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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old September 20 2013, 08:16 PM   #16
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Whenever someone would complain that the classic movie Enterprise lacked an aft torpedo launcher, I'd reply that should extra torpedo launchers (or anything else) ever be needed, a hatch would open up somewhere on the hull with them behind.

And they did that... and then some!
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Old September 20 2013, 08:39 PM   #17
Hartzilla2007
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

SeerSGB wrote: View Post
WarpFactorZ wrote: View Post
Remember, Starfleet is a peace-keeping organization. I guess they felt the addition of 100 or so torpedo tubes to the ship helped reach that goal.
Even Scotty called Kirk out on it. That's one of the points that was being made, Marcus, and his ilk were turning Starfleet into just another interstellar war-machine; this isn't the Starfleet the crew signed up to join.
Yeah, I'm kind of the opinion that Marcus was in the right until he tried to murder Kirk and his crew, start a war with the Klingons, and thawed out Khan to help with his plans, oh and the whole assignation without trial plan.

Because until those points all marcus was doing was beefing up Starfleet to deal with threats (aka what they started doing in the TNG era after the Borg kicked their asses into the dirt) and getting over the delusion that they weren't a military.

I mean hell I still don't get why Marcus would be worried about Kirk or someone blabbing about Section 31 in this movie considering it was described as a Starfleet division that designs defenses and gathers intelligence on potential threats to the federation (instead of the typical criminal organization that engages in terrorism from the TNG era), I mean why would he be worried about that, that sounds reasonable.

I mean seriously what is it about acknowledging that the universe isn't all sunshine and kittens and that there are things out there that want nothing more than to kill you in the most horrible ways imaginable and don't give a crap how you feel about it either because they can't or they just don't want to and that some steps should be taken to protect yourself from them that some people in the trek universe and even in the fandom have trouble with accepting
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Old September 20 2013, 08:44 PM   #18
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Jeyl wrote: View Post
Also kind of hard to sell the idea that weaponizing Starfleet is bad when this Enterprise has more weapons than all the previous Enterprises combined, and we're supposed to shun the Vengeance because it has a lot of weapons.
I just assumed that those broadside torpedo launchers were specific only to the mission (say, in Galaxy-class-style interchangeable modules), though it still doesn't explain why, then, there's such a prominent dual torpedo launcher facing the front of the ship anyway.

But your point specifically reminds me that, for all the weapons this Enterprise has, she never had a chance to fire a single shot in the movie. I doubt it was intentional on the part of the writers that all those weapons were useless and impotent in the end -- if it really *were* intentional, it could have made an effective counterpoint to Marcus' war machine approach, that more weapons doesn't mean better or more secure.
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Old September 20 2013, 08:51 PM   #19
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

SeerSGB wrote: View Post
WarpFactorZ wrote: View Post
Remember, Starfleet is a peace-keeping organization. I guess they felt the addition of 100 or so torpedo tubes to the ship helped reach that goal.
Even Scotty called Kirk out on it. That's one of the points that was being made, Marcus, and his ilk were turning Starfleet into just another interstellar war-machine; this isn't the Starfleet the crew signed up to join.
Wait. So Marcus is really Harve Bennett?
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Old September 20 2013, 08:59 PM   #20
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

I was going with the assumption that the side torpedo launchers were originally intended to launch probes and other scientific equipment, and they were just repurposed into weapon's launchers.

Alson it only appeared to be maybe twelve tubes per side, with the rest ready for immediate reloading.
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Old September 20 2013, 09:00 PM   #21
Hartzilla2007
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Cyke101 wrote: View Post
But it could have made an effective counterpoint to Marcus' war machine approach, that more weapons doesn't mean better or more secure.
Mostly because Marcus fired his more and better weapons first from is more combat oriented vessel while Kirk tried to use the Picardian talk your way out of a fight maneuver against and opponent who wasn't having any of that and promptly blew the crap out of him.
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Old September 20 2013, 09:52 PM   #22
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
Cyke101 wrote: View Post
But it could have made an effective counterpoint to Marcus' war machine approach, that more weapons doesn't mean better or more secure.
Mostly because Marcus fired his more and better weapons first from is more combat oriented vessel while Kirk tried to use the Picardian talk your way out of a fight maneuver against and opponent who wasn't having any of that and promptly blew the crap out of him.
Oh, but how was Marcus defeated? By beaming over a superweapon in humanoid form to covertly take over the ship.

Our message for today, kids: at your Wheaties, wear black, and try eugenics for a change! Starfleet shouldn't be a war machine, it should be pro-CIA/NSA. Don't forget your cloaks and daggers (I keed, I keed)
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Old September 20 2013, 10:04 PM   #23
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

BillJ wrote: View Post
Shilliam Watner wrote: View Post
I mean really. I watched the movie tonight as Sulu gave his threatening speech to Khan and saw the torpedoes being put into the tubes.
Makes sense from a combat perspective. You don't have to maneuver the ship around as much in order to fire torpedoes.
Shouldn't makeone blind bit of difference, Photon torpedeos aren't fire and forget weapons that only continue to move in the direction they are fired. They could in theroy track a target and adjust their course. Of course that does mean the enemy has a greater chance of being able to intercept them.
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Old September 21 2013, 12:14 AM   #24
Hartzilla2007
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

MacLeod wrote: View Post
Shouldn't makeone blind bit of difference, Photon torpedeos aren't fire and forget weapons that only continue to move in the direction they are fired.
funny that torpedo in Star Trek 6 seemed to have no trouble changing course when it locked on to Chang's ship.
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Old September 21 2013, 12:23 AM   #25
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
Shouldn't makeone blind bit of difference, Photon torpedeos aren't fire and forget weapons that only continue to move in the direction they are fired.
funny that torpedo in Star Trek 6 seemed to have no trouble changing course when it locked on to Chang's ship.
To be fair, the poor thing just had major bypass surgery, a lot of that could have been spasms.
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Old September 21 2013, 03:14 AM   #26
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
Hartzilla2007 wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
Shouldn't makeone blind bit of difference, Photon torpedeos aren't fire and forget weapons that only continue to move in the direction they are fired.
funny that torpedo in Star Trek 6 seemed to have no trouble changing course when it locked on to Chang's ship.
To be fair, the poor thing just had major bypass surgery, a lot of that could have been spasms.
The STVI-TUC torpedo was the only thing that to me was deserving of the name. Although looking up the official definition, I now see that a weapon can be called a torpedo yet be neither self-propelled nor self-maneuvering. IMO, you need both to be called a torpedo, though, but I have seen Hunt for Red October too many times.
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Old September 21 2013, 03:56 AM   #27
Kruezerman
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

I liked it. It's a big ship so she can fit extra tubes on the side. I've never liked the idea that entire sections of a ship were simply empty, waiting for a mission so that they can be used. It seemed like such a waste. With those side torpedo tubes, now she can defend herself 360 degrees!

They did a good job in giving the Enterprise crew actual jobs and purpose, instead of just a bunch of people wandering lovely hallways.
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Old September 21 2013, 04:08 AM   #28
Shilliam Watner
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

I still don't like the way they launched Mudd's ship out the side of the ship.
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Old September 21 2013, 04:11 AM   #29
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

Kruezerman wrote: View Post
I liked it. It's a big ship so she can fit extra tubes on the side. I've never liked the idea that entire sections of a ship were simply empty, waiting for a mission so that they can be used. It seemed like such a waste. With those side torpedo tubes, now she can defend herself 360 degrees!

They did a good job in giving the Enterprise crew actual jobs and purpose, instead of just a bunch of people wandering lovely hallways.
My only problem with the side tubes is that they're stuck in the engineering section, which is already cram packed with machinery and presumably storage. Plus it's a bit risky to line both sides of that section with weapons that could chain-detonate and destroy the ship if the enemy gets a lucky hit on the tubes before the torps launch. (Yeah, I know the Vengeance manages to somehow not get reduced to atoms, but that's the power of plot for you).
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Old September 21 2013, 04:19 AM   #30
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Re: What The Hell? What Is Up With The Side Hull Torpedo Bays?

bullethead wrote: View Post
(...but that's the power of plot for you).
There's your answer to EVERYTHING Star Trek.
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