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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Star Trek - Original Series

Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old October 23 2013, 11:40 AM   #646
Stompy
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Harvey wrote: View Post
Changing gears a bit for the moment, the book claims (pg.184) that Bruce Hyde (Lt. Riley) can be seen at the helm in 'The Man Trap' in a pick-up shot taken during 'The Naked Time.' Can anyone confirm this with a screencap?


this is who I think they are talking to. If it is him he looks different in this episode
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Old October 24 2013, 03:26 AM   #647
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

The guy appears to be a background performer named Budd Albright. I rambled a bit about that claim on my blog.
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Old October 24 2013, 05:20 AM   #648
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

That looks nothing like Bruce Hyde.
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Old October 26 2013, 12:10 AM   #649
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

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Could he be selectively choosing ratings samples to support his argument that the series was a success? It certainly doesn't support anything I'd read back in the 60s or early 70s.
Yeah I think he might be overstating things a bit with the ratings. Although it probably IS fair to say that the show was much more popular and highly rated than the conventional wisdom has always had it.

Because before now, I had always heard that the show was a huge disappointment and finished nearly last in the ratings every year. Which always seemed strange to me given how bold and unique the show must have looked at the time.

If nothing else, it's nice to know that the show at least wasn't a complete dud.

And yeah, there's probably also some truth to the fact that the high cost of the show and Roddenberry's difficult ways played a big role in the show's cancellation as well.
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Old October 26 2013, 05:56 AM   #650
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

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Because before now, I had always heard that the show was a huge disappointment and finished nearly last in the ratings every year.
NBC committed to the show for three seasons. A program as expensive as Star Trek wouldn't have stayed on the air for the sixteen episodes NBC initially orered if it had been "nearly last in the the ratings." (One of Star Trek's time slot competitors, The Tammy Grimes Show, was cancelled after just four episodes which weren't even that bad).
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Old November 3 2013, 12:14 AM   #651
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

There's a new interview with Cushman at Trek Movie.

He repeats his version of 'The Alternative Factor,' but still doesn't provide a source.

He says quite a bit more about the ratings, but it seems more apparent than ever that he doesn't know what he's talking about (there were only two ratings services in the '60s and '70s?).

Probably the most revealing thing about Cushman is when he says, "Lucille Ball lost her studio because she sponsored Star Trek, and was determined to put it on the air." That kind of thing is rather indicative of what you'll find in these books in that it both exaggerates the importance of the series and totally ignores important things that were happening outside of it in Hollywood.
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Old November 3 2013, 06:55 PM   #652
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Harvey wrote: View Post

....A program as expensive as Star Trek wouldn't have stayed on the air for the sixteen episodes NBC initially orered if it had been "nearly last in the the ratings." (One of Star Trek's time slot competitors, The Tammy Grimes Show, was cancelled after just four episodes which weren't even that bad).
Very interesting stuff, but I thought that Star Trek was done on a shoestring and even had to borrow some of their "creatures/aliens" from "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea." Is this incorrect?
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Old November 3 2013, 07:38 PM   #653
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

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I thought that Star Trek was done on a shoestring and even had to borrow some of their "creatures/aliens" from "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea." Is this incorrect?
I pretty much doubt it. Irwin Allen's shows were too busy borrowing props and costumes from each other to be able to rent them out.
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Old November 3 2013, 07:54 PM   #654
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Harvey wrote: View Post
Probably the most revealing thing about Cushman is when he says, "Lucille Ball lost her studio because she sponsored Star Trek, and was determined to put it on the air." That kind of thing is rather indicative of what you'll find in these books in that it both exaggerates the importance of the series and totally ignores important things that were happening outside of it in Hollywood.
Yeah, that sort of claim makes no sense at all. Lucille was nearing 60, she owned the studio personally, and perhaps she was just more comfortable as a performer than running a business after the marriage to Desi was officially over. She certainly didn't stop working. After selling Desilu, she immediately formed her own Lucille Ball Productions and started in on Here's Lucy.
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Old November 3 2013, 08:40 PM   #655
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Marc Cushman really did himself no favors by rushing this book to press without having it thoroughly proofread for accuracy (to say nothing of spelling and grammar). While I have yet to find any glaring errors in his discussions about the main topics--the pre-,during and post-production details for each episode--they certainly exist for some of the "scene setter" filler.

I've already touched upon the "Hogan's Heroes" error in misnumbering the camp which the story took place in. Last night I discovered that he's also mischaracterized the prisoner of war camp as a concentration camp. That's a bit more of a glaring error than labeling Stalag 13 as Stalag 17. Imagine that, a sitcom about a concentration camp. Don't you think even a proofreader unfamiliar with the show should have caught that and said to themselves, "that can't be right."

I have been a staunch defender of this book, and still support it to the point I would recommend it--the revised version, that is. But I understand why DC Fontana told Cushman, (paraphrasing) 'You better let me review the second season edition before you go to print with it.'

And don't get me wrong--I'm not a Hogan's Heroes fan who's simply upset about those errors mentioned above. Quite frankly, I don't like that show (maybe because I somehow have developed a visceral dislike of Bob Crane over the years) and rarely watch it (and yet even I can identify the errors made).

I'm still looking forward to the season two and three books, but I will have a more skeptical view if errors like these appear in them.
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Old November 3 2013, 08:42 PM   #656
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Harvey wrote: View Post
There's a new interview with Cushman at Trek Movie.

Probably the most revealing thing about Cushman is when he says, "Lucille Ball lost her studio because she sponsored Star Trek, and was determined to put it on the air." That kind of thing is rather indicative of what you'll find in these books in that it both exaggerates the importance of the series and totally ignores important things that were happening outside of it in Hollywood.
Why do I suddenly hear these words coming out of GR's mouth?
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Old November 4 2013, 01:18 AM   #657
Harvey
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

Zameaze wrote: View Post
Very interesting stuff, but I thought that Star Trek was done on a shoestring and even had to borrow some of their "creatures/aliens" from "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea." Is this incorrect?
I have no idea if the series rented creatures that had been previously used on that Irwin Allen series, but it certainly wasn't "done on a shoestring." Star Trek was an expensive, prestige production. As it went along, and the studio lowered the budget while the cast and others got contractual raises, there was certainly less money to go around.
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Old November 4 2013, 01:21 AM   #658
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

An editor can shape your book and your sentences. A proofreader does grammar. Since writing about the entertainment industry, he would need a fact-checker from that realm, someone who knows about Arbitron and Desilu and Stalag numbers. Kind of like what Kellam DeForest did for Trek science.

I didn't have the budget for a fact-checker for my book, though there would be several knowledgeable folks about Satchmo who would've known the facts; and many more who can recognize a potentially-wrong fact and research it. I had to -- as best as I could -- recognize anything I might have gotten wrong, and double- or triple- check it. Even then, I am afraid some expert is going to instantly see something wrong, which will undermine the rest of it. One does what one can.

But with so many errors easy for knowledgeable readers to see, it certainly calls into question other facts and conclusions about which we do not know. Why don't some of you offer to proof or fact-check his next volume? (I think I already did upthread.) I'd do it for a modest fee; probably there are kind souls with time who could crowdsourcedly check it for him. Might be a nice IDIC-ish thing to do.
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Old November 4 2013, 01:26 AM   #659
Harvey
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

After the review I wrote, I doubt Cushman or his publisher would be at all interested in my services as a fact-checker.

But, let's be honest -- for a modest fee, I'd do it.
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Old November 4 2013, 02:21 AM   #660
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Re: New Book about TOS: These Are The Voyages

^^ I'd say a lot depends on your approach. You are sincerely interested in this kind of materiel and you'd like to see it done justice. It's one thing to say, "I think this is suspect" and saying, "This stuff is crap." If you'd really like to do it---and in the process have your name attached to something you're really interested in---then you could approach him with a good balance of deference and candor.
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