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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

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Old February 11 2014, 03:27 AM   #181
ryan123450
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

They aren't in exact chronological order. The numbering is more an intended reading order.
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Old February 11 2014, 03:58 AM   #182
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

ryan123450 wrote: View Post
They aren't in exact chronological order. The numbering is more an intended reading order.
I don't think it's even that. I think I heard once that it was more a matter of authors' scheduling. Really, the first four Typhon Pact books are all standalones, the only common thread being that they tell stories involving one or more members of the Pact -- a thematic crossover in the vein of things like Invasion! or Gateways or Section 31.
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Old February 12 2014, 05:43 AM   #183
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

^Yeah, I'm pretty sure when they came out the authors said you could read them in any order.
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Old February 15 2014, 03:43 AM   #184
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Finished "Rough Beasts of Empire". I wasn't so crazy about this one, mainly for the characterization of Sisko which I had a major problem with throughout. Also, I didn't really get Donatra's actions, either. How stupid is she to march into the enemy's den? And I also found her committing suicide to be questionable as well.

I just thought of something as well; the only African-American lead in Star Trek divorces his wife and abandons his 4 year old daughter. I think I read somewhere that Brooks wasn't happy with the ending of DS9 because he went into the Temple rather than be with his pregnant wife; this is much worse than that! Hopefully he doesn't read it Not a choice I would have made...

I've started the Picard/Shran book. No opinion so far. It's a little weird because I think I'm about 80 pages into it and there's no villain so far, and I have no idea which Typhon Pact nation is going to be the bad guy.
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Old February 15 2014, 04:01 AM   #185
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Mr Light wrote: View Post
Finished "Rough Beasts of Empire". I wasn't so crazy about this one, mainly for the characterization of Sisko which I had a major problem with throughout.
Keep in mind that RBoE is the first book in a 3-part arc that continues in Plagues of Night and Raise the Dawn. By itself, it's just the setup without the resolution. What would you think of Sisko's characterization if you'd only seen "Emissary" and not the rest of the series?


I've started the Picard/Shran book. No opinion so far. It's a little weird because I think I'm about 80 pages into it and there's no villain so far, and I have no idea which Typhon Pact nation is going to be the bad guy.
Do you mean Picard/Shar, i.e. Paths of Disharmony? Shran is Jeffrey Combs's character from Enterprise.
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Old February 15 2014, 09:04 AM   #186
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Mr Light wrote: View Post
I just thought of something as well; the only African-American lead in Star Trek divorces his wife and abandons his 4 year old daughter.
1. As Christopher said, this arc will pay off in Plagues of Night/Raise the Dawn. Have some patience.

2. It's important to understand something about Sisko's motivations: He is not abandoning Kassidy and Rebecca, he is attempting to protect them in the only way he knows how. Remember, he knows from his time in the Wormhole that the Prophets can see possible futures, and they warned him that to stay with Kassidy would lead to great suffering -- which he believes means his wife and daughter are in great danger. He doesn't want to leave them; he is doing it because he believes it is necessary.
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Old February 15 2014, 01:21 PM   #187
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

I understand the internal rationale within the story, but it just really rubs me the wrong way, and it looks bad for the franchise. I'm sure they redeem the character in future novels, but in this one story, at this point, it's bad. I'm surprised Fox News didn't have a field day with this or something
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Old February 15 2014, 01:33 PM   #188
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Mr Light wrote: View Post
Also, I didn't really get Donatra's actions, either. How stupid is she to march into the enemy's den? And I also found her committing suicide to be questionable as well.
Donatra didn't commit suicide, she was murdered by the Tzenkethi. Remember when she smacked the PADD against the wall? It was unbreakable. She couldn't have killed herself with it.
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Old February 15 2014, 02:07 PM   #189
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Did they outright say that in the book? Because they cut away from her being all sad and depressed, then they announce her suicide, and that wrap up scene with the Tzenkethi lady states that she didn't even have to do anything with Donatra or something like that.
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Old February 15 2014, 02:22 PM   #190
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

No, both of the deaths were done by the Tzenkethi. Part of the purpose of that book was to show just how subtle the schemes of the Tzenkethi were - we never even saw the Tzenkethi character, between the beginning and end, but she made it happen.
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Old February 15 2014, 02:54 PM   #191
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

Mr Light wrote: View Post
I understand the internal rationale within the story, but it just really rubs me the wrong way, and it looks bad for the franchise... in this one story, at this point, it's bad.
Why?

Sisko isn't "abandoning" Rebecca. The racist stereotype you're referencing is about black men supposedly shrugging "meh" and wandering off into the sunset because they don't care about their children and lack a sense of basic familial responsibility. That clearly doesn't describe Sisko or have anything to do with how Sisko's story unfolds in Rough Beasts. Nor do Sisko's actions - which are not those of the stereotype anyway - have anything to do with his race, nor is his skin colour/facial features of any relevance at any point.

I don't understand this argument that the book is treading on dangerous ground by having Sisko choose to sever contact with his family out of a conviction that staying will subject them to danger.
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Old February 15 2014, 03:44 PM   #192
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

And again, RBoE is not the whole story. It's act one of a three-act story.

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Old February 15 2014, 05:40 PM   #193
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

^If DRG3 had a fraction of Kirsten Beyer's talent in writing that kind of personal story then maybe this would not be coming up so often and that continuation would have been clear. If he had a fraction of Una McCormack's talent then he probably would could have been effective in his Romulan plots. If he had a fraction of Mack's talent for pacing then maybe his novels would not feel so ponderous or that he is trying to cram a 1000 page epic into aroung a quarter of that page count. If he had a fraction of CLB's vision and buy in to the optimistic future then maybe his work would not feel so soulless.

There is not anything that he does that other author's don't do a hell of a lot better.
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Old February 15 2014, 06:00 PM   #194
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

^ And this post is some bullshit right here.

DRG3 has a sense of epic scope, a talent for writing sensory and emotional detail, and a capacity for using familiar elements in amazingly unfamiliar ways that none of those authors match.

I adore Beyer, McCormack, Mack, and Bennett but you could write a similar paragraph about each of them, couldn't you?

Ahem: "If Bennett had a fraction of Beyer's ability to justify every emotional arc, or Una McCormack's facility with developing alien cultures, or a fraction of Mack's ability to write action scenes, or DRG3's graceful ability to incorporate continuity in surprising ways, then maybe his books wouldn't suck!" But that of course understates Christopher's detailed use of science, his delightful explanations of glaring canon inconsistencies, and his optimism.

Like whichever authors you like; I'm not saying you have to love DRG3. But there's a difference between "I don't like DRG3's particular strengths and weaknesses as an author" and "there is not anything he does that other authors don't do a hell of a lot better". No one else could, or would, have written Serpents Among The Ruins. Or Crucible: McCoy. Or Raise The Dawn, for that matter. And those are TrekLit classics.

Rough Beasts isn't his best, no, but it's also just a beginning. Considering Beasts / Plagues / Dawn as one story, it's one of TrekLit's most magnificent epics, and Beasts has all the setup that makes the other two possible.
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Old February 15 2014, 06:17 PM   #195
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Re: The Past Decade of Trek Lit

j3067 wrote: View Post
^If DRG3 had a fraction of Kirsten Beyer's talent in writing that kind of personal story then maybe this would not be coming up so often and that continuation would have been clear.
Go back and read the comments made when RBoE first came out, and you'll see that to many readers, myself included, it was clear at the time that the book represented the beginning of a new arc -- that it was parallelling "Emissary," starting a new character journey for Sisko by putting him in a dark place like where he'd been in the series pilot. I mean, this was the first DS9 novel set in the post-Destiny era, so it was pretty clear to me that it was intended as the beginning of a new storyline. I've never understood the reactions of readers who assumed it was the end of Sisko's journey or something. Why would they bring DS9 back for only one book?
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