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Old September 18 2013, 10:14 PM   #31
R. Star
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

The biggest weakness of Real Life is... that's such an emotional and moving moment for the Doctor that defines his psyche and changes him forever.... so naturally it's never mentioned again.
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Old September 19 2013, 02:17 PM   #32
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

R. Star wrote: View Post
The biggest weakness of Real Life is... that's such an emotional and moving moment for the Doctor that defines his psyche and changes him forever.... so naturally it's never mentioned again.
I don't think it's someting that NEEDS to be specifically brought up again..."hey doc, how's that dead daughter of yours"

but it was maintained more in his behavior after that point. It was something that shaped his personality and outlook and that is what stayed wit him for the rest of the show
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Old September 19 2013, 08:14 PM   #33
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

How did it shape him? He didn't grieve with his family. He didn't follow-up with his son or wife. It's like "OK, I got through the death of the daughter, so that's all I need to know. I'm done."

It doesn't work that way in real life.
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Old September 19 2013, 08:44 PM   #34
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

teya wrote: View Post
How did it shape him? He didn't grieve with his family. He didn't follow-up with his son or wife. It's like "OK, I got through the death of the daughter, so that's all I need to know. I'm done."

It doesn't work that way in real life.
everyone handles death differently. but it did affect his personality from that point, he seemed a little more patient. He might not have been seen grieving with his holographic family, but that doesn't mean he didn't grieve in his own way
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Old September 19 2013, 09:10 PM   #35
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

lurok wrote: View Post
... but I don't even want to mention Stormfront).

The best thing about S3 was ditching the Kazon. And it gave us Season 4.
Hey, Stormfront was the best "German" episode in all of Trek.

...and I completely agree about losing the treeheads. Star Trek's worst "villains".
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Old September 19 2013, 09:37 PM   #36
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

La la la (*covers eyes*)...I've just finished "Unity." I'm not reading the comments above. But I will say I thought "Unity" was good and I'd love to see more like this. It would be neat if the Cooperative somehow turned into a new kind of Borg enemy, or if they became enemies of the Borg who come back in a later season in a surprise to help the VOY crew defeat the Borg in a critical episode. What I'd really like to see is the origin of the Borg. That would (potentially) be interesting.

I must have been in a funny mood early this morning when I watched the episode though. When Riley touched her face and asked Chakotay if he felt it, I immediately thought it would be funny if he touched his chest and said, "did you feel that?" Also when I watched "Blood Fever" I thought it would have been funny if the Doctor (a.k.a. the Pimp in this episode) -- when he went back to the holodeck, he found Vorik wearing nothing but a lei, sweating and smoking a cigarette saying "Doctor, you're a genius."
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Old September 20 2013, 12:13 AM   #37
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

KaraBear wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
How did it shape him? He didn't grieve with his family. He didn't follow-up with his son or wife. It's like "OK, I got through the death of the daughter, so that's all I need to know. I'm done."

It doesn't work that way in real life.
everyone handles death differently. but it did affect his personality from that point, he seemed a little more patient. He might not have been seen grieving with his holographic family, but that doesn't mean he didn't grieve in his own way
At the very least it gave him an insight into emotional pain.
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Old September 20 2013, 02:02 AM   #38
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

dub wrote: View Post
La la la (*covers eyes*)...I've just finished "Unity." I'm not reading the comments above. But I will say I thought "Unity" was good and I'd love to see more like this. It would be neat if the Cooperative somehow turned into a new kind of Borg enemy, or if they became enemies of the Borg who come back in a later season in a surprise to help the VOY crew defeat the Borg in a critical episode. What I'd really like to see is the origin of the Borg. That would (potentially) be interesting.
What I loved about this episode is that it suggests that the Borg can be a social and cultural group that is independent of specific political goals (radical assimilation). I like the idea that there are different kinds of Borg: a diversity, which flies in the face of the Borg as cultural (and political and technological) assimilators.
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Old September 20 2013, 01:45 PM   #39
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

teacake wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
How did it shape him? He didn't grieve with his family. He didn't follow-up with his son or wife. It's like "OK, I got through the death of the daughter, so that's all I need to know. I'm done."

It doesn't work that way in real life.
everyone handles death differently. but it did affect his personality from that point, he seemed a little more patient. He might not have been seen grieving with his holographic family, but that doesn't mean he didn't grieve in his own way
At the very least it gave him an insight into emotional pain.
exactly!
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Old September 20 2013, 04:41 PM   #40
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

KaraBear wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post

everyone handles death differently. but it did affect his personality from that point, he seemed a little more patient. He might not have been seen grieving with his holographic family, but that doesn't mean he didn't grieve in his own way
At the very least it gave him an insight into emotional pain.
exactly!
I thought it showed us his innate self-centeredness. It wasn't about the familial loss for him. It wasn't about "how can I support my wife and son?"

It was about how it affected him and only him.

And in that, there was certainly continuity.
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Old September 20 2013, 04:51 PM   #41
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

teya wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post

At the very least it gave him an insight into emotional pain.
exactly!
I thought it showed us his innate self-centeredness. It wasn't about the familial loss for him. It wasn't about "how can I support my wife and son?"

It was about how it affected him and only him.

And in that, there was certainly continuity.
but it was only a loss for him, the others were just holograms and he knew that.

I've lost people very close to me, and when that happened my first thougths were not oh how can I support my family, but my first thoughts were of my own grief over the loss. Once I dealt with my own feelings I could be supportive to other people. Maybe that makes me a selfish A-hole, but everyone deals with loss their own way.
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Old September 20 2013, 05:04 PM   #42
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

But the Doc's whole schtick was about how holograms were just like people.

As for your extrapolation to insinuate that I'm calling you a "selfish A-hole"...

I'm not. I am describing my impression of the episode and what it showed me about the Doctor. It's not personal.

I'm an oddity. While I think Picardo did an awesome job, I simply didn't *like* the Doctor. He was a great character, but not a likeable one IMO. Which is fine in my book because the unlikeable characters are usually more interesting.
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Old September 20 2013, 05:15 PM   #43
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

teya wrote: View Post
But the Doc's whole schtick was about how holograms were just like people.

As for your extrapolation to insinuate that I'm calling you a "selfish A-hole"...

I'm not. I am describing my impression of the episode and what it showed me about the Doctor. It's not personal.

I'm an oddity. While I think Picardo did an awesome job, I simply didn't *like* the Doctor. He was a great character, but not a likeable one IMO. Which is fine in my book because the unlikeable characters are usually more interesting.
yeah, and PEOPLE deal with grief in their own way, some turn inward some cling to others. I wouldn't call anyone selfish for however they grieve. If they need to take care of themselves first I don't think that makes them selfish

Edit: the unlikeableness of the doctor...while I did like him, wasn't he supposed to be unlikeable? isn't that why starfleet trashed his line?
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Old September 20 2013, 05:24 PM   #44
teya
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

KaraBear wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
But the Doc's whole schtick was about how holograms were just like people.

As for your extrapolation to insinuate that I'm calling you a "selfish A-hole"...

I'm not. I am describing my impression of the episode and what it showed me about the Doctor. It's not personal.

I'm an oddity. While I think Picardo did an awesome job, I simply didn't *like* the Doctor. He was a great character, but not a likeable one IMO. Which is fine in my book because the unlikeable characters are usually more interesting.
yeah, and PEOPLE deal with grief in their own way, some turn inward some cling to others. I wouldn't call anyone selfish for however they grieve. If they need to take care of themselves first I don't think that makes them selfish
He *never* (that we saw) took care of the rest of his family. The program was over once he played out the scenario & did his own grieving. He didn't take it the rest of the way, that yes, all of us people eventually, one way or another, get around to. We turn to each other. We take care of each other.
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Old September 20 2013, 05:50 PM   #45
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Re: Thoughts on Season 3

teya wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
But the Doc's whole schtick was about how holograms were just like people.

As for your extrapolation to insinuate that I'm calling you a "selfish A-hole"...

I'm not. I am describing my impression of the episode and what it showed me about the Doctor. It's not personal.

I'm an oddity. While I think Picardo did an awesome job, I simply didn't *like* the Doctor. He was a great character, but not a likeable one IMO. Which is fine in my book because the unlikeable characters are usually more interesting.
yeah, and PEOPLE deal with grief in their own way, some turn inward some cling to others. I wouldn't call anyone selfish for however they grieve. If they need to take care of themselves first I don't think that makes them selfish
He *never* (that we saw) took care of the rest of his family. The program was over once he played out the scenario & did his own grieving. He didn't take it the rest of the way, that yes, all of us people eventually, one way or another, get around to. We turn to each other. We take care of each other.
well considering that the episode ends with the Doc in a very tight hug with his wife and son, I assume they did take care of each other, even though it wasn't specifically spelled out for us
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