RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,962
Posts: 5,391,686
Members: 24,719
Currently online: 622
Newest member: terkarivish

TrekToday headlines

Forbes Cast In Powers
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

Dorn To Voice Firefly Character
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

No ALS Ice Bucket For Saldana
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

Free Star Trek Trexels Game
By: T'Bonz on Aug 22

New Trek-themed Bobble Heads
By: T'Bonz on Aug 21

IDW Publishing November Trek Comic
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Pegg/Wright Trilogy In The Works
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Star Trek: The Compendium Rebate Details
By: T'Bonz on Aug 20

Gold Key Archives Volume 2
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19

Takei Documentary Wins Award
By: T'Bonz on Aug 19


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Trek Literature

Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 1 2013, 09:58 AM   #16
King Daniel Into Darkness
Admiral
 
King Daniel Into Darkness's Avatar
 
Location: England again
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Dave Stern suggests in the preface to "The Children of Kings" that his rendition of Pike was more informed by Bruce Greenwood's performance than Jeffrey Hunter's.

I forgot about that one. I think Dave wrote it as something of an ENT/TOS/nuTrek mishmash. It used the new warp speed effect on the cover, gave Klingons cloaking devices long before the usual TOS-era assumption of a D7s-for-cloaks Klingon/Romulan exchange (thus fitting in neatly with decloaking Klingons during Kirk's Kobayashi Maru test) and described Klingon Warbirds as more heavily armed versions of the usual battlecruisers.

Although the first mission of the new Enterprise was to Vulcan in the '09 movie, so technically it shouldn't fit into that continuity. But where's the fun in that? I imagined it as TOS but with ultra modern graphics and effects.
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3
King Daniel Into Darkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 01:36 PM   #17
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

^I think the idea behind The Children of Kings, as expressed in the author's afterword, was that since we now had more than one timeline onscreen, the books didn't necessarily have to be bound to an existing timeline. Or something like that. Although from a more pragmatic standpoint, I think the book was most likely written before the movie came out, and things were still up in the air about which timeline(s) Pocket would be writing books about going forward. I recall that before Marco Palmieri was laid off, and before I was pegged to write one of the abortive Abramsverse novels, Marco had asked me to develop a TOS novel which could be tailored to either continuity depending on what Pocket ended up doing vis-a-vis the movies going forward. (In retrospect, given what happened with the Abrams novels, that seems like a safer idea than what we ended up doing.) Mine would presumably have been adjusted to fit either one continuity or the other before publication, but maybe TCoK was based on a similar idea, telling a story that wasn't clearly bound to either continuity.

As for TCoK being before the launch of the Enterprise in the movie, keep in mind that Countdown to Darkness established the existence of an earlier Enterprise that Robert April commanded until 2249. So maybe it could fit that continuity after all?
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog

Last edited by Christopher; October 1 2013 at 01:57 PM.
Christopher is online now   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 01:39 PM   #18
TJ Sinclair
Captain
 
TJ Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: There and back again...
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Dave Stern suggests in the preface to "The Children of Kings" that his rendition of Pike was more informed by Bruce Greenwood's performance than Jeffrey Hunter's.
The Children of Kings was an unusual (weird?) case, in that it seemed to be intentionally written as a "mashup" of the two timelines. Not an approach I really want to see repeated, unless it's done exceptionally well and with a purpose.

ETA: Ah, missed some replies, sorry.
__________________
"Social harmony is not a good goal. There's plenty of social harmony in a prison camp. The individual is the smallest and most oppressed minority..." -- Diane Carey, April 2001
TJ Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 03:03 PM   #19
The Wormhole
Admiral
 
The Wormhole's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Despite what Dave Stern had written, I just viewed The Children of Kings as straight Prime Universe anyway. Certainly the descriptions we get of the Enterprise (running water, bathtubs, paper printouts) seem more consistent with The Cage than they do the Abramsverse and it is Jeffrey Hunter used on the cover anyway.

But that's just my take.
__________________
"Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.
The Wormhole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 03:52 PM   #20
Therin of Andor
Admiral
 
Therin of Andor's Avatar
 
Location: New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
View Therin of Andor's Twitter Profile
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Despite what Dave Stern had written, I just viewed The Children of Kings as straight Prime Universe anyway.
It was. Stern's rendition of Pike was more informed by Bruce Greenwood's performance than Jeffrey Hunter's.
__________________
Thiptho lapth! Ian (Entire post is personal opinion)
The Andor Files @ http://andorfiles.blogspot.com/
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/
Therin of Andor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 03:53 PM   #21
TJ Sinclair
Captain
 
TJ Sinclair's Avatar
 
Location: There and back again...
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Despite what Dave Stern had written, I just viewed The Children of Kings as straight Prime Universe anyway.
It was. Stern's rendition of Pike was more informed by Bruce Greenwood's performance than Jeffrey Hunter's.
You might want to re-read that, Therin. How does the author using the Abramsverse version of Pike place the book in the Prime Universe?

ETA: After rereading your statement myself, I suppose you're not using your second sentence as proof of your first, as it may appear. Okay. Moving on, then.
__________________
"Social harmony is not a good goal. There's plenty of social harmony in a prison camp. The individual is the smallest and most oppressed minority..." -- Diane Carey, April 2001

Last edited by TJ Sinclair; October 1 2013 at 04:05 PM.
TJ Sinclair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 05:07 PM   #22
Greg Cox
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Oxford, PA
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Relayer1 wrote: View Post
I think that our view on how things are and what they look like in Kirks era and before has to default to what we've seen in the JJverse UNLESS it has been established in TV or in novels to be otherwise. For instance London in the 23rd century...

I would say that as we have already established an actor for Pike on TV, the one in the novels is Hunter.
I suspect that's up to the reader to some degree, like whether you visualize Saavik as Kirstie Alley or Robin Curtis.

And if somebody wants to visualize Chris Pine or Zachary Quinto when reading a TOS novel, who are we to object?
__________________
www.gregcox-author.com
Greg Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 05:11 PM   #23
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

^Right. These are variations in artistic interpretation, like the difference between the way John Byrne draws Superman and the way Bruce Timm draws him. What we're seeing is not a documentary from the future, it's a work of art representing -- and interpreting -- a hypothetical future. No interpretation can be held up as the definitive "true" version because they're all equally imaginary.

As a rule, I imagine the original cast when reading a TOS novel, but lately I tend to prefer imagining Greenwood as Pike because he was simply so much more appealing in the role than Hunter.

And when I re-read Vanguard a while back, I tried imagining Alice Eve as the young Carol Marcus, but it didn't work very well because I don't know what she sounds like with an American accent.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is online now   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 05:18 PM   #24
Greg Cox
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Oxford, PA
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

On the other hand, I recently gave Uhura a line of dialogue that, in retrospect, sounded more like Zoe Saldana than Nichelle Nichols. I went back and tweaked it while doing some final revisions.
__________________
www.gregcox-author.com
Greg Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 05:22 PM   #25
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
On the other hand, I recently gave Uhura a line of dialogue that, in retrospect, sounded more like Zoe Saldana than Nichelle Nichols. I went back and tweaked it while doing some final revisions.
Well, that's different, I think. How they look is open to interpretation, but how they behave strikes me as a more genuine variation between timelines, because the characters have had different life experiences.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is online now   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 05:34 PM   #26
Greg Cox
Vice Admiral
 
Location: Oxford, PA
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Christopher wrote: View Post
Greg Cox wrote: View Post
On the other hand, I recently gave Uhura a line of dialogue that, in retrospect, sounded more like Zoe Saldana than Nichelle Nichols. I went back and tweaked it while doing some final revisions.
Well, that's different, I think. How they look is open to interpretation, but how they behave strikes me as a more genuine variation between timelines, because the characters have had different life experiences.
Exactly. Their speech patterns are somewhat different and the actors put slightly different spins on the characters. Pegg's Scotty is arguably more comic than Doohan's, for example. NuChekov is more of a whiz-kid prodigy than the earlier version.The new Spock and Uhura have a whole different dynamic that informs their interactions, and so on.
__________________
www.gregcox-author.com
Greg Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 1 2013, 07:11 PM   #27
Sci
Admiral
 
Sci's Avatar
 
Location: "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Christopher wrote: View Post
And when I re-read Vanguard a while back, I tried imagining Alice Eve as the young Carol Marcus, but it didn't work very well because I don't know what she sounds like with an American accent.
She uses an American Midwestern accent in the movie She's Out of My League.
__________________
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it." - George Orwell, 1946
Sci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 2 2013, 03:11 AM   #28
Therin of Andor
Admiral
 
Therin of Andor's Avatar
 
Location: New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
View Therin of Andor's Twitter Profile
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

TJ Sinclair wrote: View Post
How does the author using the Abramsverse version of Pike place the book in the Prime Universe?
"Performance". Not the setting, nor the storyline, just Greenwood's interpretation of the character is from the new timeline.
__________________
Thiptho lapth! Ian (Entire post is personal opinion)
The Andor Files @ http://andorfiles.blogspot.com/
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/
Therin of Andor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 2 2013, 03:27 AM   #29
The Wormhole
Admiral
 
The Wormhole's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
TJ Sinclair wrote: View Post
How does the author using the Abramsverse version of Pike place the book in the Prime Universe?
"Performance". Not the setting, nor the storyline, just Greenwood's interpretation of the character is from the new timeline.
The irony was while reading The Children of Kings I thought it was a spot-on characterization of Pike as played by Hunter. I didn't even think of Greenwood at all.
__________________
"Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.
The Wormhole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 2 2013, 03:38 AM   #30
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: NuTrek references in the novels

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
"Performance". Not the setting, nor the storyline, just Greenwood's interpretation of the character is from the new timeline.
You're misremembering. From the Author's Note to The Children of Kings (p. 403):
...J. J. Abrams's 2009 reimagining of Trek not only recharged my twenty-third-century batteries, but freed me of the need to write specifically to one vision of humanity's future.

The Children of Kings is a prequel to that 2009 film; the Enterprise as it might have been under Captain Christopher Pike (though I have to admit when I was writing Pike's scenes, I still pictured Jeffrey Hunter, rather than Bruce Greenwood. Old habits, dying hard, I suppose).
So it sounds to me like just the reverse of what you said -- it was intended to evoke the new timeline, but the portrayal of Pike (and some other details) drew more on the original version.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:21 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.