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Old January 30 2014, 05:26 PM   #271
Christopher
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

As I said before, there is a real difference between filling a similar niche and simply being a copy. It's not that the original/current Daredevil is exactly like Spider-Man, because of course he isn't. It's more like they share a subgenre, a style of storytelling. Like how Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Supernatural are both shows about wisecracking demon-fighters, but one is by no means a copy of the other. So nobody here is proposing a "ripoff."

And the Chitauri were not created for the Avengers movie. They're the equivalent of the Skrulls in the Ultimate Marvel Universe in the comics.
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Old January 30 2014, 05:35 PM   #272
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

If you approach it with the idea of "Oh, let's make him like Spider-Man because Spider-Man doesn't exist and nobody will notice" then it's just lazy copying. What Daredevil's known for and became famous for isn't goofy, swashbuckling antics. That doesn't mean he has to be relentlessly grim and humorless though or that there can't be any of that, think more Angel since we're using Buffyverse metaphors.
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Old January 30 2014, 06:25 PM   #273
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Kestrel wrote: View Post
If you approach it with the idea of "Oh, let's make him like Spider-Man because Spider-Man doesn't exist and nobody will notice" then it's just lazy copying.
But that's absolutely not what I'm proposing, as I've explained repeatedly. I'm saying that he could fill a similar niche in his own way. Like how, say, Spock and Data filled a similar niche in their respective Star Trek series, as the scientific genius and the outside observer of humanity, but were nonetheless extremely distinct characters. A character can fill a similar role and purpose without being a copy or ripoff in any way.

What Daredevil's known for and became famous for isn't goofy, swashbuckling antics.
Not in his Frank Miller heyday, no. But you don't call a character "Daredevil" if you don't want him to be a carefree swashbuckler, and that's what Stan Lee and Bill Everett's original version of the character was. And it's a quality that Mark Waid has brought back to the character in recent years, without losing the baggage and impact of that darker phase the character went through, because now DD's more upbeat behavior is a way of coping with that past tragedy, of trying to reinvent himself.

And Waid's take on the character has been very successful. I was never a reader of DD's comics before, but I've followed Waid's run with considerable interest. This is what Daredevil is known for to the contemporary comics audience. And screen adaptations often draw their lead from where things currently are in the source material, or at least have been relatively recently -- which is why so many Marvel movies draw on elements of the Ultimate universe, or why the 1990 TV version of Barry Allen's Flash had a number of qualities and characters in common with Wally West's Flash.

Of course, the creators of a TV or film adaptation of a comic don't just copy a single era; they distill what they consider the best or most viable ideas from throughout the character's history and synthesize them into a new whole. I expect them to draw on what Frank Miller did with Daredevil, undoubtedly, but I'm hoping they will synthesize it with elements of the Waid interpretation that's brought such freshness and life to the character.
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Old January 30 2014, 09:37 PM   #274
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

No one is proposing that, Kestrel.
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Old January 30 2014, 10:00 PM   #275
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Christopher wrote: View Post
And it's a quality that Mark Waid has brought back to the character in recent years, without losing the baggage and impact of that darker phase the character went through, because now DD's more upbeat behavior is a way of coping with that past tragedy, of trying to reinvent himself.

I expect them to draw on what Frank Miller did with Daredevil, undoubtedly, but I'm hoping they will synthesize it with elements of the Waid interpretation that's brought such freshness and life to the character.
As you note though, for the comics Waid's building on years of history and baggage, where a TV show wouldn't have the time to do that necessarily. I think we're in basic agreement though in wanting to see some synthesis, you're just arguing more heavily for Waid's take and I hope they take more cues from Miller.

Actually... the nearest analogue to what I'd like to see is Arrow without the island segments, which is funny because there's a lot of Nolan's Batman movies there, and I've always thought Daredevil's closest counterpart in comics was Batman without the money.
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Old January 30 2014, 10:54 PM   #276
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Kestrel wrote: View Post
As you note though, for the comics Waid's building on years of history and baggage, where a TV show wouldn't have the time to do that necessarily.
There might be a way. It wouldn't be the first time a series' lead started out with a dark past that they were trying to move beyond, with that past revealed gradually through flashback and exposition. Xena did that, and so has Arrow, more gradually.

Or maybe there's a way to balance both approaches. Give DD the tragedies he's gone through in the comics, but have him resolve sooner to rise above them rather than wallowing in unending despair for years on end. That way there'd be a more direct and ongoing struggle between his commitment to optimism and the circumstances conspiring to destroy it.


I think we're in basic agreement though in wanting to see some synthesis, you're just arguing more heavily for Waid's take and I hope they take more cues from Miller.
That's partly just because of the name -- as I said, I don't think the name "Daredevil, The Man Without Fear" is consistent with someone wallowing in angst and despair. Someone called Daredevil should be bold, confident, scoffing at risk.

Plus I'm not a fan of relentlessly depressing TV shows. There was a time when darkness was bold because it was unusual, but then everyone jumped on the "dark = sophisticated" bandwagon and now it's become ubiquitous and cliched. Which is why I find Waid's approach so appealing -- because he's actually doing something fresh rather than just conforming to the fashion.


...and I've always thought Daredevil's closest counterpart in comics was Batman without the money.
Actually it's kind of the other way around. The modern view of Batman is defined mainly by Miller's seminal work on the character in The Dark Knight Returns and Batman: Year One -- and Miller did those after his work on Daredevil, and indeed probably got those gigs on the strength of that work. So the similarities between the modern Batman and the "definitive" Daredevil are not at all accidental.
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Old January 31 2014, 02:00 AM   #277
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Kestrel wrote: View Post
If you approach it with the idea of "Oh, let's make him like Spider-Man because Spider-Man doesn't exist and nobody will notice" then it's just lazy copying. What Daredevil's known for and became famous for isn't goofy, swashbuckling antics. That doesn't mean he has to be relentlessly grim and humorless though or that there can't be any of that, think more Angel since we're using Buffyverse metaphors.
I wasn't talking about changing the character in my post. All I meant was if you want to tell a story about a billionaire vigilate who uses gadgets and don't have Batman, then it makes sense to use Green Arrow instead.
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Old January 31 2014, 03:08 AM   #278
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Come to think of it, if they did take a Frank Milleresque approach to Daredevil, the general audience would probably think they were copying Batman -- or Arrow. So that could be an advantage to incorporating a more Waid-like tone.
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Old January 31 2014, 04:11 AM   #279
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

What about my point about maintaining tone between the four series? Surely you agree that Jessica Jones won't be lighthearted.
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Old January 31 2014, 04:49 AM   #280
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Thor and The Incredible Hulk didn't have the same tone. The Avengers worked out pretty well.
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Old January 31 2014, 05:07 AM   #281
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
What about my point about maintaining tone between the four series? Surely you agree that Jessica Jones won't be lighthearted.
Why would you want all four series to have the same tone? Wouldn't that be redundant? If you've got four different shows, then they should be different. They should complement one another. If one goes unusually dark, there should be a lighter one to provide balance and relief.

I mean, it's not as if Daredevil is an out-and-out comedy character. In Waid's interpretation, he's a man who's been through several different hells and come out the other side, and has chosen to define himself by the latter rather than the former, to use optimism as a source of strength and a defense against despair. I have no problem seeing such a character sharing a universe with a different character whose life is in a darker place.
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Old February 26 2014, 06:41 PM   #282
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Latest news:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...ticle&id=51126

The Netflix miniseries will all be filmed in New York City. That's great news. NYC is so important to the Marvel universe, but it's been kind of underrepresented in the MCU so far except for portions of The Incredible Hulk and The Avengers. And these four characters are all based in NYC, so it'd be a shame if they faked the city with some other location.

I'd say this will make the Marvel Netflix shows the largest shared TV universe set and shot in NYC since the Law & Order franchise.
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Old February 26 2014, 08:15 PM   #283
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Christopher wrote: View Post
Latest news:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?p...ticle&id=51126

The Netflix miniseries will all be filmed in New York City. That's great news. NYC is so important to the Marvel universe, but it's been kind of underrepresented in the MCU so far except for portions of The Incredible Hulk and The Avengers.
And the Stark Expo in Iron Man 2, and the first act and final scene (not the stinger) of Captain America: The First Avenger.
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Old February 26 2014, 08:34 PM   #284
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

Glad to see filming begins this summer. This is getting closer to reality.

So, will they hire anyone we've heard of to play Daredevil?
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Old February 26 2014, 11:53 PM   #285
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Re: Marvel Studios may be planning more MCU for the small screen

I'm guessing it'll be a potpourri of casting for the leads and main support casts for these Netflix series.

Not too unlike the films. RDJ, Chris Evans, SLJ, Scar Jo, Anthony Hopkins, Natalie Portman...yep heard of those people. Well known. Chris Hemsworth, Jaime Alexander, Tom Hiddleston, Sebastain Stan, Clark Gregg at the time were not known, known to a few and now are household name. Stan really will be after Winter Soldier opens.

I suspect the TV casting will be similar.
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