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The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old September 6 2013, 07:04 PM   #61
Noddy
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

I have my doubts regarding the Okuda chronology's placement of the beginning of Generations in the same year as The Undiscovered Country. I've always felt that would be better placed a year or two after TUC.

And while I accept the 2285 date for TWOK and TSFS, I think TVH and TFF also occurred in that year, and not 2286 and '87, as the chronology states.
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Old September 6 2013, 09:14 PM   #62
sariel2005
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

I have my doubts regarding the Okuda chronology's placement of the beginning of Generations in the same year as The Undiscovered Country. I've always felt that would be better placed a year or two after TUC.
Taking DS9 into account if we take the three years later thing at face value then It would make it 2372 I think.
Think their placing it before Defiant is a bit suspect, given Tom says Crusher forced his shoreleave
Pretty sure DS9 crew would be aware of the destruction of the Enterprise.
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Old September 7 2013, 04:22 AM   #63
Leto_II
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

Noddy wrote: View Post
I have my doubts regarding the Okuda chronology's placement of the beginning of Generations in the same year as The Undiscovered Country. I've always felt that would be better placed a year or two after TUC.
For quite a long while, Generations actually was set in 2294, not '93, which allowed for a bit more time for the Enterprise-B to be completed, etc.

If you look at the novels that were published during those years (and possibly the first two editions of the Okudas' own chronology, IIRC), you'll notice that Generations is indeed placed at 2294 (as do Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens' Federation, Denny Martin Flynn's The Fearful Summons, etc.).

This was later retconned to have the Ent-B launch take place later in the same year as the Khitomer summit, which suddenly makes for a very squeezed-in bunch of post-Undiscovered Country/pre-Generations novels (of which there are quite a few).
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Old September 7 2013, 12:09 PM   #64
Noddy
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

sariel2005 wrote: View Post
I have my doubts regarding the Okuda chronology's placement of the beginning of Generations in the same year as The Undiscovered Country. I've always felt that would be better placed a year or two after TUC.
Taking DS9 into account if we take the three years later thing at face value then It would make it 2372 I think.
Think their placing it before Defiant is a bit suspect, given Tom says Crusher forced his shoreleave
Pretty sure DS9 crew would be aware of the destruction of the Enterprise.
What three years later line is this? I can't quite remember.
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Old September 7 2013, 05:16 PM   #65
sariel2005
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

What three years later line is this? I can't quite remember.
the opening of Emissary (DS9) has the battle of Wolf 359
We then have a caption of " 3 years later" and cut to Sisko arriving at Deep Space Nine.
Which would be 2370.

looking at continuity, if we assume that the festival of light in "Data's Day" is in 2267 november ( based on the calendar date of the festival with the second appearance of Leah Brahms shortly after - we have Geordi say that "booby Trap" was about a year ago ( so november 2266) placing "Best of Both Worlds" in 2267

That said - "Eye of the Needle" (Voy) explicitly places the year as 2371 - and that runs concurrently with season three of DS9 - which ( I have realised since my previous post) kills the idea of it being 2372 stone dead.
Frustrating as DS9 season three refers to three years on the station repeatedly in season three and I am loathe to ignore references onscreen.

That said if you are prepared to ignore stardates, placing Datas day in 2266 ( in season three) would probably be a good idea given the repeatedly given statements of Molly O'Briens age in DS9 - without checking I do not know if that raises other continuity issues though.
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Old September 7 2013, 09:03 PM   #66
Hober Mallow
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

sariel2005 wrote: View Post
What three years later line is this? I can't quite remember.
the opening of Emissary (DS9) has the battle of Wolf 359
We then have a caption of " 3 years later" and cut to Sisko arriving at Deep Space Nine.
Which would be 2370.
The whole "three years later" thing messes things up, when only little over two years has actually passed since "TBOBW2" aired in TNG's fourth season. DS9 premiered in the middle of TNG's sixth season. I just decided it was rounding up to three years. Unfortunately, right at the beginning of DS9 season two, Sisko talks about the four year anniversary of his wife's death. This is right at the beginning of TNG's seventh season, only three years since "TBOBW2."

Basically, DS9 screws everything up. There's no easy way to explain it by itself, let alone well enough to account for other date discrepancies (like Molly being four years old when she was born only one season earlier on TNG). Back when I used to care about stuff like this, it frustrated me to no end. I found the best way to deal with it is to simply not care.
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Old September 7 2013, 10:00 PM   #67
sariel2005
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
sariel2005 wrote: View Post
What three years later line is this? I can't quite remember.
the opening of Emissary (DS9) has the battle of Wolf 359
We then have a caption of " 3 years later" and cut to Sisko arriving at Deep Space Nine.
Which would be 2370.
The whole "three years later" thing messes things up, when only little over two years has actually passed since "TBOBW2" aired in TNG's fourth season. DS9 premiered in the middle of TNG's sixth season. I just decided it was rounding up to three years. Unfortunately, right at the beginning of DS9 season two, Sisko talks about the four year anniversary of his wife's death. This is right at the beginning of TNG's seventh season, only three years since "TBOBW2."

Basically, DS9 screws everything up. There's no easy way to explain it by itself, let alone well enough to account for other date discrepancies (like Molly being four years old when she was born only one season earlier on TNG). Back when I used to care about stuff like this, it frustrated me to no end. I found the best way to deal with it is to simply not care.
that can work if we take it that it was the third year after the Wolf 359 it occurs. ( hence three years ago ) which makes it 2370. thats ok though Molly remains an issue.

Then again "Pegasus" seems to date the seventh season of TNG specifically so... maybe not.



EDIT - Having just watched Generations again, It does seem possible that Generations is set in early 2372. - The Stardate is after that of "Eye of the Needle" and Data mentions 34 years of growth. Datas activation is listed as 2nd February 2338 - so if his comment is correct ti would be 2372.

Last edited by sariel2005; September 8 2013 at 05:57 PM. Reason: ADDENDUM
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Old September 9 2013, 09:31 PM   #68
Hober Mallow
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

sariel2005 wrote: View Post
EDIT - Having just watched Generations again, It does seem possible that Generations is set in early 2372. - The Stardate is after that of "Eye of the Needle" and Data mentions 34 years of growth. Datas activation is listed as 2nd February 2338 - so if his comment is correct ti would be 2372.
Does that work with Geordi's comment that the Farpoint mission was seven years ago?
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Old September 9 2013, 09:35 PM   #69
sariel2005
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

sariel2005 wrote:
EDIT - Having just watched Generations again, It does seem possible that Generations is set in early 2372. - The Stardate is after that of "Eye of the Needle" and Data mentions 34 years of growth. Datas activation is listed as 2nd February 2338 - so if his comment is correct ti would be 2372.
Does that work with Geordi's comment that the Farpoint mission was seven years ago?

Well seven years ago would be 2265, so not really - that said if the far point mission was later in 2264 then it would be less than 8 years, so its possible.
FWIW Data would tend to be more accurate than Geordi I reckon.
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Old September 14 2013, 06:19 PM   #70
sariel2005
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Re: IS the okuda timeline canon?

And then in "The 37's" Janeway says it is 2371, oh well...
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