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A 28 34.15%
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Old October 21 2013, 10:42 PM   #91
WalkerBait
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

DarthTom wrote: View Post

One point of the plot I didn't get or perhaps missed the dialogue in the film is why was the Chinese space station losing its orbit? That seemed just a little to easy to make the plot work. Also that she gets incredibly lucky pushing the right controls to eject the emergency landing vehicle.

The rest IMO was plausible - at least plausible enough.
In the real worl the Chinese space station is in fairly low orbit. It could've simply been pushed or fallen a bit especially after the escape rocket launched/the first pass of the meteor shower.
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Old October 21 2013, 11:23 PM   #92
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

publiusr wrote: View Post
stj wrote: View Post
I always tend to think of "masculino-fascist" type of concepts as what you get when you have a right-winger embarrassed by their cherished reactionary illusions trying to sound leftish by trying to copy Marxism without ever, ever bothering to find out anything about it.
Spaceflight and even science was lampooned as being 'penetrative' for awhile by some eco-feminists and deep ecologists. Even Chomsky had to put the breaks on that and well as postmodernism. I've always adored Camille Paglia myself.

She thought that pop-art deserved more respect, and I love her for that. One of her books
http://www.amazon.com/Glittering-Ima...dp_kinw_strp_1
To be fair, you're talking about phallic objects penetrating deep, dark, unknown spaces. It's a gold mine for psychoanalysis.
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Old October 22 2013, 01:17 AM   #93
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

publiusr wrote: View Post
stj wrote: View Post
I always tend to think of "masculino-fascist" type of concepts as what you get when you have a right-winger embarrassed by their cherished reactionary illusions trying to sound leftish by trying to copy Marxism without ever, ever bothering to find out anything about it.
Spaceflight and even science was lampooned as being 'penetrative' for awhile by some eco-feminists and deep ecologists. Even Chomsky had to put the breaks on that and well as postmodernism. I've always adored Camille Paglia myself.
You should find the AMERICAN CINEMATOGRAPHER on TMP; there is a general article before the tech ones that sounds like somebody's psych thesis at times, comparing the Enterprise to spermatozoa as it penetrates v'ger's exterior. You'd figure that kind of thing for the DISCOVERY in 2001, but for TMP?
Well, the way Kirk looks at the ship in drydock ...
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Old October 22 2013, 02:32 PM   #94
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post

In the real worl the Chinese space station is in fairly low orbit. It could've simply been pushed or fallen a bit especially after the escape rocket launched/the first pass of the meteor shower.
In the, 'real world,' the Chinese haven't even launched their space station yet?

The Chinese space station[citation needed] (CSS) is a planned artificial satellite to be placed in low earth orbit. It is part of Project 921 of the Chinese space program. It is a third generation modular space station, comparable to the Soviet/Russian Mir, Russian OPSEK and the ISS. Operations will be controlled from the Beijing Aerospace Command and Control Centre in the People's Republic of China.
According to the technology-tabloid The Register, Wang Wenbao, director of the Chinese space agency, the China Manned Space Engineering Office (CSME), believes that the project "will enhance national prestige and strengthen the national sense of cohesion and pride."[1][2] The planned launching date is "around 2020" [3]
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Old October 22 2013, 02:37 PM   #95
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

U.S. shuttle orbotors don't fly anymore and the Chinese don't have a working station in orbit yet. So that pretty well makes this film science fiction...seeing as some people were questioning that.
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Old October 22 2013, 02:47 PM   #96
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Warped9 wrote: View Post
U.S. shuttle orbotors don't fly anymore and the Chinese don't have a working station in orbit yet. So that pretty well makes this film science fiction...seeing as some people were questioning that.
Of course. Regardless even in science fiction they often explain why inexplicable things are happening. And they didn't explain why the Chinese Space Station was losing orbit. Also - as I said up thread - she got very lucky pushing the right buttons to properly engage the emergency evacuation vehicle since she didn't read Chinese.
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Old October 22 2013, 05:44 PM   #97
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

^ I thought she muttered something about the button layouts being the same, with only the language labels different?
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Old October 22 2013, 05:52 PM   #98
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Gaith wrote: View Post
^ I thought she muttered something about the button layouts being the same, with only the language labels different?
Astronaut Clooney said the layout of the Chinese station was similar to the Soyuz. (Which it is/will be in real life.) So since she was familiar with the procedures on the Soyuz she could operate the Chinese pod.

The thing that occurs to me is that she's lucky the pod happened to settle into a proper reentry angle.

I think of the discussions in "Apollo 13" where they talk about the capsule needing to be in a narrow reentry corridor. Too steep and it burns up on reentry, to shallow and it skips off the atmosphere. Bullock's pod seemed to happen to be in just the right reentry corridor.

In the, 'real world,' the Chinese haven't even launched their space station yet?
Yes it's not built yet, but as your excerpt says, it's to be built in a low orbit. So given some hand waving (which we already have to do a LOT of for this movie to work) we can assume it's shallow orbit but it into reentry earlier especially if we compound it with being pushed out of orbit a bit by the debris field/launching of the escape pods.
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Old October 23 2013, 02:07 PM   #99
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

I'm confused.

China's Tiangong-1 space station was launched in 2011 and has since been visited by two different Shenzhou crews. I assumed that this was the Tiangong station also depicted in Gravity? Or was that supposed to be a later Tiangong station which is not yet in orbit?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiangong-1
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Old October 23 2013, 06:32 PM   #100
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

^ It looks like Tiangong-1 is just the first part of a larger planned station. The one in the movie appeared to be the complete Tiangong station.
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Old October 23 2013, 09:40 PM   #101
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Cap'n Crunch wrote: View Post
^ It looks like Tiangong-1 is just the first part of a larger planned station. The one in the movie appeared to be the complete Tiangong station.
Actually, Tiangong-1 is only the first in a series of planned Chinese space stations. Tiangong-1 will be de-orbited soon and then replaced by Tiangong-2 in (probably) 2015. It will be followed by Tiangong-3, before the Chinese plan to move ahead with building a larger, modular space station in the mold of Mir and the ISS.

The Chinese space station in Gravity is also refered to as "Tiangong", but it is no indication given which of the stations in the Tiangong series is meant.

According to Wikipedia, the Soyuz capsule used by Ryan Stone is designated TMA-14M. The real-world Soyuz TMA-14M is currently scheduled for a launch in late 2014 and a landing in early 2015. We could perhaps surmise that Gravity is supposed to be set in the near-future year of 2015 and Chiese space station depicted in the movie is either Tiangong-2 or Tiangong-3.
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Old October 23 2013, 11:21 PM   #102
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

This is why you just sit back and enjoy the majesty of excellent filmcraft. I think we can all agree that, in terms of its plot and narrative, it is pretty much nonsense!
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Old October 30 2013, 10:49 AM   #103
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Kelthaz wrote: View Post
I might be a little fuzzy on the details near the end there, but I'm pretty sure I got the gist of it.


Kelthaz wrote: View Post
I really enjoyed the film, but it got silly at the end. A+ for the first half. C- for the second half. Overall, I went with a B+.
That wraps up my impression. The second part / space station seemed essentially like a repetition of the ISS part (to arrive at the 90 minute screen time?), except that a fire extinguisher WALL-E-style was used as thruster (problem: unless you use your wrist mirror you are unable to see where the thrust propels you to...).

I really enjoyed the film for many of its visuals, sound design and this continuous shot in the beginning (really conveying to us the experience of being there) and will purchase the 3D Blu-ray but some of the scientific nonsense really spoiled part of the experience and this great interview with an actual NASA astronaut revealed some of it.

Interestingly the space shuttle started to revolve around its own axis and - had the shuttle's arm still been attached - an astronaut at the end of the arm would have experienced centrifugal forces that would have pushed him or her away from the shuttle.

That's the kind of centrifugal push the filmmaker would have needed to justify the ISS scene (whatever would have made the ISS rotate around its own axis is unimportant, but it would have provided the scientific explanation for this pivotal scene...).

At that moment I gave up all hope to watch a film that had seemed thus far to hold on to "Science Fact", relaxed and enjoyed the breath taking (...) rollercoaster ride in Earth's orbit.

IMHO it's just sad that the film could have used more "science" and still have the same kind or drama or even more:

Former NASA astronaut Scott Parazynski said that a tiny fragment flying with bullet speed would probably ignite the oxygen supply of an EVA suit upon impact penetration. So we could have had an exploding astronaut plus the gruesome image of a space shuttle pilot's head with a hole through which to see Earth.

Again, a very good film but compared to the depiction of spacecraft and zero gravity in MISSION TO MARS there's more fiction than fact in it.

Bob
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Old October 31 2013, 01:26 AM   #104
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

Robert Comsol wrote: View Post
except that a fire extinguisher WALL-E-style was used as thruster (problem: unless you use your wrist mirror you are unable to see where the thrust propels you to...).
Hence, why Bullock's character is shown adjusting where she aims the extinguisher whenever she rotates to catch a glimpse of the station.
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Old October 31 2013, 02:33 AM   #105
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Re: Gravity - Review and Discussion Thread

There's still a lot of hand waving you have to do for the fire extinguisher scene to work. She'd have to have it perfectly place at (or very near) her center of mass in order for it to work as propulsion (rather than spinning her around) and even then I don't know that it'd give her that much thrust.
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