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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old September 18 2013, 03:34 PM   #76
BillJ
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Roddenberry did it out of artistic integrity. Abrams does it because he's a hack.
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Old September 18 2013, 03:34 PM   #77
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

You just keep telling yourself that.
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Old September 18 2013, 03:35 PM   #78
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
You just keep telling yourself that.
I think The Wormhole was being a touch sarcastic.
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Old September 18 2013, 03:39 PM   #79
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

After some of the things I've heard on this site, it can be hard to tell
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Old September 18 2013, 04:56 PM   #80
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

Shazam! wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Yanks wrote: View Post
..and we're all supposed to line up and praise this thing because it made money...
I praise it because both the critics and public at large thought it was the best blockbuster of the summer
So you only like because other people do?
It's worthy of praise as it made Trek very accessible and relevant in 2013. The box office and non-trekkie critics reflect that.

To re-launch Trek with those high budgets in the way how you are familiar with Trek back in 1994-1999 would further make Trek so elite, inaccessible and even unpalatable beyond repair.

It seems that there are some who rather Trek die with it's limited appeal because it worked OK in their day and to their own tastes of relentless technobabble and cheesy exchange of dialog than to attract and inspire many more people who could like Trek and become life long fans themselves.
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Old September 18 2013, 05:44 PM   #81
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

Mach5 wrote: View Post
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Hmmm.... I like or dislike something because I like or dislike it. I don't really care what "the critics" say.
I read reviews because I appreciate different perspectives, but I too like to make up my own mind. Just like I made my mind about Bridesmaids 45 minutes in when I decided that this critically acclaimed pile of unfunny already killed too many of my brain cells and pressed the stop button.


I enjoy reading different perspective as well.
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Old September 18 2013, 05:49 PM   #82
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

anh165 wrote: View Post
Shazam! wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
I praise it because both the critics and public at large thought it was the best blockbuster of the summer
So you only like because other people do?
It seems that there are some who rather Trek die with it's limited appeal because it worked OK in their day and to their own tastes of relentless technobabble and cheesy exchange of dialog than to attract and inspire many more people who could like Trek and become life long fans themselves.
That's not a fair assessment IMHO. Abrams and the writers would have more credibility with me if they developed some original material for our traditional characters. It's the alternate timeline that sticks in my craw. Pre-TOS material could've been terrific on its own. Take the characters through the academy and their initial sojourns into space. Pike could've been the vehicle to tie it all together. Instead, we have to destroy 2 fundamental cultures (and their homes), kill off Kirk's father and ruin his childhood, in essence changing all the core events that created the Kirk and crew that we know AND have come to love. As I wrote in an earlier post, all Abrams has done is to turn everything upside down and call it art. Are you telling me that all of the character destruction was necessary to make Trek accessible to newer audiences? Rubbish.
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Old September 18 2013, 05:55 PM   #83
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

anh165 wrote: View Post
Shazam! wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
I praise it because both the critics and public at large thought it was the best blockbuster of the summer
So you only like because other people do?
It's worthy of praise as it made Trek very accessible and relevant in 2013. The box office and non-trekkie critics reflect that.

To re-launch Trek with those high budgets in the way how you are familiar with Trek back in 1994-1999 would further make Trek so elite, inaccessible and even unpalatable beyond repair.

It seems that there are some who rather Trek die with it's limited appeal because it worked OK in their day and to their own tastes of relentless technobabble and cheesy exchange of dialog than to attract and inspire many more people who could like Trek and become life long fans themselves.
That's a false dichotomy. Plenty of Star Trek has had commercial appeal in spite of (1) being "heady", (2) skimping on the special effects, and (3) preferring dialogue over action. It's difficult to account for the successes of TVH or TNG without noticing those things. And even though it used military-style conflict, TWOK was weak in terms of special effects, even for its day. Conversely, Nemesis still sucked even though it was thematically lighter, had a bigger effects budget, emphasized more action, and was directed by someone who could care less for trek.
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Old September 18 2013, 05:57 PM   #84
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

BillJ wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
You just keep telling yourself that.
I think The Wormhole was being a touch sarcastic.
And yet, he nalied it in one sentence.
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Old September 18 2013, 06:12 PM   #85
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

Admiral2 wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
You just keep telling yourself that.
I think The Wormhole was being a touch sarcastic.
And yet, he nalied it in one sentence.
If you've read anything at all about Roddenberry, you'd know that his name and integrity never belong in the same sentence.
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Old September 18 2013, 08:09 PM   #86
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

BillJ wrote: View Post
Admiral2 wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post

I think The Wormhole was being a touch sarcastic.
And yet, he nalied it in one sentence.
If you've read anything at all about Roddenberry, you'd know that his name and integrity never belong in the same sentence.
I keep telling people, Cochrane in FC is a dig at Roddenberry. The more I've read about Gene--and I'm not talking about his personal or family life, I'm talking purely professional life--the more I think they wrote Cochrane as a way of taking on the "Great Bird" and the hero worship some fans (the TNG crew) has for him.
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Old September 18 2013, 08:23 PM   #87
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

SeerSGB wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post
Admiral2 wrote: View Post

And yet, he nalied it in one sentence.
If you've read anything at all about Roddenberry, you'd know that his name and integrity never belong in the same sentence.
I keep telling people, Cochrane in FC is a dig at Roddenberry. The more I've read about Gene--and I'm not talking about his personal or family life, I'm talking purely professional life--the more I think they wrote Cochrane as a way of taking on the "Great Bird" and the hero worship some fans (the TNG crew) has for him.
Never heard that, before. It's a very valid comparison, whether it was done deliberately or purely coincidental. I'm jealous of you for not having thought of that, myself.
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Old September 18 2013, 08:25 PM   #88
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

SeerSGB wrote: View Post
I keep telling people, Cochrane in FC is a dig at Roddenberry. The more I've read about Gene--and I'm not talking about his personal or family life, I'm talking purely professional life--the more I think they wrote Cochrane as a way of taking on the "Great Bird" and the hero worship some fans (the TNG crew) has for him.
Hmmm. I'd never got onto that before! It could very well be true!
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Old September 18 2013, 10:03 PM   #89
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

Shazam! wrote: View Post
So you only like because other people do?
Yanks wrote: View Post
Hmmm.... I like or dislike something because I like or dislike it. I don't really care what "the critics" say.
Note to both of you:

"Like" and "praise" are not synonyms.
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Old September 18 2013, 10:09 PM   #90
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Re: No More Wrath of Khan Homages

Mach5 wrote: View Post
umichigan wrote: View Post
Roddenberry, for all his faults, created Star Trek out of fresh ideas
You've never seen Forbidden Planet, have you? Or read Hornblower for that matter.
Chalk one up to Mach5!

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