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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old September 9 2013, 04:42 PM   #151
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

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Old September 9 2013, 05:17 PM   #152
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

JWPlatt wrote: View Post
I always see people write about Anthony. I never see Anthony. He has a more mythological feeling to me, like Zeus.
Pfft. Zeus never had an account at TrekBBS. He's nobody.
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Old September 9 2013, 05:31 PM   #153
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

BillJ wrote: View Post
KirkusOveractus wrote: View Post

So much so that it's made it as a full story in Entertainment Weekly now to herald the release of STID on disc.

Thanks, knuckleheads. 100 fans just made Trek fandom a bigger joke with the general public, by saying a movie that the general public liked was the worst Trek movie.


And we wonder why the general public thinks that we're all virgins living in our parents basements.

I think the below clip pretty much says it all:

Trekkies Bash New Star Trek Film As Fun Watchable
Move over, I need that wall too
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Old September 9 2013, 05:42 PM   #154
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Well, when I look at STID and try to figure out what's wrong with Star Trek in general, this is the answer I come up with.

Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish? Outside of potentially adding Carol Marcus to the crew roster (all depends if they want to bring her back), nothing really happens in this movie that signifies any real change. Bob Orci argues that thanks to this movie, Kirk has now earned the Captain's chair! Well, in my opinion, he earned the Captain's chair during the pre-title sequence when he violated the Prime Directive to save Spock. That's what I'd expect not only Kirk to do, but every Starfleet Captain to do. Yes, he lied in his report, but that should have been the real issue. Not violating the Prime Directive.

Sacrificing himself on the other hand? I don't see it as earning the Captain's chair. Anyone can sacrifice themselves to save the day. Spock did that in the last movie when he rammed the Jellyfish into the Narada, but nobody gave him any commendation. You could argue that he was saved in the end, but so was Kirk in this movie.

And it all ends the same exact way the last movie ended. After spending a good chunk of the movie on Earth, the crew are now together on the Enterprise, reporting in and getting ready to head out into deep space complete with the Star Trek opening monologue. But since the idea of exploring deep space was mostly thrown in as a pre-title sequence where the crew immediately went back to Earth, I don't have any real confidence that the writers will take that promise seriously. As Damon Lindelof said, if your a big budget action movie, you've got to save the world. I have a strong feeling we'll be back at Earth as one of the main settings/perils for the third movie.
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Old September 9 2013, 05:45 PM   #155
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Jeyl wrote: View Post

Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish?
What more did it need to accomplish?
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Old September 9 2013, 05:59 PM   #156
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

What did STID accomplish?

It entertained.

Anything more is too existential to ponder. Our sun will swallow the Earth in a great red ball of fire in 4 or 6 billion years, so what does anything really accomplish?
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Old September 9 2013, 06:40 PM   #157
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Jeyl wrote: View Post
Well, when I look at STID and try to figure out what's wrong with Star Trek in general, this is the answer I come up with.

Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish? Outside of potentially adding Carol Marcus to the crew roster (all depends if they want to bring her back), nothing really happens in this movie that signifies any real change. Bob Orci argues that thanks to this movie, Kirk has now earned the Captain's chair! Well, in my opinion, he earned the Captain's chair during the pre-title sequence when he violated the Prime Directive to save Spock. That's what I'd expect not only Kirk to do, but every Starfleet Captain to do. Yes, he lied in his report, but that should have been the real issue. Not violating the Prime Directive.

Sacrificing himself on the other hand? I don't see it as earning the Captain's chair. Anyone can sacrifice themselves to save the day. Spock did that in the last movie when he rammed the Jellyfish into the Narada, but nobody gave him any commendation. You could argue that he was saved in the end, but so was Kirk in this movie.

And it all ends the same exact way the last movie ended. After spending a good chunk of the movie on Earth, the crew are now together on the Enterprise, reporting in and getting ready to head out into deep space complete with the Star Trek opening monologue. But since the idea of exploring deep space was mostly thrown in as a pre-title sequence where the crew immediately went back to Earth, I don't have any real confidence that the writers will take that promise seriously. As Damon Lindelof said, if your a big budget action movie, you've got to save the world. I have a strong feeling we'll be back at Earth as one of the main settings/perils for the third movie.
Well, Kirk's sacrifice also made him face the reality that there are no-win scenarios (bear in mind he doesn't know he'll really survive). He was essentially reliving his father's moment in the Kelvin's captain's chair. An essential part of Kirk's character in the Prime Universe was his belief that he would always be able to cheat death. There's always a way out. In TWOK he realized he was wrong with the loss of Spock.

(I also think it was planned that Spock would be beamed out of the Jellyfish before it rammed into the Narada. So it wasn't really a suicidal/sacrificial run.)

As far as being Earth-centered goes, TMP started with Kirk on Earth and was about saving the Earth; in TWOK the mission started from Earth; TSFS started with Kirk on Earth; TVH was set on Earth and about saving it; in TUC Kirk's mission started from Earth (and coincidental to STID, became a mission to stop a plan for a Klingon-Federation war that would threaten Earth); GEN had Earth scenes; FC was set on Earth and was about saving it; NEM was about stopping a Romulan-Federation war that would of course threaten Earth.
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Old September 9 2013, 07:10 PM   #158
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Jeyl wrote: View Post
Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish?
Making the first relevant social commentary in Trek in over 20-25 years while telling an entertaining story.
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Old September 9 2013, 08:31 PM   #159
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

beamMe wrote: View Post
Jeyl wrote: View Post
Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish?
Making the first relevant social commentary in Trek in over 20-25 years while telling an entertaining story.
And one that we as a society should really consider and I can't think of another blockbuster that has done something similar.
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Old September 9 2013, 09:17 PM   #160
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Franklin wrote: View Post
Jeyl wrote: View Post
Well, when I look at STID and try to figure out what's wrong with Star Trek in general, this is the answer I come up with.

Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish? Outside of potentially adding Carol Marcus to the crew roster (all depends if they want to bring her back), nothing really happens in this movie that signifies any real change. Bob Orci argues that thanks to this movie, Kirk has now earned the Captain's chair! Well, in my opinion, he earned the Captain's chair during the pre-title sequence when he violated the Prime Directive to save Spock. That's what I'd expect not only Kirk to do, but every Starfleet Captain to do. Yes, he lied in his report, but that should have been the real issue. Not violating the Prime Directive.

Sacrificing himself on the other hand? I don't see it as earning the Captain's chair. Anyone can sacrifice themselves to save the day. Spock did that in the last movie when he rammed the Jellyfish into the Narada, but nobody gave him any commendation. You could argue that he was saved in the end, but so was Kirk in this movie.

And it all ends the same exact way the last movie ended. After spending a good chunk of the movie on Earth, the crew are now together on the Enterprise, reporting in and getting ready to head out into deep space complete with the Star Trek opening monologue. But since the idea of exploring deep space was mostly thrown in as a pre-title sequence where the crew immediately went back to Earth, I don't have any real confidence that the writers will take that promise seriously. As Damon Lindelof said, if your a big budget action movie, you've got to save the world. I have a strong feeling we'll be back at Earth as one of the main settings/perils for the third movie.
Well, Kirk's sacrifice also made him face the reality that there are no-win scenarios (bear in mind he doesn't know he'll really survive). He was essentially reliving his father's moment in the Kelvin's captain's chair. An essential part of Kirk's character in the Prime Universe was his belief that he would always be able to cheat death. There's always a way out. In TWOK he realized he was wrong with the loss of Spock.

(I also think it was planned that Spock would be beamed out of the Jellyfish before it rammed into the Narada. So it wasn't really a suicidal/sacrificial run.)

As far as being Earth-centered goes, TMP started with Kirk on Earth and was about saving the Earth; in TWOK the mission started from Earth; TSFS started with Kirk on Earth; TVH was set on Earth and about saving it; in TUC Kirk's mission started from Earth (and coincidental to STID, became a mission to stop a plan for a Klingon-Federation war that would threaten Earth); GEN had Earth scenes; FC was set on Earth and was about saving it; NEM was about stopping a Romulan-Federation war that would of course threaten Earth.
While waiting on a phone call, I decided to dice up all 12 movies

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Old September 9 2013, 09:30 PM   #161
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Cyrus wrote: View Post
What happened, did he get banned?
Didn't he eat his own shoes because he always said with 100% certainty that it won't be Khan?
Dennis departed for his own reasons. As for the STID thing, it's the exact opposite. He always claimed it was Khan. But I bet you knew this already.

mos6507 wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
all the others liked it. So go fuck yourself.
I don't remember one block of fans insulting another block of fans in such a childish and rude way before JJ Trek changed the makeup of Trek "fandom" demographics.

Unfortunately, not only is TrekMOVIE broken, but TrekBBS is too.


beamMe wrote: View Post
Jeyl wrote: View Post
Success and reviews aside, what did STID really accomplish?
Making the first relevant social commentary in Trek in over 20-25 years while telling an entertaining story.
Yep. Spot on.
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Old September 9 2013, 09:48 PM   #162
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

mos6507 wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
all the others liked it. So go fuck yourself.
I don't remember one block of fans insulting another block of fans in such a childish and rude way before JJ Trek changed the makeup of Trek "fandom" demographics.

Unfortunately, not only is TrekMOVIE broken, but TrekBBS is too.
You're not serious, right? The fans have been slinging poo at each other as long as there's been a Star Trek to bitch about.
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Old September 9 2013, 10:10 PM   #163
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
The only thing that can save Trek is Robert Downey Jr.
If I was Paramount I'd give him 50 million to be in the next movie as Harry Mudd. With him we are guaranteed to reach 1 Billion and finally have a JJTrek film that will break even.
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Old September 9 2013, 10:27 PM   #164
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

You know... I would watch that!
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Old September 9 2013, 11:07 PM   #165
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Re: TrekMOVIE Is Broken

Ditto.
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