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View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
A+ 28 11.16%
A 53 21.12%
A- 46 18.33%
B+ 25 9.96%
B 27 10.76%
B- 11 4.38%
C+ 13 5.18%
C 12 4.78%
C- 9 3.59%
D+ 8 3.19%
D 10 3.98%
D- 5 1.99%
F 4 1.59%
Voters: 251. You may not vote on this poll

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Old January 4 2014, 08:44 PM   #1591
AllStarEntprise
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

OdoWanKenobi wrote: View Post
The reason that Clark's disguise is so effective has been explained time and time again in the comics. First, it's not just glasses and a hairdo change. He wears clothes that are too big, changes his posture, and raises his voice an octave. Plus, there's the biggest thing: People don't even think that Superman has a secret identity. He has the powers of (to them) a god, and he doesn't wear a mask. To most people, he's just Superman. Someone sees Clark Kent, and they don't see Superman with glasses, because they're just not looking.
Gaith wrote: View Post
^ There's no need to condescend. Fanwank comic explanations are still fanwank contrivances, and prior comics are not synonymous with Snyder's movies.

@DWF: Tell that to any celebrity - including Cavill himself - who walks down the street in NYC and is recognized multiple times per hour, if not block, but only if you don't mind being laughed at. This is gonna fool very, very few people in any reality resembling our own.
Hey lets play a game!
It's called "Search and Find: Secret Identity Edition"

Here we have Captain America/Human Torch/Chris Evans


Face from the A Team/Rocket Raccoon/ Bradley Cooper


Spider-Man/Andrew Garfield


The Wolverine/Hugh Jackman


Rachel Dawes (from TDK)/Maggie Gyllenhaal


Oh look it's Sherlock/Khan/Benedict Cumberbatch. He must be on a case to find Moriarty.


FOUND HIM Jim Moriarty/Andrew Scott


Loki/ Tom Hiddleston


Dr. Horrible/NPH


Is that the Doctor?!
Tenth Doctor/Hamlet/David Tennant


Photos of Chris Evans, Maggie Gylaanhal, Andrew Garfield, Hugh Jackman, Neil Patrick Harris taken in NYC.

Photos of Benedict Cumberbatch, David Tennant, Tom Hiddleston, Andrew Scott taken in the UK.

If you didn't know who these actors were or if you didn't take the time to look closely; you probably would not recognize them I think most people would pass by them completely unaware. Supes disguises probably works under the same principle. People don't expect to find Superman walking among us. They watch the skies hoping for a glimpse of him. No one is watching Clark suspecting he might be Superman. Just like no one suspected billionaire Bruce Wayne to be the Batman.

"PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN"

Last edited by AllStarEntprise; January 4 2014 at 09:37 PM.
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Old January 4 2014, 08:59 PM   #1592
Gaith
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

When it comes to these guys at least...

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post

Spider-Man/Andrew Garfield


The Wolverine/Hugh Jackman


Rachel Dawes (from TDK)/Maggie Gyllenhaal


Oh look it's Sherlock/Khan/Benedict Cumberbatch. He must be on a case to find Moriarty.




Loki/ Tom Hiddleston


Dr. Horrible/NPH




If you didn't know who these actors were or if you didnt take the time to look closely.
That's not really a sentence, but if you're saying I wouldn't recognize the above actors, bullshit, especially without the beards and shades (which I doubt we'll see Supes put on in public onscreen), and that's just from single 2D images. Even Jackman is totally recognizable there.


AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
Aside from the last picture all of the others were taken in NYC.
Wrong again; Cumberbatch, Scott and Hiddleston are all on the London tube there along with Tennant. The cushioned seats, small cars, and colored poles are your first clues.


AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
I think most people would pass by them completely unaware. Supes disguise probably works under the same principle. People don't expect to find Superman walking among us.
If Supes were real and had torn up Metropolis like that, you're damn right people would expect to see him around. Manhattan folks expect to see famous people all the time; a friend of mine chatted up Angelina Jolie a few months ago.


AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
Just like no one suspected billionaire Bruce Wayne to be the Batman.
Also laughably unbelievable. In Batman Begins, his obviously super-expensive car was being chased by multiple police as he rushed home to cure Rachel, thereby pointing a big-ass public arrow in the likeliest direction of his house... and that's just one of many examples.
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Old January 4 2014, 09:02 PM   #1593
suarezguy
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Warped9 wrote: View Post
One thing that made sense to me (from what we saw of it) was making Lois smart enough to figure out who Clark was from the beginning. This got around the hoary old idea that has long lost any credibility whatsoever that him simply donning glasses (and maybe combing his hair a bit differntly) could fool her into beleiving Clark and Superman were two separate individuals. They got that out of the way.
While I liked it myself, what will that say about everyone else, especially the other journalists, who get to know Clark in the sequels?

Although Jackman, particularly with that grin, is the only celeb posted I'd recognize.

Warped9 wrote: View Post
This Superman is facing a huge unforseen challenge before he's actually decided to be Superman and establish himself. It all comes to a head before he's even really figured everything out for himself.
There didn't seem to be much reason to be so hesitant, though (aside from his childhood, which if it's that important was underdeveloped), especially with Jor-El so confidently pushing him to be a hero/example.
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Old January 4 2014, 09:30 PM   #1594
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Gaith wrote: View Post
When it comes to these guys at least...

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post

Spider-Man/Andrew Garfield


The Wolverine/Hugh Jackman


Rachel Dawes (from TDK)/Maggie Gyllenhaal


Oh look it's Sherlock/Khan/Benedict Cumberbatch. He must be on a case to find Moriarty.




Loki/ Tom Hiddleston


Dr. Horrible/NPH




If you didn't know who these actors were or if you didnt take the time to look closely.
That's not really a sentence, but if you're saying I wouldn't recognize the above actors, bullshit, especially without the beards and shades (which I doubt we'll see Supes put on in public onscreen), and that's just from single 2D images. Even Jackman is totally recognizable there.
^ You're right. i had a thought in my head and I didn't translate it very well as I was compiling the images.

Well all of these actors have been seen by the masses in multiple movies (cinema and home video) and tv projects. Superman was fighting and flying all around the city and in the space. I doubt many people saw his face and formed a lasting impression of it.


Gaith wrote: View Post
AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
I think most people would pass by them completely unaware. Supes disguise probably works under the same principle. People don't expect to find Superman walking among us.
If Supes were real and had torn up Metropolis like that, you're damn right people would expect to see him around. Manhattan folks expect to see famous people all the time; a friend of mine chatted up Angelina Jolie a few months ago.
How many Metropolis citizens actually saw Superman close enough to get a lastly impression of him? Not many. I didn't see any news crews or people taking photos. So at present, Superman can only be identified by the military members who worked with him and a dozen or so people in Metropolis who actually saw Supeman when he wasn't fliying around battling Zod at super speeds.
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Old January 4 2014, 10:52 PM   #1595
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Gaith wrote: View Post
^ There's no need to condescend. Fanwank comic explanations are still fanwank contrivances, and prior comics are not synonymous with Snyder's movies.
It wasn't my intent to come off as condescending. I was merely trying to add to the discussion. Apologies.
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Old January 4 2014, 11:15 PM   #1596
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

^ No worries. I got a bit carried away also.

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
How many Metropolis citizens actually saw Superman close enough to get a lastly impression of him? Not many. I didn't see any news crews or people taking photos. So at present, Superman can only be identified by the military members who worked with him and a dozen or so people in Metropolis who actually saw Supeman when he wasn't fliying around battling Zod at super speeds.
Okay, fair point, but especially after all the carnage in Metropolis, surely people worldwide will demand Superman give a public interview and show his face? Even if Clark isn't particularly at risk for recognition at the end of MOS, that can't possibly last.
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Old January 4 2014, 11:38 PM   #1597
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Velma from Scooby Doo has something to say about comic books and secret identity logic. Lol

You can stop watching at 0:53



Enjoy
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Old January 4 2014, 11:46 PM   #1598
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

You have to roll with secret identity thing in these types of movies. Besides, Superman's secret identity is the least of Man of Steel's problems.
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Old January 5 2014, 01:00 AM   #1599
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Dream wrote: View Post
You have to roll with secret identity thing in these types of movies. Besides, Superman's secret identity is the least of Man of Steel's problems.
It depends on the character, I think. Absurd as they may be, the anonymity of Batman and Arrow's "The Arrow" don't really bother me because being brooding rogue operators are key to their very personalities. Likewise, Peter Parker's a misfit and an underdog, so it makes sense for him thematically to keep a low profile and not glory in the celebrity of his abilities like Iron Man does, even if he does things in the movies that really should have outed him (like shattering the basketball backboard and bending the football goal in ASM).

With Superman, though, he's just so damn powerful and flamboyant (he goes by a name with "super" in it and wears a flowing red cape, for Pete's sake) that his whole mild-mannered identity thing just strikes me as tangential to his super-work at best and hypocritical at worst. He stands for "truth [and] justice" but hides from the public. He could topple a government each night, but writes newspaper stories instead of helping clear war zones of weapons, and building homes for disaster-stricken refugees? I'm not saying he doesn't deserve any time off or any privacy, but holding a newspaper job doesn't strike me as the way to go. Just my two cents.
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Old January 5 2014, 03:01 AM   #1600
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Well, also, no one ever really sees Spider-Man's or Batman's face. Superman on the other hand ...
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Old January 6 2014, 07:10 PM   #1601
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

Yeah I have to admit, in today's day and age it's really hard to imagine a superhero keeping his identity a secret for very long. Even the masked ones like Batman or Spider-Man would probably be tracked down and figured out pretty quickly, once the media or feds decided to put all their attention and resources on it.
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Old January 6 2014, 07:28 PM   #1602
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

It has to be said that fooling the public in general, strangers with whom you would have limited contact, and fooling someone you work closely with day in and out are different things.

There have been and continue to be people who lead double lives and people close to them are often none the wiser to it. That said those leading those double lives are trying to remain unnoticed and out of sight. That doesn't apply to a superhero who by nature will inevitably come into contact with the public.

A disguise does go beyond mere appearance. For Batman, he operates mostly at night in the shadows and usually ill lighted environments. His other disguise is making certain the Bruce Wayne persona comes across as mostly self-centred and highly unlikely as someone willing to inconvenience himself and certainly not to the extent of endangering himself for the sake of others.

Spider-Man's persona is supposed to be quite different than Peter Parker. Parker is a socially awkward nerd while Spidey is a confident, wise-cracking extrovert. The full face mask doesn't hurt either.

Superman basically hides out in the open. The Clark persona isn't be that different from Peter Parker's other than Clark being a good reporter. Clark just needs to come across as one of the last people who could bring himself to be openly brave and capable. Now that could cut it with most, but not likely with someone like Lois with whom he has a lot of contact with. That's why I think it works in MOS that they got that element out of the way.
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Old January 6 2014, 07:53 PM   #1603
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

I once took a bus downtown. I got on and took a seat near the back in an isle facing seat. One other person was there when I got on, across from me in the first forward facing seats after the aisle facing seats opposite me. We exchanged friendly greetings but I could tell he wasn't interested in small talk so I just minded my own business along the trip.

About a block away from my stop I pulled the notification cord and started gathering my things to exit. A casual glance his way caught him in a very stark profile and I froze - after a moment of my mind racing he noticed I was staring and looked straight at me and then my suspicion was confirmed. "You're... You're..." I stammered, not remembering his real name. Emotion totally took over, a great gushing of admiration swelled in me, I was about to shout out alerting everyone on board to whom we were in the presence of but I still couldn't remember his name. Then, as if sensing my imminent outpouring about to blow his cover, he put his finger over his lips and quietly shushed me. Suddenly feeling conspiratorial, knowing something no one else on the bus knew I began feeling I had been made a confidant & composure took over. Still not able to remember his name I finally whispered the end of the sentence hanging on the tip of my tongue for the last few incredible moments


He nodded and got up extending his hand for a shake, which I did. I just stood there smiling at him, hadn't noticed the bus had stopped. "I think this is your stop." he said in character voice. I somehow managed to pull myself away and stumble off the bus left with a memory of a lifetime.
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Old January 6 2014, 08:13 PM   #1604
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

In our lives we can notice a lot of people can look very much alike. And a person's appearance can change drastically in our perceprions simply by changing attire, hairstyle and general demeanor.
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Old January 6 2014, 08:31 PM   #1605
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Re: MAN OF STEEL - Grading & Discussion

For me, ultimately, it's just willing suspension of disbelief. I agree with those who say that in our world, eventually Clark Kent or Bruce Wayne would be outed as the alter-ego of Superman or Batman. But ultimately, I don't really care, so long as the film is immersive enough for me to put aside niggles like that.
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