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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

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Old September 21 2013, 11:06 PM   #256
DorkBoy [TM]
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

Christopher wrote: View Post
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When they introduced Saavik in TWOK it seemed like they intended her to be a core member of the cast.
Yes. The idea, at least tentatively, was to gradually phase out the original, aging cast and phase in a "next generation," so to speak, of younger leads. But instead nostalgia won out, every change the movies tried to make was undone within two movies, and the TOS cast was stuck in a rut for the rest of their careers rather than having any kind of plausible career or personal advancement.
Yeah. The DC comics assumption that she would take over Spock's old position was actually a pretty good one, I thought.
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Old September 21 2013, 11:50 PM   #257
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

DorkBoy [TM] wrote: View Post
Yeah. The DC comics assumption that she would take over Spock's old position was actually a pretty good one, I thought.
I haven't read the comics in question, but her taking over the science office position doesn't make much sense to me. She has command school training, and was at navigation during TWoK; what qualifies her to serve as science officer?
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Old September 21 2013, 11:54 PM   #258
Sran
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

Christopher wrote: View Post
Yes. The idea, at least tentatively, was to gradually phase out the original, aging cast and phase in a "next generation," so to speak, of younger leads. But instead nostalgia won out, every change the movies tried to make was undone within two movies, and the TOS cast was stuck in a rut for the rest of their careers rather than having any kind of plausible career or personal advancement.
I've always wondered what might have been had the Enterprise been manned by Decker, Saavik, Xon, and others. I could see Kirk sticking around as a recurring character. Maybe he makes an appearance or two in the films. But I'd have liked seeing a younger group of officers undertaking their own missions. The TOS films are great, but as you said, everything more or less resets every few films, as if none of the crew ever advance or take on new assignments.

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Old September 21 2013, 11:59 PM   #259
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

ATimson wrote: View Post
I haven't read the comics in question, but her taking over the science office position doesn't make much sense to me. She has command school training, and was at navigation during TWoK; what qualifies her to serve as science officer?
Does seem kinda like Vulcan stereotyping, doesn't it? Then again, she was Spock's protegee, so it's not implausible that she would've taken an interest in sciences even if it wasn't her ultimate choice of focus at the Academy.
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Old September 22 2013, 12:27 AM   #260
Sran
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

^And don't forget Kirk's own biases. Remember what he told Decker after Sonak died: "I'd still like a Vulcan there if possible." As Academy superintendent, he had the authority to make crew assignments to Enterprise when using the vessel as his flagship. For all we know, Saavik at the science station was his idea, not Spock's.

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Old September 22 2013, 01:09 AM   #261
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

Sran wrote: View Post
As Academy superintendent, he had the authority to make crew assignments to Enterprise when using the vessel as his flagship. For all we know, Saavik at the science station was his idea, not Spock's.
Since Spock was dead when DC Comics started its run...
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Old September 22 2013, 01:15 AM   #262
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

ATimson wrote: View Post
I haven't read the comics in question, but her taking over the science office position doesn't make much sense to me. She has command school training, and was at navigation during TWoK; what qualifies her to serve as science officer?
Don't forget Decker took over as both exec and science officer in TMP before Spock rendezvoused with the ship, because he was, apparently, the only qualified individual in the entire crew! I realize that the Enterprise was just getting ready to launch, and not all the crew was aboard, but really, there were only two people on the entire ship qualified to run the science station?

So I guess Saavik would've been qualified to run the sciences station in STII.
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Old September 22 2013, 01:18 AM   #263
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

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So I guess Saavik would've been qualified to run the sciences station in STII.
Not necessarily. More than twelve years passed between TMP and TWOK. The Enterprise design was new in 2273, but other ships used similar systems by 2285. It's likely she'd have been able to use the station properly. After all, we see Chekov there in TSFS. And he was stupid.

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Old September 22 2013, 01:59 AM   #264
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

^Let's keep in mind that, going by production order, Chekov was introduced as an assistant science officer, and wasn't seen at navigation until his third episode.
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Old September 22 2013, 02:06 AM   #265
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

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^Let's keep in mind that, going by production order, Chekov was introduced as an assistant science officer, and wasn't seen at navigation until his third episode.
You're right. But that doesn't explain how he'd have been trained on the new design by the time TSFS rolled around. I'd guess he had a chance to learn during the ship's second five-year mission before leaving for Reliant, but it's not clear. Chekov seemed to bounce from station to station depending on which film was taking place (tactical/security ----> XO ----> navigator ----> science -----> navigator).

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Old September 22 2013, 02:17 AM   #266
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

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You're right. But that doesn't explain how he'd have been trained on the new design by the time TSFS rolled around.
What do you mean, "new design?" Aside from the out-of-universe replacement of the original film projectors with video monitors, the bridge stations in TSFS were the exact same ones from TMP, which means they'd been unchanged for at least 12 years. And Reliant had the exact same design too (since it was a redress of the same bridge set). Do you really think that Chekov got from security chief to first officer without ever training on the science station?
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Old September 22 2013, 02:29 AM   #267
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

Christopher wrote: View Post
What do you mean, "new design?" Aside from the out-of-universe replacement of the original film projectors with video monitors, the bridge stations in TSFS were the exact same ones from TMP, which means they'd been unchanged for at least 12 years. And Reliant had the exact same design too (since it was a redress of the same bridge set). Do you really think that Chekov got from security chief to first officer without ever training on the science station?
You misunderstood what I was saying. My earlier comments were in response to a poster who remarked that as of TMP, only Decker had been trained on the new design of the Enterprise, which was why Kirk asked him to serve as science officer after Sonak died. Chekov was aboard but served as security chief and tactical officer.

By the time we get to TSFS, Chekov is at the science station, which means he would have learned the new design in the intervening twelve years. That was my point. Not that the bridge design was different between TMP and TWOK/TSFS.

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Old September 22 2013, 08:34 PM   #268
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

In The Shocks of Adversity, Chekov's absence in TAS is explained by him being cross-trained in all divisions, under Spock's guidance. As such, he spents more time below-decks and away from the bridge.

This could be the timeframe where he earned his full qualification of the various stations.
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Old September 22 2013, 09:33 PM   #269
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

^We're talking specifically about the post-refit configuration of the science station, so that's obviously not something he could've learned during the 5-year mission.

(Also, in Ex Machina, I established that Chekov had been on extended leave during TAS.)
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Old September 22 2013, 11:42 PM   #270
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Re: News about early 2014 schedule

ATimson wrote: View Post
DorkBoy [TM] wrote: View Post
Yeah. The DC comics assumption that she would take over Spock's old position was actually a pretty good one, I thought.
I haven't read the comics in question, but her taking over the science office position doesn't make much sense to me. She has command school training, and was at navigation during TWoK; what qualifies her to serve as science officer?
I always assumed David Marcus would take over as Science Officer, and Saavik would be First Officer, till Shatner tired of the captain role, at which point Captain Saavik would've taken over.
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