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Old September 9 2013, 05:48 PM   #16
RoJoHen
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Driverless cars scare the shit out of me. Technology fails sometimes, and when that happens, humans need to be able to step in and take control. Drivers already don't pay enough attention to the road! I can only imagine how much less they'll be paying attention when they're even not responsible for driving.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:08 PM   #17
THE Robert Maxwell
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Re: Technological Stagnation

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Driverless cars scare the shit out of me. Technology fails sometimes, and when that happens, humans need to be able to step in and take control. Drivers already don't pay enough attention to the road! I can only imagine how much less they'll be paying attention when they're even not responsible for driving.
You do realize it's not hard to have safety features that include, "if everything goes pear-shaped, pull to the side of the road and slow to a stop," right?

Real life is not Star Trek. Your dashboard isn't going to yell "ERROR! ERROR!", throw sparks in your face, and fly off a cliff because it ran over an unexpected rock.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:14 PM   #18
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Re: Technological Stagnation

But modern cars are already wide open to hacking, allowing attackers to take over the engine control, brakes, and in some cases the steering. Some think the NSA cyber warfare branch is already doing this. A clever foreign attack could kill or injure millions of drivers simultaneously when they all slam into each other.

We should be building robustness instead of adding even bigger vulnerabilities.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:15 PM   #19
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Re: Technological Stagnation

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Driverless cars scare the shit out of me. Technology fails sometimes, and when that happens, humans need to be able to step in and take control. Drivers already don't pay enough attention to the road! I can only imagine how much less they'll be paying attention when they're even not responsible for driving.
In 2010 there were an estimated 5 + million with a capital M car accidents of which ~ 32,000 people were killed in the US. This makes cars IMO the biggest serial killer in America and the people who kill who are driving them.

If automation would even half that number - and I believe it could do even much better than that - you'd think the public would overwhemingly support the driverless car and the technology necessary to run it - occassional failure or not.

Wiki

But like I said earlier in this thread - privacy rights groups I'd imagine will be one of the biggest hurdles to a large scale use of any such tech.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:19 PM   #20
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Only cars with self driving require gps. You wouldn't have to retrofit all current cars on the road for the benefit of the self driving ones.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:19 PM   #21
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Driverless cars scare the shit out of me. Technology fails sometimes, and when that happens, humans need to be able to step in and take control. Drivers already don't pay enough attention to the road! I can only imagine how much less they'll be paying attention when they're even not responsible for driving.
You do realize it's not hard to have safety features that include, "if everything goes pear-shaped, pull to the side of the road and slow to a stop," right?

Real life is not Star Trek. Your dashboard isn't going to yell "ERROR! ERROR!", throw sparks in your face, and fly off a cliff because it ran over an unexpected rock.
I was thinking more like having to avoid those other random drivers who also aren't paying attention and driving like assholes. I get nervous about how a driverless car would react to certain things, or if it would react in enough time to be worth it.

How would a driverless car steer in the wintertime if it suddenly came upon a patch of ice and was about to swerve into oncoming traffic? How far ahead would a driverless car be able to see? If a family of deer suddenly jumps into the road, would the car be aware of it fast enough to avoid collision?
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Old September 9 2013, 06:28 PM   #22
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Re: Technological Stagnation

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Driverless cars scare the shit out of me. Technology fails sometimes, and when that happens, humans need to be able to step in and take control. Drivers already don't pay enough attention to the road! I can only imagine how much less they'll be paying attention when they're even not responsible for driving.
You do realize it's not hard to have safety features that include, "if everything goes pear-shaped, pull to the side of the road and slow to a stop," right?

Real life is not Star Trek. Your dashboard isn't going to yell "ERROR! ERROR!", throw sparks in your face, and fly off a cliff because it ran over an unexpected rock.
I was thinking more like having to avoid those other random drivers who also aren't paying attention and driving like assholes. I get nervous about how a driverless car would react to certain things, or if it would react in enough time to be worth it.
I can guarantee you it would react far more quickly and accurately than you or I could. I'd bet my life on it.

How would a driverless car steer in the wintertime if it suddenly came upon a patch of ice and was about to swerve into oncoming traffic? How far ahead would a driverless car be able to see? If a family of deer suddenly jumps into the road, would the car be aware of it fast enough to avoid collision?
Are you serious? Have you not driven a modern car with a traction control system/electronic stability system? This is a solved problem and doesn't even require a self-driving car.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:29 PM   #23
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post

You do realize it's not hard to have safety features that include, "if everything goes pear-shaped, pull to the side of the road and slow to a stop," right?

Real life is not Star Trek. Your dashboard isn't going to yell "ERROR! ERROR!", throw sparks in your face, and fly off a cliff because it ran over an unexpected rock.
I was thinking more like having to avoid those other random drivers who also aren't paying attention and driving like assholes. I get nervous about how a driverless car would react to certain things, or if it would react in enough time to be worth it.
I can guarantee you it would react far more quickly and accurately than you or I could. I'd bet my life on it.

How would a driverless car steer in the wintertime if it suddenly came upon a patch of ice and was about to swerve into oncoming traffic? How far ahead would a driverless car be able to see? If a family of deer suddenly jumps into the road, would the car be aware of it fast enough to avoid collision?
Are you serious? Have you not driven a modern car with a traction control system/electronic stability system? This is a solved problem and doesn't even require a self-driving car.
I guess not, and considering all the dead deer I find in the middle of the street and all the abandoned cars I find on the side of the road in the wintertime, this is still very much a problem for a large number of people.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:32 PM   #24
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Re: Technological Stagnation

sojourner wrote: View Post
Only cars with self driving require gps. You wouldn't have to retrofit all current cars on the road for the benefit of the self driving ones.
I'm not an expert on this but as I understand it in order for a large scale system to work every car would have to have GPS switched on so the automation could successfully work in sync with all of the other vehicle traffic.

It is amazing however that the Google Car has logged hundreds of thousands of miles and only 1 accident - and it was the human drivers fault in that situation.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:32 PM   #25
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Re: Technological Stagnation

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I was thinking more like having to avoid those other random drivers who also aren't paying attention and driving like assholes. I get nervous about how a driverless car would react to certain things, or if it would react in enough time to be worth it.
I can guarantee you it would react far more quickly and accurately than you or I could. I'd bet my life on it.

How would a driverless car steer in the wintertime if it suddenly came upon a patch of ice and was about to swerve into oncoming traffic? How far ahead would a driverless car be able to see? If a family of deer suddenly jumps into the road, would the car be aware of it fast enough to avoid collision?
Are you serious? Have you not driven a modern car with a traction control system/electronic stability system? This is a solved problem and doesn't even require a self-driving car.
I guess not, because this is still very much a problem for a lot of people around here.
That's because they think they're smarter than the car.

A modern car know within milliseconds if a wheel is losing traction. It can vary the speed of each wheel to compensate. A self-driving car is even more capable: it can turn the wheels, increase or decrease acceleration, selectively apply brakes at different pressures to each wheel. It can do things that a human can't possibly do in order to avoid an accident. I can't guarantee a self-driving car will never get into an accident, however the consequences of such an accident are likely to be much less than if a human was at the wheel. We simply do not have the physical capabilities to control a car the way the on-board computer can.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:34 PM   #26
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Re: Technological Stagnation

MacLeod wrote: View Post
In Theory a plane could take-off, fly to it's destinationa nd land by itself. The technology exists but would we want to fly on plane without a pilot?
Most of those operations require fairly little decision-making; it's just follow the signal logic.

Pilots are there in case decisions need to be made, because machines aren't very good at that yet.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:36 PM   #27
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Re: Technological Stagnation

I'm not saying the technology can't work. I just have a hard time putting my life in the hands of something other than myself. If the technology takes off and proves itself to be a better solution, then I'll support it. I just tend to lean on the side of caution. If I'm going to die, I'd rather it be my own fault than the fault of some computer error.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:38 PM   #28
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
I can guarantee you it would react far more quickly and accurately than you or I could. I'd bet my life on it.
We might be closer than you think. The new Mercedes S series coming out this fall will have what they call, 'autopilot.'

It will essentiall steer the car and hold the car between the lines and will auto break the vehicle if it senses a hazard.

It's not a true driverless vehcile because if the driver takes their hands off the steering wheel for more than 10 seconds it will disengage the autopilot.

Also, sad but true - most of us cannot afford an $80,000 vehicle.

Mercedes semi-driverless car
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Old September 9 2013, 06:38 PM   #29
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Re: Technological Stagnation

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I'm not saying the technology can't work. I just have a hard time putting my life in the hands of something other than myself. If the technology takes off and proves itself to be a better solution, then I'll support it. I just tend to lean on the side of caution. If I'm going to die, I'd rather it be my own fault than the fault of some computer error.
The side of caution would be not to trust humans to operate fast-moving wheeled death machines in the first place.
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Old September 9 2013, 06:42 PM   #30
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Re: Technological Stagnation

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I'm not saying the technology can't work. I just have a hard time putting my life in the hands of something other than myself. If the technology takes off and proves itself to be a better solution, then I'll support it. I just tend to lean on the side of caution. If I'm going to die, I'd rather it be my own fault than the fault of some computer error.
The side of caution would be not to trust humans to operate fast-moving wheeled death machines in the first place.
I concede that point, for sure. This is why we need transporters.

A driverless car would certainly have advantages, especially for long roadtrips. If I never have to drive myself through Nebraska again, I'll be a happy man.

But I love driving, and sometimes I just get in my car and drive around for fun without any particular destination in mind. I would need the ability to turn off the auto-pilot so that I can still drive myself around when I want to.
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