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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old November 10 2013, 12:43 AM   #1
hammerhead
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Commander Kirk

So in Into Darkness we see Kirk been busted down to first officer by Pike, now did that mean we saw him been demoted in rank to Commander?

Now I now he says to Spock not to call him Captain and in response Spock calls him Commander instead on the way to the big meeting. Did his uniform reflect this change in rank, I couldn't tell?

Was this the first time we've seen a Commander Kirk?
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Old November 10 2013, 01:21 AM   #2
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Commander Kirk

IIRC, Kirk does wear the insignia of a Commander when they're at the all-hands meeting with Marcus. It would have been the first time we ever see Kirk wear the insignia of any rank lower than Captain.

(For most of ST XI, Kirk is a Lieutenant, but does not wear a full Starfleet uniform.)
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Old November 10 2013, 01:37 AM   #3
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Re: Commander Kirk

I think you mean XI.
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Old November 10 2013, 01:44 AM   #4
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Re: Commander Kirk

Yes, my bad
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Old November 10 2013, 02:05 AM   #5
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Re: Commander Kirk

Of course this would have vastly improved Insurrection if Commander Kirk had been in it.
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Old November 10 2013, 02:22 AM   #6
Avro Arrow
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Re: Commander Kirk

hammerhead wrote: View Post
So in Into Darkness we see Kirk been busted down to first officer by Pike, now did that mean we saw him been demoted in rank to Commander?

Now I now he says to Spock not to call him Captain and in response Spock calls him Commander instead on the way to the big meeting. Did his uniform reflect this change in rank, I couldn't tell?

Was this the first time we've seen a Commander Kirk?
Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
IIRC, Kirk does wear the insignia of a Commander when they're at the all-hands meeting with Marcus. It would have been the first time we ever see Kirk wear the insignia of any rank lower than Captain.
I just checked the scene in question on the DVD, and Kirk is still wearing captain's insignia at the meeting.
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Old November 10 2013, 02:24 AM   #7
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Re: Commander Kirk

hammerhead wrote: View Post
Did his uniform reflect this change in rank, I couldn't tell?
Jim Kirk was promoted at the end of the first movie to the rank of Jim Kirk. This rank is inalterable due to narrative necessity. Trying to square any of this with how a normal human organization would handle ranks is a one-way ticket to the puzzle factory.
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Old November 10 2013, 02:32 AM   #8
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Re: Commander Kirk

Jim Kirk likes being Captain. Any time he isn't a Captain, the universe conspires to make him one.
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Old November 10 2013, 02:33 AM   #9
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Re: Commander Kirk

"I'M CAPTAIN KIRK!!!"
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Old November 10 2013, 02:36 AM   #10
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Re: Commander Kirk

Avro Arrow wrote: View Post
I just checked the scene in question on the DVD, and Kirk is still wearing captain's insignia at the meeting.
Whoopsies.
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Old November 10 2013, 01:45 PM   #11
hammerhead
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Re: Commander Kirk

Avro Arrow wrote: View Post

I just checked the scene in question on the DVD, and Kirk is still wearing captain's insignia at the meeting.
Thanks for checking Avro Arrow, so it seems he didn't have time for a uniform change or he was still Captain as Spock believed. But Kirk specifically corrected him and seemed to be ok when Spock called him Commander.

Was Spock wearing the right insignia in that scene? Guess it's all moot as Marcus obviously reversed the demotion, but it'd be nice to get confirmation that the demotion occurred!
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Old November 10 2013, 02:47 PM   #12
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Re: Commander Kirk

That he is demoted to executive officer of Enterprise is beyond doubt.

Although he acknowledges that his 'official' rank in that position is Commander, as Pike has been made Captain of the Enterprise again, maybe that doesn't necessarily mean that his actual rank takes a hit. Maybe he can still technically be a Captain and yet also be an XO/Commander. His "spoken rank" is really only reflective of his position aboard the ship, at least for the 20 seconds that Pike has resumed the Captaincy anyway.
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Old November 10 2013, 07:27 PM   #13
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Re: Commander Kirk

hammerhead wrote: View Post
Was Spock wearing the right insignia in that scene? Guess it's all moot as Marcus obviously reversed the demotion, but it'd be nice to get confirmation that the demotion occurred!
Spock wasn't demoted he was transfered.
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Old November 11 2013, 01:34 AM   #14
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Re: Commander Kirk

The Abramsverse seems a bit cavalier about rank, though (and not just Kirk jumping straight from Lt. to Captain. What about Cupcake, for example?), so it's not really surprising if somebody's not wearing the right insignia.
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Old November 11 2013, 03:13 AM   #15
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Re: Commander Kirk

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
IIRC, Kirk does wear the insignia of a Commander when they're at the all-hands meeting with Marcus. It would have been the first time we ever see Kirk wear the insignia of any rank lower than Captain.

(For most of ST XI, Kirk is a Lieutenant, but does not wear a full Starfleet uniform.)
I'm pretty sure he's still in Captain's dress uniform, with three stripes, four pips and the TMP-style insignia set in a circle. A commander would have two stripes, three pips and a plain arrowhead (and Admiral a white uniform front and gold insignia set in a circle)

Since Kirk presumably walked right out of Starfleet after being bumped back to the academy, then went straight from the bar to the emergency meeting, he didn't have time to requisition a new uniform.
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