RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,914
Posts: 5,388,395
Members: 24,718
Currently online: 467
Newest member: Tribblemaker

TrekToday headlines

IDW Publishing November Trek Comic
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Pegg/Wright Trilogy In The Works
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Star Trek: The Compendium Rebate Details
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Gold Key Archives Volume 2
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19

Takei Documentary Wins Award
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19

Cumberbatch To Voice Khan
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19

Shaun And Ed On Phineas and Ferb
By: T'Bonz on Aug 18

New Ships Coming From Official Starships Collection
By: T'Bonz on Aug 18

Trek Stars Take On Ice Bucket Challenge
By: T'Bonz on Aug 18

Retro Review: Profit and Lace
By: Michelle on Aug 16


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 6 2013, 04:02 AM   #361
diankra
Commodore
 
Location: UK
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Christopher wrote: View Post
^I couldn't stand more of the way they stretched the images out to fit a widescreen format. That was just vandalism.
It's an interesting one: when Dad's Army and the like are repeated here now, they display as square-ish pictures in the middle of the widescreen.
__________________
"Some days are better than others. They say that where I come from."
"Loudly, I imagine, on the day you left."
(Blake's 7 - Rumours of Death)
diankra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 04:07 AM   #362
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Well, that's the way it should look. The show was made in the more "square-ish" format of the time. I'll never understand why some people think it's better to have an image distorted to fit the frame than it is to have a little black space in order for the image to look the way it was meant to.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 04:14 AM   #363
diankra
Commodore
 
Location: UK
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Christopher wrote: View Post
Well, that's the way it should look. The show was made in the more "square-ish" format of the time. I'll never understand why some people think it's better to have an image distorted to fit the frame than it is to have a little black space in order for the image to look the way it was meant to.
That's what puzzled me: if British TV can handle it in a way that the TVs latch onto automatically (it's something in the decoding, as they do look different from set to set, and particularly if you record a DVD copy on one machine and play it on another), why not do the same in the states?
__________________
"Some days are better than others. They say that where I come from."
"Loudly, I imagine, on the day you left."
(Blake's 7 - Rumours of Death)
diankra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 05:51 AM   #364
Ar-Pharazon
Rear Admiral
 
Ar-Pharazon's Avatar
 
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

^ That's the big thing in the Star Trek TNG blu-ray discussions, "why didn't they make it 16:9?".

I'm happy it's remastered well and looks as great as it does. I understand it wasn't meant to be widescreen.
__________________
Rimmer, on what period of history to live in-
“Well, It’d be the 19th century for me, one of Napoleon’s marshals.
The chance to march across Europe with the greatest general of all time and kill Belgians” - (White Hole).
Ar-Pharazon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 11:53 AM   #365
DWF
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Christopher wrote: View Post
^I couldn't stand more of the way they stretched the images out to fit a widescreen format. That was just vandalism.
With HDTVs you cna change the format anyway and I can't see what's lost watching older shows.
__________________
The greatest science fiction series of all time is
Doctor Who! And I'll take you all on, one-by-one
or all in a bunch to back it up!"
--- Harlan Ellison, from his introduction
to the PINNACLE series of Doctor Who books
DWF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 03:09 PM   #366
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

diankra wrote: View Post
That's what puzzled me: if British TV can handle it in a way that the TVs latch onto automatically (it's something in the decoding, as they do look different from set to set, and particularly if you record a DVD copy on one machine and play it on another), why not do the same in the states?
It's not about the TVs. It's a specific choice made by the people behind this specific set of specials. I've never seen it done with anything else in American TV. Usually, programs are broadcast in their original aspect ratio, or portions are cut off to fit the screen but the actual proportions of the image are unaltered. (Although a lot of HDTVs do stretch things out to fit the frame unless you set them to display the original aspect ratio. But that's done by the receivers, not the broadcasters.) "The Aztecs" was presented in its original aspect ratio when this retrospective began. But starting with "Tomb of the Cybermen," they decided to employ this bizarre distortion that kept the central part of the image in its original proportions but stretched out the sides of the image to fill a widescreen frame. That's something new in my experience and I profoundly hope it doesn't catch on.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 03:47 PM   #367
diankra
Commodore
 
Location: UK
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

I understand that; my point was that on the UK system the older productions aren't actually transmitted with black space to either side, but the sets are triggered automatically to display them like that (though if you want to override it, you can get your set to streeetch every image into widescreen if you so choose), so I wondered if there was some difference between the two transmission systems that meant that couldn't happen in the States, so the the broadcasters had to decide whether to 'sidebar' or stretch at source.
__________________
"Some days are better than others. They say that where I come from."
"Loudly, I imagine, on the day you left."
(Blake's 7 - Rumours of Death)
diankra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 04:30 PM   #368
Allyn Gibson
Vice Admiral
 
Allyn Gibson's Avatar
 
Location: South Pennsyltucky
View Allyn Gibson's Twitter Profile Send a message via AIM to Allyn Gibson Send a message via Yahoo to Allyn Gibson
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

My parents have to adjust their HDTV manually. There's something like four different settings on their television -- letterboxed all around, letterboxed on the sides, stretched, cropped. (The cropped one is weird -- it stretches the 4:3 to the 16:9 width and then lops off the top and bottom.) They usually have me fix it when I visit, because they do something like get the television stuck on the cropped setting.
__________________
"When David Marcus cited the great thinkers of history -- "Newton, Einstein, Surak" -- Newt Gingrich did not make his list." -- 24 January 2012

allyngibson.net
Allyn Gibson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 06:13 PM   #369
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

diankra wrote: View Post
I understand that; my point was that on the UK system the older productions aren't actually transmitted with black space to either side, but the sets are triggered automatically to display them like that (though if you want to override it, you can get your set to streeetch every image into widescreen if you so choose), so I wondered if there was some difference between the two transmission systems that meant that couldn't happen in the States, so the the broadcasters had to decide whether to 'sidebar' or stretch at source.
US sets aren't configured to do that automatically, I think, though you can choose that setting. I think that standard-definition signals are broadcast in 4:3 and HD signals are broadcast in widescreen. The BBCA Doctors Revisited specials show up on my (old, standard-def, 4:3) TV as letterboxed (i.e. with black space above and below to fit into a 4:3 frame) and stretched out. But that's on the standard-def BBCA channel, as I understand it. I would assume that if I got the BBCA HD feed, it would be a full widescreen image with no bars (which means that the sides would be cut off on my set, and the image would fill the screen on an HDTV).

I think this is just the modern equivalent of colorization. They decided to alter the image to make it fit what's become standard, even though that means changing it in an unauthentic and unappealing way.



Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
My parents have to adjust their HDTV manually. There's something like four different settings on their television -- letterboxed all around, letterboxed on the sides, stretched, cropped. (The cropped one is weird -- it stretches the 4:3 to the 16:9 width and then lops off the top and bottom.) They usually have me fix it when I visit, because they do something like get the television stuck on the cropped setting.
I'll never understand why HDTVs don't just default to the correct aspect ratio for any image with black space on the sides or top/bottom as needed, just like my computer monitor does when I'm watching an online video. I get so sick of seeing HDTVs in public places that are broadcasting standard-def 4:3 images stretched and flattened to fit a wide screen. Nobody but me seems bothered that the people and objects are unnaturally squashed. They'd rather see everything misshapen than tolerate some harmless black space. And HDTVs seem to be designed to cater to that bizarre set of priorities as the default.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 06:22 PM   #370
DWF
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

There's so little stretching it hardly matters, but a change in resolution is always noticed. And in the terms of the classic Doctor Who there's always a difference between the film images and the videotaped portions.
__________________
The greatest science fiction series of all time is
Doctor Who! And I'll take you all on, one-by-one
or all in a bunch to back it up!"
--- Harlan Ellison, from his introduction
to the PINNACLE series of Doctor Who books
DWF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 6 2013, 06:42 PM   #371
Mr. Adventure
Admiral
 
Mr. Adventure's Avatar
 
Location: Mr. Adventure
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Christopher wrote: View Post
I've never seen it done with anything else in American TV.
Cartoon Network does it, they show everything in widescreen including older cartoons. In the early days of HDTV, AMC was even worse as they'd stretch their already cropped pan-and-scan versions of movies. As a somewhat early adopter of HDTV it was more prevalent than it is now. Of course, now there's less and less 4:3 programming being shown, period.

Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
My parents have to adjust their HDTV manually. There's something like four different settings on their television -- letterboxed all around, letterboxed on the sides, stretched, cropped. (The cropped one is weird -- it stretches the 4:3 to the 16:9 width and then lops off the top and bottom.) They usually have me fix it when I visit, because they do something like get the television stuck on the cropped setting.
My TV has a 4:3 mode which will take those streched-out broadcasts and force them back into 4:3 which is pretty handy. I take it that isn't a common feature.

I've also found a good number of people who are oblivious to their TV stretching out the image and a good number that aren't aware they are watching the SD channel instead of the HD one (when both are available).
Mr. Adventure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 7 2013, 02:43 AM   #372
Klaus
Rear Admiral
 
Klaus's Avatar
 
Location: Beach condo, Bay of Eldamar
View Klaus's Twitter Profile
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Mr. Adventure wrote: View Post
I've also found a good number of people who are oblivious
You could have just shortened it to this...
__________________
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
t-shirts!
deviantArt
Klaus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 7 2013, 02:45 AM   #373
diankra
Commodore
 
Location: UK
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

As a sidenote the Doctors Revisited season starts running in the uk next Saturday on Watch. It'll be intrrrsting to see how they run Tomb... will it be stretched as in the US?
__________________
"Some days are better than others. They say that where I come from."
"Loudly, I imagine, on the day you left."
(Blake's 7 - Rumours of Death)
diankra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 10 2013, 02:57 AM   #374
The Borgified Corpse
Admiral
 
The Borgified Corpse's Avatar
 
Location: Ouch! Forgotten already? You were just down there 20 minutes ago.
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Mr Light wrote: View Post
Series Five had a lot of bad episodes, but I thought the Angel two parter was perfectly done. I wish that Moffat's run had lived up to those first five episodes. Vampires of Venice, Amy's Choice, and the Silurian 2 parter were a real low point in the modern series. And I know I'm in the minority on this one but I find Vincent and the Doctor to be just alright.
I disagree. If anything, I think Season 5 got much better as it went along. It starts out great with "The Eleventh Hour." But then you've got some half-baked ideas that never quite gel in "The Beast Below." Then you've got the shitty Dalek redesign in "Victory of the Daleks." Then you've got Smith & Gillan not quite totally in character yet in "The Time of Angels"/"Flesh & Stone."

IMO, things got a lot better after that. "Amy's Choice" & "The Lodger" are both on my top 5 list of the best episodes of the new series. "The Vampires of Venice" is a solid if unremarkable story that immediately does a fantastic job of integrating Rory into the ensemble. "Vincent & the Doctor" is heartbreakingly poignant.

The Silurian 2-parter is a bit of a misstep. I suspect it would work better as a 1-parter. Then they would have less time to dwell on the humans contemplating whether or not they should torture their Silurian prisoner.

Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
My main criticism with "The Time of Angels" two-parter is that Matt Smith's characterization isn't there yet. Of course it's not -- it's the first episode of his run that was produced, and it was written as a tenth Doctor story, so the eleventh Doctor is prone to the tenth Doctor's verbal tics.
Agreed. Wholeheartedly. In particular, I think Smith has some shouty moments towards the end of part 2 that are very Tennant-esque.

Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the heck out of "The Time of Angels" (though I really wish the second part didn't drop major plotlines from the first part, like why the Clerics wanted the Angel in the first place)
They forgot because their reason fell into the crack.

DWF wrote: View Post
The Time Of Angels was a bad turning point actually, Moffat changed the rules regarding the Angels and it really started up the mystery surrounding River.
I wouldn't say that the story "really started up the mystery surrounding River." They make 1 or 2 brief mentions of the fact that the Doctor doesn't really know who River is yet. But that's about it. Out of all of River's appearances, I'd say it's the one where River's presence is the most incidental and the one that spends the least time focusing on or speculating about River's backstory.
__________________
Kegg: "You're a Trekkie. The capacity to quibble over the minutiae of space opera films is your birthright."
The Borgified Corpse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 26 2013, 03:48 PM   #375
Klaus
Rear Admiral
 
Klaus's Avatar
 
Location: Beach condo, Bay of Eldamar
View Klaus's Twitter Profile
Re: Classic Who on BBC America

Sunday night this time...
__________________
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
t-shirts!
deviantArt
Klaus is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:25 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.