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General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

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Old September 19 2013, 09:01 PM   #1
Noddy
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The Valtane Enigma

I'm aware this has probably been discussed to death elsewhere, but I'm fairly new around these parts, so bear with me. The character of Valtane, who first appeared in Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country, reappeared in the VOY episode "Flashback", which depicted additional events during that movie. In the TV episode, Valtane dies before the USS Excelsior gets to Khitomer, but as everyone knows, he appeared alive and well on the bridge of the Excelsior at the end of TUC, after the battle of Khitomer. Now I've heard a lot of theories trying to reconcile this - Valtane has a twin brother, he recovered in sickbay, Tuvok's memory was faulty - and none of them really click for me. Valtane looks a bit too well to have recovered in sickbay at the end of TUC - I'd imagine he'd probably be recuperating for a while, not going straight back on the bridge, minus even any scars - and besides, the clear implication of the TV episode was that Valtane died, and that was the reason the virus left his body and transferred itself to Tuvok. And why would Tuvok's memory specifically home in on this time period if it wasn't when he caught the virus?
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Old September 19 2013, 09:11 PM   #2
MikeS
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Flashback was not a time-travel episode, it took place in Tuvok's head. As it was a "memory virus", I have no problem believing that it could have affected his memory of the incident.
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Old September 19 2013, 11:01 PM   #3
Praetor
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

And it'd be easy to say that Valtane technically did die, but was resuscitated immediately afterward off-camera.
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Old September 19 2013, 11:10 PM   #4
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Voyager got it wrong.
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Old September 19 2013, 11:38 PM   #5
Opus
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Valtane has a twin brother. In TUC when the Praxis wave hit Excelsior, one Valtane brother is seen next to Sulu's captain's chair and another Valtane brother is seen in a cutaway shot at the science station reacting to the shockwave. Check it out, it's really there!

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Old September 19 2013, 11:44 PM   #6
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Valtaine had a twin. Problem solved.
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Old September 19 2013, 11:45 PM   #7
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

I think this is what they call in the Star Trek universe a continuity error.
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Old September 19 2013, 11:48 PM   #8
MacLeod
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Pick any of the theories you like, the simple plan fact is that the writers screwed up. They either

1.>Couldn't care
2.>Didn't think the fans would notice
3.>Didn't think the fans would care
4.>Other
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Old September 19 2013, 11:49 PM   #9
R. Star
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

5. Didn't notice themselves.
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Old September 20 2013, 12:14 AM   #10
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Surely you don't mean they didn't even bother to do some basic research like rewatching TUC?
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Old September 20 2013, 03:05 AM   #11
The Wormhole
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Flashback got a lot wrong in regards to TUC. In Flashback, Sulu takes the Excelsior into Klingon space to rescue Kirk and Bones a few days after the Praxis explosion. But in TUC, few months go by after the explosion before Gorkon and his staff arrive on the Enterprise for dinner. Honestly, Tuvok has a faulty memory is the best excuse for everything. Valtane, timing of the Praxis incident.

But the part that really bothers me is when Janeway looks up everything in Starfleet records, which includes the Excelsior's sensor logs on the nebula and a log entry from Sulu saying the ship is undergoing minor repairs. Why is this in the starship's database? Wouldn't it be more convenient for it to be in space Wikipedia, or Memory Alpha which starship crews can access via space internet? Sure, that would mean the Voyager crew wouldn't have access to this, but really does Starfleet actually load up each starship's database with every sensor readings the ship made and every mundane captain's log entry? Besides, how the hell does someone read a log entry from Sulu saying his ship is undergoing minor repairs and decide "starships 80 years in the future are going to need to know that."
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Old September 20 2013, 08:55 AM   #12
Tiberius
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Flashback got a lot wrong in regards to TUC. In Flashback, Sulu takes the Excelsior into Klingon space to rescue Kirk and Bones a few days after the Praxis explosion. But in TUC, few months go by after the explosion before Gorkon and his staff arrive on the Enterprise for dinner. Honestly, Tuvok has a faulty memory is the best excuse for everything. Valtane, timing of the Praxis incident.

But the part that really bothers me is when Janeway looks up everything in Starfleet records, which includes the Excelsior's sensor logs on the nebula and a log entry from Sulu saying the ship is undergoing minor repairs. Why is this in the starship's database? Wouldn't it be more convenient for it to be in space Wikipedia, or Memory Alpha which starship crews can access via space internet? Sure, that would mean the Voyager crew wouldn't have access to this, but really does Starfleet actually load up each starship's database with every sensor readings the ship made and every mundane captain's log entry? Besides, how the hell does someone read a log entry from Sulu saying his ship is undergoing minor repairs and decide "starships 80 years in the future are going to need to know that."
Well, given that it's basically a text file, and also given that the size of a starship's databanks are practically infinite, why not?
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Old September 20 2013, 09:05 AM   #13
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Like anything else the size/contents of the databanks on a ship/base are plot driven.
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Old September 20 2013, 02:16 PM   #14
The Wormhole
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

Tiberius wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Flashback got a lot wrong in regards to TUC. In Flashback, Sulu takes the Excelsior into Klingon space to rescue Kirk and Bones a few days after the Praxis explosion. But in TUC, few months go by after the explosion before Gorkon and his staff arrive on the Enterprise for dinner. Honestly, Tuvok has a faulty memory is the best excuse for everything. Valtane, timing of the Praxis incident.

But the part that really bothers me is when Janeway looks up everything in Starfleet records, which includes the Excelsior's sensor logs on the nebula and a log entry from Sulu saying the ship is undergoing minor repairs. Why is this in the starship's database? Wouldn't it be more convenient for it to be in space Wikipedia, or Memory Alpha which starship crews can access via space internet? Sure, that would mean the Voyager crew wouldn't have access to this, but really does Starfleet actually load up each starship's database with every sensor readings the ship made and every mundane captain's log entry? Besides, how the hell does someone read a log entry from Sulu saying his ship is undergoing minor repairs and decide "starships 80 years in the future are going to need to know that."
Well, given that it's basically a text file, and also given that the size of a starship's databanks are practically infinite, why not?
Even if it is a simple text file in a database of near infinite capacity, why would anyone think a log entry on stardate 9521 about the Excelsior undergoing minor repairs is significant enough to remember? Does Starfleet actually load up the databases on each ship with every trivial log entry?

Must have sucked for the Equinox, I imagine due to damage they were cut off from their database. They wouldn't be able to read about that time Captain Harriman ordered a fresh coat of paint on the doors to crew quarters on deck 6 on the Enterprise B. No wonder they felt they had to slaughter those aliens.
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Last edited by The Wormhole; September 21 2013 at 01:15 AM.
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Old September 20 2013, 04:09 PM   #15
Praetor
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Re: The Valtane Enigma

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Must have sucked for the Equinox, I imagine due to damage they were cut off from their database. They wouldn't be able to read about that time Captain Harriman ordered a fresh coat of paint on the doors crew quarters on deck 6 on the Enterprise B. No wonder they felt they had to slaughter those aliens.


Starship databases are proportionate to the number of ships in a system/sector/quadrant... they scale according to plot.
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