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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old January 23 2014, 03:51 PM   #2101
trekker670
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

MakeshiftPython wrote: View Post
Given that the Okudas and Dan Curry were involved in the remastering of S2, I'm surprised they were content with what HTV was churning out. How involved were they though? You'd think with them looking over the project, especially Dan Curry, that the effects would at least be more than "acceptable".
A lot of times having someone so close to the project managing it actually damages the final product, rather than help it. I'm not saying that's the case here, but I recall when S2 first came out a lot of people were saying that many of the flaws were a tell of Dan Curry's involvement. He and Lagato had two distinct styles when it came the the SFX, but with Curry's involvement in the remaster, his style began to bleed into Lagato's episodes. That was the claim when the season came out, as to whether it's true or not is anyone's guess.
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Old January 23 2014, 04:57 PM   #2102
SpHeRe31459
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Location: Sacramento, CA
Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Start Wreck wrote: View Post
HTV's mistakes were all VFX-related. The pure live-action footage in TNG Season 2 looks excellent.

I'm not overly familiar with the X-Files, but are there any comparable FX shots that demonstrate what they've learned since then?
Well that's the thing, the X-Files is more like a 90's sitcom or drama. AFAIK, it didn't make extensive use of bluescreen inserts and of course didn't have multipass shots of models that need to be correctly re-composited. I believe most things were done in camera. So for HTV they should have a much easier time, they mostly just get to do film scanning, episode conforming, and then recreating the opening/closing titles/credits.
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Old January 23 2014, 06:19 PM   #2103
MickJo1701
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Not too long ago I (attempted) to clean up some of the shots from Season 2 to make them fit in with how CBS D would have done them. Not the greatest in Photoshop but I had a go .

http://imageshack.com/a/img839/9319/jxs5.jpg

http://imageshack.com/a/img811/8311/4rif.jpg
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Old January 23 2014, 09:53 PM   #2104
Hober Mallow
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Start Wreck wrote: View Post
HTV's mistakes were all VFX-related.
Except for when they used incorrect live-action shots.

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Old January 23 2014, 09:59 PM   #2105
M
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

MickJo1701 wrote: View Post
Not too long ago I (attempted) to clean up some of the shots from Season 2 to make them fit in with how CBS D would have done them. Not the greatest in Photoshop but I had a go .

http://imageshack.com/a/img839/9319/jxs5.jpg

http://imageshack.com/a/img811/8311/4rif.jpg
You know, these are actually rather good in illustrating what can be done in post processing. I like your versions better, even though the contrast on the Borg cube is a little too harsh.
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Old January 23 2014, 10:25 PM   #2106
MakeshiftPython
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
Start Wreck wrote: View Post
HTV's mistakes were all VFX-related.
Except for when they used incorrect live-action shots.

Wasn't that only "Q Who"? I know they did use alternate takes for the extended version of "The Measure of a Man", though I think that's because they were using the takes that were used on that VHS cut.
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Old January 23 2014, 10:29 PM   #2107
Harvey
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

I thought someone uncovered another episode where they messed up, too?

(Or perhaps it was from a different season where the wrong live action footage was used?)
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Old January 24 2014, 04:15 AM   #2108
Beta-Z
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Start Wreck wrote: View Post

I'm not overly familiar with the X-Files, but are there any comparable FX shots that demonstrate what they've learned since then?
Haven't seen shots of that, but they're not touching these anyway.
FOX ordered that all FX material is only being UPSCALED from SD for the entire series.
Same thing happened to the show "Firefly" in HD.
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Old January 24 2014, 04:26 AM   #2109
Hober Mallow
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

I seem to recall some really shitty CGI on XF.
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Old January 30 2014, 11:55 PM   #2110
trevanian
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

XF had occasional bad shots, but a lot of the VFX is of the invisible variety, where you don't even know there are VFX.
The 2nd season ender, in a quarry kind of location, looks like it is all red dirt, but according to what I read in CFQ at the time, the color is all a post process (which really blew my mind, because I can usually spot stuff.)

I think there's probably a lot of VFX on XF, which is one reason they decided to just upscale rather than have to spend serious bread.
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Old January 31 2014, 12:17 AM   #2111
Harvey
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

There might have been some post-processing in "Anasazi," but they also painted the rocks to get the red tint. You can actually see where the paint stops and the actual color of the ground begins in one or two shots.
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Old January 31 2014, 01:01 AM   #2112
tomswift2002
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

[QUOTE=jimbotron;9155389]
GNDN wrote: View Post
Peak Performance was pretty good, but the effects remastering was bad.

The deflector dish was noticeably misaligned, and they forgot to light the nacelles.

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x...nce_hd_377.jpg
Not to mention, but that Enterprise looks like a pretty poor CGI model. I can see a few bumps and rough spots on the Ferengi craft, and just by the light you can tell that the Ferengi ship is the original model and real, and the Stargazer looks to be the original model---but that Enterprise looks like something out of a Nintendo 64 game, it is so plasticky looking.
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Old January 31 2014, 03:38 AM   #2113
Maxwell Everett
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

[QUOTE=tomswift2002;9187453]
jimbotron wrote: View Post
GNDN wrote: View Post
Peak Performance was pretty good, but the effects remastering was bad.

The deflector dish was noticeably misaligned, and they forgot to light the nacelles.

http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/albums/2x...nce_hd_377.jpg
Not to mention, but that Enterprise looks like a pretty poor CGI model. I can see a few bumps and rough spots on the Ferengi craft, and just by the light you can tell that the Ferengi ship is the original model and real, and the Stargazer looks to be the original model---but that Enterprise looks like something out of a Nintendo 64 game, it is so plasticky looking.
Pretty sure that's the ILM six-foot filming miniature. A CG model wouldn't have misaligned or missing passes or a gap on the underside of the engineering hull where a panel has been clearly popped off and a mounting arm secured! You can see what I'm talking about here.
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Old January 31 2014, 06:37 AM   #2114
trevanian
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Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

Problem with the 6ft model is that unless you had the lighting EXACTLY right to highlight the little bumps, it could look like a frisbee. So there are plenty of shots I remember of it looking bad (along with a number that were fine, or as good as you could make that ugly PoS look given its lines.)

Another prob on occasion (and I remember this with guest ships, like the vessel in THE WOUNDED) is when they'd either speed up a shot in post or record it at 30fps instead of 24 (I think that was a Dan Curry thing, never Legato.) The vessel takes on that Telenovela look that screamed (and to me still screams) 'video/cg' ... in essence it is taking a decent model shot and making it look like a cartoon (which also happened sometimes with features ... there's a shot of the X-jet in hanger in the first X-MEN that featured a nice miniature jet, but the scanning and compositing were done in such a way that it just LOOKED like mediocre CGI.)
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Old January 31 2014, 07:34 AM   #2115
SpHeRe31459
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Location: Sacramento, CA
Re: Season TWO OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

trevanian wrote: View Post
Problem with the 6ft model is that unless you had the lighting EXACTLY right to highlight the little bumps, it could look like a frisbee. So there are plenty of shots I remember of it looking bad (along with a number that were fine, or as good as you could make that ugly PoS look given its lines.)
Right so that combined with HTV's awful re-compositing/lighting (or rather lack of scene integrating lighting), makes it look all the more fake, even though it's the real model.
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