone) It's a lot of work to stay in shape as you get older. Shatner had a pretty long run, all things considered. A lot of men would have already been flabby and out of shape by the age he was in ST:TMP. Instead he was flashing his (now unwaxed) biceps in a short-sleeved shirt, and then he goes on to do a physically demanding weekly TV series (TJ Hooker) where he has to run-down thugs. He was pretty active for his age in the 1980s. He just slowed down by the 90s.
Yes, everyone gets wrinkled, lined and flabby, but I still maintain that Shatner could've done more to keep up his appearance. We can't have our actors looking too realistic, now ...

Mojochi wrote: View Post
2takesfrakes wrote: View Post
According to what I've read ... Diane M. ... was glad to leave and did not want to come back.
I've heard about that too, and it just seems suspicious to me, because Denise Crosby left after a very tumultuous first season, where everyone pretty much thought they were going to be canned, and yet as of the third season, she was game to come back in any incarnation, as often as they'd have her.

Whoopi was new to the show in season 2 also, and grew into the cast quite well. Michele Forbes began as a guest actor, and came back to play Ro, who left & she reprised later. Dwight Schultz has always been eager to reprise Barclay. Wheaton reprised Wes. John Delancie, Suzie Plakson, Tony Todd, etc...

It seems the only person who had an issue with the environment was Muldaur alone. What does that suggest? It's not like TOS was all sunshine and roses anyway, given some of the internal drama that's come out since
Yeah, but you know ... everybody on TOS was mostly men, including GR. She was young and pretty and she's on the show getting all this attention, "Diane! We love having you, guest for us! You're so beautiful and talented - you're really going to make a name for yourself ..." and it was genuine, I'm sure. She was all those things. And the roles she was given on TOS were devoid of politics of any kind. They needed a babe-of-the-week, and she filled-in, nicely.

But when TNG came around, she was middle-aged and playing a crusty old lady whose job it was to bitch to all the characters, especially everybody's friend Data. I'm sure that Gates was pretty vocal about not appreciating being used as just a pretty decoration, at a time when TNG really needed team players. Marina always was, but her charater was always having to find stuff to do. So she felt her job was in jeapoardy, though it never really was, because she had the right attitude.

Getting rid of Gates was a bad decision and she had to come back. As I understand it, Sir Patrick Stewart was the one who eventually persuaded her to come home. The situation was not stacked, at all, in Diane's favour. She was basically a "scab," as it were, and was treated as such. Nobody gave a shit, this time, that Diane was onboard, except maybe for Gene. It was a matter of Time, that's what it was. "You Can't Go Home Again," and this is a case in point.
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Old April 15 2014, 06:05 AM   #135
Nerys Myk
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Re: Why is Tasha Yar hated?

BillJ wrote: View Post
Robert Comsol wrote: View Post

Curiously, should I wonder why he replaced veteran actors from the TOS pilots (who actually gave the impression they could play experienced doctors) with a guy (McCoy) who seemed emotionally unstable most of the time and seemed to prefer lamenting over practising?
There's really no proof that either Boyce or Piper wouldn't have turned out the exact same way if they had been cast for the weekly series.
They're all the same character, really. And IIRC, Kelly was GR's first choice ( and second) to play "the doctor". One might guess the role was written with him in mind.

I liked John Hoyt' take on the part, but Paul Fix just didn't do it for me.

Robert Comsol's conflating of actor and character is puzzling.
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