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Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old November 11 2013, 12:43 AM   #346
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

I liked Rise because it's quite different for Trek. I feel like it should be in black and white.
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Old November 11 2013, 09:30 AM   #347
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

It seems like my watching of season 3 fourteen years ago was sporadic, while season 4 I must have done a better job of keeping up with it, because I'm recognising far more here.

Revulsion
A serial killer hologram program. Pretty good. Especially helped by an amazing performance. I like it's portrayed as what would happen to the Doctor if the crew didn't turn around their opinion of them.


The Raven
I think this examination of Seven's back story is a bit soon. Not just that she's only just joined the crew, but also there's absolutely no one questioning how The Raven got some 60,000 light years from where it was last seen. That's a pretty big question for Janeway that just never even gets brought up. Non answer I can cope with, but not even asking it is unbelievable.
Despite the timing, the actual story itself is fine. The idea that her implants pick up the signal, and it's immediately Borg because to her Borg is family is great. Seven's even more dramatic recursion to a child-like state when faced with her family's death was really well done

Scientific Method
I liked it, neat idea, someone clandestinely conducting experiments on the crew. Though the out of phase thing feels a little over-familiar, did Voyager over-rely on that trope or is it just me?
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Old November 11 2013, 09:22 PM   #348
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Depending how far back you push Scientific Method it explains the nonsense in earlier episodes.

Imagine they had been there for the last 5 episodes.

(Cough)

They kickstarted Kes' evolution into a cloud.
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Old November 11 2013, 09:35 PM   #349
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Yeah, but having them back there since Threshold is pushing it.
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Old November 12 2013, 09:29 AM   #350
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Sorry R. Star? What episode are you talking about? I've never heard of one by that name
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Old November 12 2013, 09:53 AM   #351
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Let me remind you!



Unforgettable!
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Old November 12 2013, 10:06 AM   #352
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

No, I don't remember that happeinng in Unforgettable.

Or is that a candid shot of Virginia Madsen without makeup?
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Old November 12 2013, 05:01 PM   #353
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

As I've stated elsewhere, I loved "Revulsion", because Leland Orser just completely sells it with his performance. And the part of the show featuring him is such an effective little piece, using only 3 actors. And then there's the subplot with Harry and Seven-- "Take off your clothes."
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Old November 12 2013, 07:56 PM   #354
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Melakon wrote: View Post
As I've stated elsewhere, I loved "Revulsion", because Leland Orser just completely sells it with his performance. And the part of the show featuring him is such an effective little piece, using only 3 actors. And then there's the subplot with Harry and Seven-- "Take off your clothes."
Yeah the evil hologram was quite convincing and definitely had a menacing air to him. As for the subplot.... Harry Kim, the dog chasing the car.... doesn't know what to do with it if he caught one. I think he's just afraid of all things sexual.
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Old November 12 2013, 11:36 PM   #355
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

No he was afraid of being assimilated. They are all a little bit afraid of 7 in the beginning. The Borg are still in many ways a mystery, but their true horror is that the Borg were us.
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Old November 12 2013, 11:55 PM   #356
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

Men don't care about disease.

Disease comes later.

Worrying about later is for wussies.

Sex now, disease later.
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Old November 13 2013, 05:54 AM   #357
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

I was going to wait till I caught up to the OP before posting some more of my own thoughts on the closing episodes of S3 and the start of S4, but decided to post things in blocks instead of all at once, so here we go with my own thoughts on Favorite Son through Distant Origin.

Favorite Son
I'm pretty sure TOS drew fairly heavily on myth as the inspiration for a lot of its story ideas, but I can't recall it bring done in TNG or DS9, which makes this episode fun because it's basically the Sci-Fi/Star Trek version of the Siren section of The Oddysey, which I thought was cool.

Real Life
Like the OP, I wasn't sure I was going to like this episode, but I ended up changing my mind. I liked both the A and B stories, although I do have to admit that I was skeptical about B'Elanna being the one to make the alterations to the Doctor's 'Family Life' holo-program.

Tom's continued subtle flirting with B'Elanna was also fun, although it's rather ironic that she'll read Klingon romance novels while shunning pretty much every other aspect of her Klingon heritage.

Before and After
Kes happens to be one of my favorite characters on the show, and I also really like time travel stories, so I was already 'predisposed' towards enjoying this episode even if it had been horrible.... which it was far from.

It reminded me a lot of both Endgame and TNG's All Good Things and Parallels, and the conceit of tying it to the Year of Hell and thereby creating some foreshadowing was a really neat creative decision.

I also liked seeing what Kes would've gone through if she and Neelix had mated during the events of Elogium.

The OP talked about how it was kind of jarring seeing Kes with long hair in the present without any explanation, and I agree, although I also think it works despite catching you a bit off-guard.

Distant Origin
I really enjoyed this episode. It reminded me of Tattoo, TNG's The Chase, and DS9's Vortex, and also served as a callback of sorts to Threshold (at least for me).

I also liked the fact that it not only referenced Basics P2 and Fair Trade, it gave us new info about the latter by showing us that one of the items Voyager had used for trade for the items they acquired was a canister of the warp plasma they'd traded for with the Tak-Tak.

The whole 'alien Galileo' ending was also neat, although I really wanted Chakotay to smack the Voth Minister in the face.
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Old November 13 2013, 01:13 PM   #358
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

DigificWriter wrote: View Post
Real Life
Like the OP, I wasn't sure I was going to like this episode, but I ended up changing my mind. I liked both the A and B stories, although I do have to admit that I was skeptical about B'Elanna being the one to make the alterations to the Doctor's 'Family Life' holo-program.
This didn't occur to me when I watched it, but reading your sum-up. Notice how the kids the son falls in with are Klingon, and he wants to embrace Klingon warrior culture. If the Doctor wasn't going through such a harrowing ordeal that's some Freudian programming by B'elanna right there.
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Old November 13 2013, 06:01 PM   #359
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

B'Elanna wished she herself was dead and transferred that... No, too early, the deathwish is later.
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Old November 16 2013, 11:33 PM   #360
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Re: Voyager again, for the first time

I've now caught up to the OP in my viewing.

Displaced
I really liked the Nyrians. I thought it was neat that they weren't your typical villains, and don't think the episode wouldn't have been as effective if it had been more "To Serve Man" the way that director Allan Kroeker thought it should've been

Worst Case Scenario
The best thing about this episode is that it perfectly sums up Season 3 while also serving as a nice callback to Season 1, demonstrating just how far the show has come in two years, which is why it's kind of disappointing that we didn't see Kes in the present in her new long-haired look.

Scorpion, Parts 1 and 2
I've always been a big fan of both the Borg and Seven of Nine, but had never seen these particular episodes before, and have to say that for all the complaints Voyager gets as far as its usage of the Borg is concerned, this is for me one of the best Borg episodes in all of Star Trek, and might actually be better than TNG's The Best of Both Worlds, and Jeri Ryan is an excellent addition to the cast even though she doesn't appear until Part 2.

The Gift
The behind-the-scenes drama that surrounded Jennifer Lien's departure from the show neither interests nor concerns me. All I care about is the way the 'transition' from Voyager with Kes to Voyager without Kes is handled, and I really enjoyed the episode. Centering it on both the departing Kes and still-acclimating Seven really helped make the transition a smooth and fulfilling one.

Nemesis
I watched this episode in Production Order and think it works just as well as it would have in Original Airing Order, even though watching it in this order means that you go from Seven 'officially' joining the crew in The Gift to an episode in which she doesn't even appear.

As for the episode itself, I really liked the whole 'propaganda' aspect of the story, and it really reminded me in a lot of ways of the first two episodes of BSG Season 3.

Day of Honor
I really liked both the A and B stories in this episode, as they're centered on 3 of my favorite Voyager characters in Seven, Tom, and B'Elanna. "B'Elanna's Bad Day" was the perfect vehicle for exploring her character individually and evolving her burgeoning relationship with Tom, and dovetailing that story with Seven trying to integrate herself with the crew and the external complications that result.

Revulsion
I've got a soft spot for episodes that deal with Holograms or Holographic programs that either aren't what they seem or that go awry in some manner, and consequently really enjoyed this episode. The B story involving Harry and Seven was also enjoyable, although there are places where it feels like it would've worked better if it were to have been produced and/or aired after The Raven.

The Raven
I know there are some - including the PTBs on the show - who felt like this story came a little too soon, but I have to disagree. I think you needed to do this story this early in Seven's tenure on the show because of the way she came onto the ship. Juxtaposing Seven's "Pied Piper" experience with the story of the overbearing B'omar was also a brilliant decision and really helped enhance that already-strong story.

Scientific Method
The Memory Alpha article for this ep compares it to TNG's Schisms, but it reminded me more of the Enterprise episode Vox Sola and the Babylon 5 episode where Sheridan gets abducted and experimented on.

One of the things that I liked that sets this ep apart from those two episodes, though, is the way it explores Tom and B'Elanna's relationship. Their conversation at the end of the story where they kind of tongue-in-cheek question the validity of their relationship is the perfect summation of who their characters are.

I also liked getting to see Janeway be a badass again because that's always fun.
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