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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old November 19 2013, 12:28 PM   #91
teacake
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post
so why I people insisting that they make straight characters gay.
Because it is fun.

Really, the point of all fandom.
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Old November 19 2013, 12:44 PM   #92
Malaika
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post
Malakia probably thinks uhura and spock are the real true love because they are an interracial couple and because she is black . She is obviously rooting for the black female character to get the guy. this is what happens when we push our own beliefs on a pairing simply because it reflects our own life. we become blindly bias and ignorant.
Either I'm experiencing an example of "deja vu" here or you and serenitytrek1 are twins

So, again, did I miss something here? because I don't think we know each other nor I showed you pictures of me.
If I did then you'd notice, unless you were blind, that I look like a typical european gal (guess why). Using your "logic" I should be rooting for Carol/Spock.
Anyway, even if I was black (the fact that I'm whiter than Edward Cullen only adds to the irony of the whole thing here) I don't see how this can remotely be your business and relevant to the topic.

I don't get what being white, yellow, black or blue like Neytiri has anything to do with our opinions here and the fact that you (keep?) bringing this stuff up and attacking me says more about you as a person than me, frankly.
I don't know what's you problem but a lot of star trek fans are people of color so yes, a lot of the Uhura fans and S/U fans might be black and frankly your remark does hide some racist passive aggressive bulls**t here.

This is just a star trek fanboard where people are simply sharing their opinions about that weird thing called fiction
we aren't here to be play the patients of your Sigmund Freud role playing. Thanks but no thanks.
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Old November 19 2013, 01:21 PM   #93
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Malaika wrote: View Post
Cara007 wrote: View Post
Malakia probably thinks uhura and spock are the real true love because they are an interracial couple and because she is black . She is obviously rooting for the black female character to get the guy. this is what happens when we push our own beliefs on a pairing simply because it reflects our own life. we become blindly bias and ignorant.
Either I'm experiencing an example of "deja vu" here or you and serenitytrek1 are twins

So, again, did I miss something here? because I don't think we know each other nor I showed you pictures of me.
If I did then you'd notice, unless you were blind, that I look like a typical european gal (guess why). Using your "logic" I should be rooting for Carol/Spock.
Anyway, even if I was black (the fact that I'm whiter than Edward Cullen only adds to the irony of the whole thing here) I don't see how this can remotely be your business and relevant to the topic.

I don't get what being white, yellow, black or blue like Neytiri has anything to do with our opinions here and the fact that you (keep?) bringing this stuff up and attacking me says more about you as a person than me, frankly.
I don't know what's you problem but a lot of star trek fans are people of color so yes, a lot of the Uhura fans and S/U fans might be black and frankly your remark does hide some racist passive aggressive bulls**t here.

This is just a star trek fanboard where people are simply sharing their opinions about that weird thing called fiction
we aren't here to be play the patients of your Sigmund Freud role playing. Thanks but no thanks.

Who is serenitytrek1?

No. I am new here.

I simply clicked on your name and read your past posts. In one of your past posts, you said you were black. So I put two and two together . How mad are you going to get if Spock leaves Uhura for a white girl?

A lot of the time black female fans tend to ship the black female character with the white guy by default. They also hate on the white female character just like slash fans hate on the heterosexual paring. I have seen this pattern way too much on Tumblr and in fan fictions.


What is racist is for black female fans to ship uhura/spock simply because she is black. Just like it is racist for white female fans not wanting uhura with spock because she is black.

Last edited by Cara007; November 19 2013 at 02:08 PM.
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Old November 19 2013, 02:24 PM   #94
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I don't think we should be discussing or speculating on poster's race unless the poster wants to bring it up in context to a discussion.
Really, we all need to be careful not to veer into not making personal attacks. I know I've had to reign myself in and be as nice as I can even when I get emotional about things.
Yes, the majority of fic couples are straight. That's a big part of why slash was invented, to fill a void. There are very very few gay couples to root for in fiction. Is it that hard to understand why a gay man would want to root for gay couples? If they aren't being created offically, then some people will recreate the text, in an imaginary way, to please themselves. Who does that hurt, besides fictional people? They can deal with it.
I ship Picard/Beverly, Riker/Troi, Janway/Chakotay, and in Trek lit, Calhoune/Shelby. There are no canon gay male couples to ship, so I will follow slash too. That doesn't mean I don't understand the difference between slash and fan fic and the "Real" canon version.
Sorry to continue to go OT with this (in the thread I started even!) but I needed to get that off my chest. If anybody feels the need to continue this, let's start a new thread somewhere else.
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Old November 19 2013, 03:21 PM   #95
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

borgboy wrote: View Post
I don't think we should be discussing or speculating on poster's race unless the poster wants to bring it up in context to a discussion.
Really, we all need to be careful not to veer into not making personal attacks. I know I've had to reign myself in and be as nice as I can even when I get emotional about things.
Yes, the majority of fic couples are straight. That's a big part of why slash was invented, to fill a void. There are very very few gay couples to root for in fiction. Is it that hard to understand why a gay man would want to root for gay couples? If they aren't being created offically, then some people will recreate the text, in an imaginary way, to please themselves. Who does that hurt, besides fictional people? They can deal with it.
I ship Picard/Beverly, Riker/Troi, Janway/Chakotay, and in Trek lit, Calhoune/Shelby. There are no canon gay male couples to ship, so I will follow slash too. That doesn't mean I don't understand the difference between slash and fan fic and the "Real" canon version.
Sorry to continue to go OT with this (in the thread I started even!) but I needed to get that off my chest. If anybody feels the need to continue this, let's start a new thread somewhere else.

I agree as well , we should not bring characters race but sometimes this things matter. A lot of people are driven by their race ad sexuality to do things. Last Year I went on an answer site and the question was: Are spock and uhura married?

you would not have believe the answer. It was so upsetting and derogatory. the answer was No Spock does not marry N word people.

I believe that answer brought a lot of complains and the administrator had to take it down. the answer now is No they are not married.

Sometimes all this things can get out of hand. I have witness hate and racism from both sides.

I am just trying to find a common balance for all. which is why I rather have a gay couple like willow/tera than a slash couple like kirk and spock since Spock is already in a romantic relationship with uhura and Kirk likes having sex with lots of girls. there is no need for them to be a gay couple it wont fit their characters.

You know my opinion on slash. I do not like it however not once will I ever call you a [objectionable slur for "gay man" redacted] or say no kirk and spock are not [objectionable slur for "gay man" redacted]s. No human being deserves that kind of insult and derogatory attack regardless of how they live their life.

Now back to Chapel. Yes chapel can appear in the 3rd film but I doubt anything can come off it, The film already has too many characters and so much is going on in this new trek films.

Last edited by M'Sharak; November 19 2013 at 04:19 PM. Reason: unacceptable terminology
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Old November 19 2013, 03:41 PM   #96
Malaika
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post


Who is serenitytrek1?
No. I am new here.
no need to justify yourself, we know you're new here as you have a different nickname and posting with two nicknames would be against the rules, right?
still, sometimes deja vu are so powerful they're impossible to ignore....


I clicked on your name and read your past posts. In one of your past posts, you said you were black.
Did you seriously read 114 posts? out of curiosity did you do that for everyone or I'm the lucky one?

well, sorry but I don't remember ever saying that, if I did that it would be a lie.
Perhaps you assumed it from a comment where I was talking about the racial issues related to characters like Uhura that made it impossible in the 60s to have a pair like S/U and thus I was pointing up the lack of intersectionality in some stereotyped feminist arguments that wrongly claim that Uhura is reduced to a love interest.
Maybe you think, by default, that a person gotta be black to acknowledge racial issues or appreciate a character like Uhura and interracial relationships. I'm sorry to burst your bubble here, but Uhura and S/U do have a lot of fans that are not poc. Just like white couples do have a lot of fans that aren't necessarily white. In the same way, you don't need to be gay to appreciate fictional same sex relationships.

and as a matter of fact that's none of your business anyway. The only reason I replied to your personal attack is because of the irony of you assuming that I look like Uhura. (I mean, thank you lmao)
Using your logic I should ship Carol/Spock or - on the tos side - Spock/Chapel. Thank you for enlightening me about what should be my preferences. I could never realize that by myself..



So I put two and two together. How mad are you going to get if Spock leaves Uhura for a white girl?
LOL no more mad than those who are already pissed off he got one girlfriend, to begin with. It would be amusing for sure to watch some people's reaction upon discovering that Spock is giving Kirk a run for his money and he gets all the girls

A lot of the time black female fans tend to ship the black female character with the white guy by default. They also hate on the white female character just like slash fans hate on the heterosexual paring. I have seen this pattern too much on Tumblr and in fan fictions.

so according to you every Uhura fan must be a black girl who sides with her by default and not just because, idk, they just like her and like an existing canon couple and have opinions like you?
well, who I'm to change such a logical belief anyway? just please picture me like Zoe Saldana if you can

So, what are the psycological reasons behind YOUR opinions and biases, then?


on a serious note and jokes aside
You're making a lot of generalizations you're not entitled to make and you're saying a lot of judgmental bulls**t about fans that happen to be people of color and that they surely don't have to justify themselves to you. It's baffling how you don't seem to realize how inappropriate the tone of your comments is and how all the more offensive it could have been if I actually was a black woman and how offensive it can be for the poc lurking this site.
Who the heck you think you are?
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Old November 19 2013, 03:44 PM   #97
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Cara007 wrote: View Post

I am just trying to find a common balance for all. which is why I rather have a gay couple like willow/tera than a slash couple like kirk and spock since Spock is already in a romantic relationship with uhura and Kirk likes having sex with lots of girls. there is no need for them to be a gay couple it wont fit their characters.

You know my opinion on slash. I do not like it however not once will I ever call you a [objectionable slur for "gay man" redacted] or say no kirk and spock are not [objectionable slur for "gay man" redacted]s. No human being deserves that kind of insult regardless of how they live their life.
Why do you care how individual fans choose to imagine character relationships? It's up to the individual to consume and enjoy entertainment on their terms, not yours.
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Last edited by M'Sharak; November 19 2013 at 04:53 PM. Reason: unacceptable terminology redacted in quoted passage
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Old November 19 2013, 04:47 PM   #98
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

As always, let's keep the discussion about movies, characters, writing, and the like, and try not to make this about other fans or fan groups.

Also: Cara007, there had to be a way you could have made your points in this post without resorting to the use of derogatory language, even if not used as a direct insult. Please be more careful about that in the future; any further such instances may result in warnings being issued.
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Old November 19 2013, 11:41 PM   #99
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I have shipped Kirk and Spock since the day I went to a convention as a teenager and saw all the K/S fanzines and it was suddenly so very very obvious. I assume if I had had the internet back then I would have shipped them before that

However that doesn't mean I don't want Spock and Uhura together, I think it is very sweet. I love your sig Malaika I absolute adored the 2009 movie and two things I loved about it (among many) were the Spock and Uhura relationship AND how it was the slashiest K/S ever. Those actors played to that theme, such chemistry!

So it's not either/or. You can appreciate many possibilities and express multiple attitudes simultaneously to quote the man himself.
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Old November 19 2013, 11:52 PM   #100
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Malaika wrote: View Post
out of curiosity did you do that for everyone or I'm the lucky one?
You're just that engaging.
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Old November 20 2013, 12:32 AM   #101
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Lol. I go away for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose. Whatever happened to good old fashioned bisexual characters? The only thing wrong with Ivanova/Talia was that due to Andrea Thompson wanting to leave they shoe-horned the whole sexual element into just one episode and weakened its story impact.

I don't mind if 'straight' characters are given gay relationships but I'd rather it was done with subtlety, as a non-judgmental, matter of fact part of life.

I find some of the gay references in Dr Who and Tochwood to be unnecessarily overt and sometimes unnecessarily graphic (but I also speak as someone who gets fed up of them wasting time hugging every week when they only have 40 minutes to tell a story). Less can be more.

I think B5's Ivanova, BSG's Gata, Tosh's lesbian affair in Torchwood, and the mature relationship with Jack/Ianto in Children of Earth were well done. The Silurian gay relationship yo-yos from just right to too much, although i confess I am in love with the characters.

It's a tricky balance that runs the risk of polarising people but I'm sure it's only a matter of time until we get a recurring gay action hero in a US show to rival Jack (Jinx is already quite cool in Warehouse 13). Progress is being made but I really don't think the Star Trek movie franchise is looking to make bold moral statements any time soon if Kirk's use of alien hookers is anything to go by.

To summarise: Chapel - yes. Chapel as a love interest for a man or a woman - what would be the point?
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Old November 20 2013, 12:42 AM   #102
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Lol. I go away for a couple of days and all hell breaks loose. Whatever happened to good old fashioned bisexual characters? The only thing wrong with Ivanova/Talia was that due to Andrea Thompson wanting to leave they shoe-horned the whole sexual element into just one episode and weakened its story impact.
But it's fun to rewatch and look for the subtext
I don't mind if 'straight' characters are given gay relationships but I'd rather it was done with subtlety, as a non-judgmental, matter of fact part of life.

I find some of the gay references in Dr Who and Tochwood to be unnecessarily overt and sometimes unnecessarily graphic (but I also speak as someone who gets fed up of them wasting time hugging every week when they only have 40 minutes to tell a story). Less can be more.
I didn't like Jack in Doctor Who but I loved him in Torchwood and I loved his overtness. It felt more shoehorned in Who.
I think B5's Ivanova, BSG's Gata, Tosh's lesbian affair in Torchwood, and the mature relationship with Jack/Ianto in Children of Earth were well done. The Silurian gay relationship yo-yos from just right to too much, although i confess I am in love with the characters.
Agree with it all except I will take all the hot Silurian over the topness I can get The characters are adorable and cartoonish but also perfect.

To summarise: Chapel - yes. Chapel as a love interest for a man or a woman - what would be the point?
Totally agree. I really don't care if we ever see Chapel, though if they went with a series it might be interesting to have her, if they pretty much revamped her.
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Old November 20 2013, 01:14 AM   #103
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

I think Chapel and McCoy as a couple could be cute. It would be fun to see McCoy be flustered and shy in a new romance for example. I doubt it would ever be brought back, but a story with Korby and his androids could be interesting. It's a shame we don't have time for all the many stories we'd like to see and just get one movie every two or three years. I think if Uhura and Spock had the comfortable pacing of a tv series I'd probably like them together better. As it is, I was still shocked by them being a couple in the first movie, and did like them better by the second movie, they'd benefit from more time to tell their story.
And yes, I am able to enjoy media on different levels, and can apprecate Spock and Uhura while still shipping Spock and Kirk.
As for all the earlier unpleasantness, I was shocked to see the gay slur earlier. Of course I've heard it before, but it's hateful and doesn't belong here. I like to think Cara007 really didn't mean any harm, but she did know to use "the N word" and not an actual racial slur, so to follow that up with repeated use of a gay slur gives me pause.
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Old November 20 2013, 01:28 AM   #104
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Bring Chapel back? Sure, pick a hot actress and let's get some hot lesbian action going. Maybe even a three-way.

I'll be a Uhura/Chapel/Carol Marcus shipper.
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Old November 20 2013, 01:32 AM   #105
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Re: Would you like for Chapel to appear in a new movie?

Well we're gender bending the main cast in the Future of Trek forum so you can ship K/S/M if you want AND have it be all about girls.
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