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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old September 4 2013, 02:26 AM   #91
austen_pierce
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
austen_pierce wrote: View Post
At the end of Balance of Terror Kirk mourns with a junior female officer at the loss of her fiance, a junior weapons officer. Kirk had been in the process of marrying them when the episode began. I understand that this is an exception to the red-shirt rule, in which Kirk willl deliver a few testy lines "a member of my crew is dead!" before moving on, but it's worth noting in context of Picard 'thank you very much, moving on' attitude at the end of Generations.
Except Picard does morn Kirk. Deeply. It's one of the few good shots of the film.

There was no reason for him to mention the Nexus or Kirk or any of that. Kirk was best left remembered as the guy who died saving the successor to his legacy.
Are you referring to the scenes in which Picard watches Kirk die and then buries him beneath a cairn? I can somewhat accept that, but still feel Kirk deserved more. Maybe a service of some sort with the captains of the three Federation vessels, which came to rescue the E-D crew?
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Old September 4 2013, 03:58 AM   #92
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

austen_pierce wrote: View Post
Are you referring to the scenes in which Picard watches Kirk die and then buries him beneath a cairn? I can somewhat accept that, but still feel Kirk deserved more. Maybe a service of some sort with the captains of the three Federation vessels, which came to rescue the E-D crew?
No. Because, again, that puts Kirk in the 24th century where he doesn't belong. He's belongs to the past and needed to stay there. Picard understood this; it was one of the themes of the film.
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Old September 4 2013, 04:58 AM   #93
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

I sort of like the poetry of the scene. Picard buries Kirk on the site of his greatest victory. Kirk saved the crew of the Ent-D, Picard and the entire populace of Veridian III.

I only wish Berman, Braga and Moore had written a more heroic death sequence for Kirk. Remember the falling off the cliff on the bridge was a $6 million dollar reshoot of a scene that originally involved Kirk just getting shot in the back. If you haven't listened to it. I recommend listening to the Braga and Moore commentary on the GEN bluray. It's hilarious. It's like listening to one long apology about what didn't work in the film.
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Old September 4 2013, 11:59 AM   #94
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

The is no possible death scene for Kirk that people would accept.
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Old September 4 2013, 03:38 PM   #95
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
The is no possible death scene for Kirk that people would accept.
That's not true.

But if you're going to write a major character out of the franchise make sure you put some effort into it. I felt the same way about the ends of Data and the Enterprise-D.
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Old September 4 2013, 06:26 PM   #96
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Wouldn't the Federation have to remove the body, though? What about contamination of the Veridian civilization?
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Old September 4 2013, 08:56 PM   #97
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Peach Wookiee wrote: View Post
Wouldn't the Federation have to remove the body, though? What about contamination of the Veridian civilization?
A fossilized toupee would be one helluva archaeological discovery.
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Old September 4 2013, 10:42 PM   #98
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Peach Wookiee wrote: View Post
Wouldn't the Federation have to remove the body, though? What about contamination of the Veridian civilization?
The novel The Return addresses this subject, to a degree -- immediately following the events of the movie, Starfleet begins the process of removing the crashed spaceframe of the Enterprise-D saucer section, citing Prime Directive concerns over potential contamination of the Veridian IV civilization once it gains spaceflight.

Can't remember what Starfleet's stance was concerning Kirk's body in the novel, though.
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Old September 4 2013, 11:08 PM   #99
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Leto_II wrote: View Post
The novel The Return addresses this subject, to a degree -- immediately following the events of the movie, Starfleet begins the process of removing the crashed spaceframe of the Enterprise-D saucer section, citing Prime Directive concerns over potential contamination of the Veridian IV civilization once it gains spaceflight.

Can't remember what Starfleet's stance was concerning Kirk's body in the novel, though.
Kirk's body was to be removed for the same reason. Starfleet didn't want to leave any trace of any of their officers having been there. This is mentioned while Spock is seen observing a moment of silence at Kirk's grave site just as the honor guard beams down.

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Old September 5 2013, 05:23 AM   #100
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

That's it -- thanks. Been awhile since I've read it.
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Old September 5 2013, 08:10 AM   #101
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

And then....
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Old September 5 2013, 10:02 AM   #102
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
The is no possible death scene for Kirk that people would accept.
The only acceptable way Kirk could have been killed off would have been to go the full blown operatic scale of sacrificing himself in a massive explosion to save the Enterprise and the entire universe. And there's the OMG moment as the surviving crew witness from a distance.

Sort of like "The Doomsday Machine" on a $100 million budget.

And if he always knew he'd die alone, not even we the audience should actually see it up close. That leaves us free to imagine what those last seconds could have been like for him.
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Old September 5 2013, 03:01 PM   #103
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Kirk didn't have to die at all. Old Spock surviving Star Trek was far more awesome than Kirk dying in Generations.
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Old September 5 2013, 03:14 PM   #104
JarodRussell
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Melakon wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
The is no possible death scene for Kirk that people would accept.
The only acceptable way Kirk could have been killed off would have been to go the full blown operatic scale of sacrificing himself in a massive explosion to save the Enterprise and the entire universe. And there's the OMG moment as the surviving crew witness from a distance.

Sort of like "The Doomsday Machine" on a $100 million budget.

And if he always knew he'd die alone, not even we the audience should actually see it up close. That leaves us free to imagine what those last seconds could have been like for him.
And even then the reason why Kirk has to kill himself at all would be a stupid one.

"Autopilot offline", "Transporter offline" and other bullcrapshitfuck.
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Old September 5 2013, 06:20 PM   #105
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Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
Kirk didn't have to die at all. Old Spock surviving Star Trek was far more awesome than Kirk dying in Generations.
It was indeed.
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