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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old August 30 2013, 04:17 AM   #76
R. Star
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

Melakon wrote: View Post
Ezri was just too darn cute. One time I had just bought one of those Star Trek Magazines and Ezri was on the cover. A friend saw it, and his first words were "She's cute!"

Ezri was so cute, you just wanted to pick her up and take her home and-- well, she was cute.
She was cute. I wouldn't presume to deny that. My main objection to Ezri was... what exactly did she bring to the table? Sure she helped Sisko get over his depression, and was a love interest for Bashir. Beyond that it just felt they rammed her down our throats, often distracting from the intense arcs of season 7, for no apparent reason except to give her tons of screen time as if to compensate for her not being around the first six seasons. Really you could've accomplished the same with a guest star that appeared for a few episodes.
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Old August 30 2013, 12:40 PM   #77
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

R. Star wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
Ezri was just too darn cute. One time I had just bought one of those Star Trek Magazines and Ezri was on the cover. A friend saw it, and his first words were "She's cute!"

Ezri was so cute, you just wanted to pick her up and take her home and-- well, she was cute.
She was cute. I wouldn't presume to deny that. My main objection to Ezri was... what exactly did she bring to the table? Sure she helped Sisko get over his depression, and was a love interest for Bashir. Beyond that it just felt they rammed her down our throats, often distracting from the intense arcs of season 7, for no apparent reason except to give her tons of screen time as if to compensate for her not being around the first six seasons. Really you could've accomplished the same with a guest star that appeared for a few episodes.
She played centerfield.

I don't think guest stars would really accomplish as much, given that none of them would have or would develop any rapport with the crew in such a short time. Indeed, I don't know how any character, Ezri Dax or not, could avoid Cousin Oliver Syndrome in some for or other. And in the end, another permanent female crewmember was necessary, lest the show devolve into simple, testosterone driven action.
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Old August 30 2013, 09:58 PM   #78
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

She graphically demonstrated that it's possible to have a worse ship's counselor than Deanna Troi. It's valuable to see how TNG dodged a bullet.
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Old August 31 2013, 12:00 AM   #79
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

At least Troi was never duped by a hologram.
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Old August 31 2013, 12:14 AM   #80
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

I used to have a strong dislike for Ezri. Probably because I thought Jadzia was awesome. Although, after a few re-watches of the seventh season, she kind of grew on me.
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Old August 31 2013, 12:45 AM   #81
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

bbailey861 wrote: View Post
I liked Ezri. She did a good job playing a fish out of water and grew into her character well. Enjoy her continuation in the novelverse as well.
I didn't like her at first as I was such a huge Jadzia fan. But, I learned to really like her.

I love her and her crew in the novels.
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Old August 31 2013, 12:45 AM   #82
Melakon
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

Pondwater wrote: View Post
. . . she kind of grew on me.
From False Alarms (1936), a Three Stooges short--

Fat Girl: You'll like me after we get acquainted. I grow on people.

Curly: So do warts.
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Old August 31 2013, 01:39 AM   #83
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

R. Star wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
Ezri was just too darn cute. One time I had just bought one of those Star Trek Magazines and Ezri was on the cover. A friend saw it, and his first words were "She's cute!"

Ezri was so cute, you just wanted to pick her up and take her home and-- well, she was cute.
She was cute. I wouldn't presume to deny that. My main objection to Ezri was... what exactly did she bring to the table? Sure she helped Sisko get over his depression, and was a love interest for Bashir. Beyond that it just felt they rammed her down our throats, often distracting from the intense arcs of season 7, for no apparent reason except to give her tons of screen time as if to compensate for her not being around the first six seasons. Really you could've accomplished the same with a guest star that appeared for a few episodes.
Oh, well said! I still remember the look on my husband's face every time an Ezri-centric episode played. He would glare at the screen, then look at me and exclaim, "Really?, really? There is so much that they need to address before the end...and they are wasting time on her...again?!"

We were both wishing that they had killed Dax outright midway through the season so we could have seen more of the characters and arcs that we considered important.
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Old August 31 2013, 05:28 PM   #84
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

Come on, there aren't many "Ezri-centric episodes". There were basically only three - "Afterimage", "Prodigal Daughter" and "Field of Fire".
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Old August 31 2013, 05:48 PM   #85
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

If she's the worst character then it says a lot about the quality of DS9, I thought that she was an interesting take on the trill species.
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Old August 31 2013, 06:14 PM   #86
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

DS9forever wrote: View Post
Come on, there aren't many "Ezri-centric episodes". There were basically only three - "Afterimage", "Prodigal Daughter" and "Field of Fire".
Combine these with the amount of screen time she received in general and valuable time was wasted that should have been put to better use. I do feel like she was rammed down our throats and the story arcs had to be rushed to completion leading up to the finale.

Don't get me wrong. I don't hate her (anymore! ). I just think she took the focus away from the important plot arcs that needed to be addressed before the series ended.
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Old September 1 2013, 07:52 AM   #87
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

I just finished a summer-long DS9 re-watch tonight; the first time I've seen the series since it aired. I dreaded the Jadzia-Ezri changeover. Terry Farrell, you see, managed to hit almost all of my "she's hot" buttons back in those days, and Ezri was good, but only "cute" in comparison.

But this time, I enjoyed Ezri a lot more. She seemed played by a more competent actor than Jadzia, and it was fun to watch the Trill dynamics of a new face with the old memories work their way through all the characters over several episodes. As Greg Cox points out, it's a lot like the Doctor regenerating, you can't simply ignore it. And DS9 focused a lot on the characters. If they'd brought in another Dax and didn't show how the established characters integrated her back into their relationships, it would have been a huge cheat.

However ...

About halfway through the final season's fourth episode, it suddenly occurred to me that Ezri should have been a man. It isn't just rebirth in a new host that makes the Trill symbionts interesting, they can also change sex. This was explored a bit in the Next Gen episode, "The Host", and Dr. Crusher wasn't able to keep up with it.

I'd go even further. If we're gonna explore this, let's drop all pretence of metaphor and just make the Ezri host homosexual. Or at least open to the feelings he recently had for Worf and/or Julian. In the 90s, homosexuality was still a bit taboo, and contrasting this with the Trill taboo of continuing the relationships of the previous host would be neat. Watching Worf and Julian react to that would have been fascinating. He wouldn't have to be over-the-top. Perhaps he wouldn't even have to be overtly homosexual. But he'd still have to resolve his feelings for Worf.

It's interesting that the talented crew behind DS9 missed this opportunity. Especially given the hints at lesbian relationships in several episodes. I'm sure this must have occurred to someone, but I wonder why they shot it down.
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Old September 1 2013, 08:44 AM   #88
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

R. Star wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
Ezri was just too darn cute. One time I had just bought one of those Star Trek Magazines and Ezri was on the cover. A friend saw it, and his first words were "She's cute!"

Ezri was so cute, you just wanted to pick her up and take her home and-- well, she was cute.
She was cute. I wouldn't presume to deny that. My main objection to Ezri was... what exactly did she bring to the table? Sure she helped Sisko get over his depression, and was a love interest for Bashir. Beyond that it just felt they rammed her down our throats, often distracting from the intense arcs of season 7, for no apparent reason except to give her tons of screen time as if to compensate for her not being around the first six seasons. Really you could've accomplished the same with a guest star that appeared for a few episodes.
She inserted the idea into Worf's brain that the Klingon Empire needed significant change. That is a big deal I would say. It also kind of wrapped up the Dax/Klingon arc that permeated throughout the series.

It's mainly because of that scene in Tacking into the Wind that I like Ezri. It lead to Worf killing Gowron and brought the whole Klingon story to the best conclusion of any story in the series. That and she was a fun character in her own way.
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Old September 1 2013, 08:56 AM   #89
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

Mirror Ezri was much more fun than Mirror Jadzia.
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Old September 1 2013, 11:45 PM   #90
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Re: Absolute worst character in DS9 History: Ezri Dax

Psion wrote: View Post
However ...

About halfway through the final season's fourth episode, it suddenly occurred to me that Ezri should have been a man. It isn't just rebirth in a new host that makes the Trill symbionts interesting, they can also change sex. This was explored a bit in the Next Gen episode, "The Host", and Dr. Crusher wasn't able to keep up with it.

I'd go even further. If we're gonna explore this, let's drop all pretence of metaphor and just make the Ezri host homosexual. Or at least open to the feelings he recently had for Worf and/or Julian. In the 90s, homosexuality was still a bit taboo, and contrasting this with the Trill taboo of continuing the relationships of the previous host would be neat. Watching Worf and Julian react to that would have been fascinating. He wouldn't have to be over-the-top. Perhaps he wouldn't even have to be overtly homosexual. But he'd still have to resolve his feelings for Worf.

It's interesting that the talented crew behind DS9 missed this opportunity. Especially given the hints at lesbian relationships in several episodes. I'm sure this must have occurred to someone, but I wonder why they shot it down.
I absolutely agree. I really liked Ezri, more than I liked Jadzia, but Jadzia's successor should have been male. There's just too much dramatic potential in that idea. However, while DS9 was fairly edgy for a 1990s Star Trek show, it still played it pretty safe more often than not. And if the new Dax had been male, then Nana Visitor would have been the only female regular on the show. That probably played a part in it, too.
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