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Old August 28 2013, 05:22 PM   #136
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

teya wrote: View Post
Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
From the source...

JANEWAY: Very nicely. We should have vine-ripened Talaxian tomatoes in a couple of months, unless this planet has the equivalent of tomato bugs. Oh, they're awful.
So no, not Federation Engineered Superseeds.
A couple of months (60 days) would be the same timeframe as subarctic tomatoes.

Which, BTW, are naturally-bred heirlooms, not genetically engineered.
One thing that's great about Jersey, is our heirloom tomatoes, yum!
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Old August 28 2013, 05:27 PM   #137
teya
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

KaraBear wrote: View Post
teya wrote: View Post
Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
From the source...

So no, not Federation Engineered Superseeds.
A couple of months (60 days) would be the same timeframe as subarctic tomatoes.

Which, BTW, are naturally-bred heirlooms, not genetically engineered.
One thing that's great about Jersey, is our heirloom tomatoes, yum!
Jersey white corn... *sigh*
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Old August 28 2013, 05:38 PM   #138
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

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Jennifer Lien never bashed the writers in public when she was a cast member.

So I can't understand how they suddenly could lose their ability to write for her character in the beginning of season 4, especially since they managed to come up with good Kes stories up to the last minute of season 3 (and in Mrs. Taylor's case even after season 3). Did Jennifer cough in the wrong tune on a Friday morning or what?

As for other actors who had dared to speak the truth about lousy writing, they have kept their mouth shut for many years of frustration before they spoke out about the lousy writing so I see no reason why the writers shouldn't do their best for their characters.
we were actually talking about Beltran bashing the writers, not Lien

as far as "speaking the truth" They're all entitled to their opinion, but while they'r ON the show and receiving a paycheck for it, I think it's incredibly poor taste to bash the show

would you go on tv and say horrible things about the company you work for and expect no consequenses at work for it?

if Beltran had issues with the writing there are channels he could have gone through, like the other actors did
Ah, but Lien must have coughed in the wrong tune on a Friday morning, otherwise the sensitive writers wouldn't have lost their abilities or their interest so quickly when it comes to writing for the character Kes.

As for Beltran, I admire him for having the guts to stand up and tell the truth about the sloppy writing.

For years, he had seen and experienced how his character was shoved more and more in the background and how his suggestions for the character were totally ignored. Finally he lost his temper, something that most of us would do.

So what did he have to lose? Nothing! It wouldn't have changed anything to continue to bow for the masters. They had already decided to place Seven and The Doctor at Janeway's side as the main characters and the rest as moving images in the background (except for the one they've already fired).

Besides that, lousy employers and lousy companies needs a smack on the head in public. Maybe they will learn to treat their employees better after that.
Regarding Jennifer. I doubt it had anything to do with her. The problem was that they'd written Kes into a box. She was nice & sweet & compassionate. She had great mental powers that she was just learning to tap.

"Nice & sweet & compassionate" means no drama.

Great mental powers has been done hundreds of times on Star Trek, dating back to TOS.

As I said before, that's the creative process. Some things work, some things don't. Not every artistic project is a success.

Regarding Beltran. Just because Person X says that the writers suck or he's the most talented member of the band does not make it true.
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Old August 28 2013, 05:47 PM   #139
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

The only difference between Beltran and some of us would be the money involved. Lots of people complain about their employer, some even quit. But if Beltran had quit, he stood to lose a few hundred thousand dollars a year possibly, as well as a suit for breach of contract. If they had fired him instead, mission accomplished and he could draw unemployment. The only time I tried to draw unemployment, I was turned down. They said I didn't look for work hard enough when there was a foot of snow on the ground and I had no car.
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Old August 28 2013, 05:58 PM   #140
teya
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

Melakon wrote: View Post
The only difference between Beltran and some of us would be the money involved. Lots of people complain about their employer, some even quit.
Yep, I've gone home and called my best friend and whinged about my job. I've come close to quitting. I did quit a job when I just didn't fit in with the management style at a place.

What I have never done and will never do is trash the place in public. Unless the employer is doing something illegal, that is simply unprofessional--in any field.

ETA: And no, Beltran could not have drawn unemployment. Actors are private contractors. They don't get unemployment when a gig ends.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:01 PM   #141
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

teya wrote: View Post
Lynx wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post
we were actually talking about Beltran bashing the writers, not Lien

as far as "speaking the truth" They're all entitled to their opinion, but while they'r ON the show and receiving a paycheck for it, I think it's incredibly poor taste to bash the show

would you go on tv and say horrible things about the company you work for and expect no consequenses at work for it?

if Beltran had issues with the writing there are channels he could have gone through, like the other actors did
Ah, but Lien must have coughed in the wrong tune on a Friday morning, otherwise the sensitive writers wouldn't have lost their abilities or their interest so quickly when it comes to writing for the character Kes.

As for Beltran, I admire him for having the guts to stand up and tell the truth about the sloppy writing.

For years, he had seen and experienced how his character was shoved more and more in the background and how his suggestions for the character were totally ignored. Finally he lost his temper, something that most of us would do.

So what did he have to lose? Nothing! It wouldn't have changed anything to continue to bow for the masters. They had already decided to place Seven and The Doctor at Janeway's side as the main characters and the rest as moving images in the background (except for the one they've already fired).

Besides that, lousy employers and lousy companies needs a smack on the head in public. Maybe they will learn to treat their employees better after that.
Regarding Jennifer. I doubt it had anything to do with her. The problem was that they'd written Kes into a box. She was nice & sweet & compassionate. She had great mental powers that she was just learning to tap.

"Nice & sweet & compassionate" means no drama.

Great mental powers has been done hundreds of times on Star Trek, dating back to TOS.

As I said before, that's the creative process. Some things work, some things don't. Not every artistic project is a success.

Regarding Beltran. Just because Person X says that the writers suck or he's the most talented member of the band does not make it true.
that's exactly it, the ONLY thing interesting about Kes was her 9 year lifespan, which as we've both already said would have been great to fully explore. Though in that case I would have changed her relationship with neelix from boyfriend/girlfriend to father figure/daughter.

pointy ears, mental abilities, they've been done to death
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Old August 28 2013, 06:03 PM   #142
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

teya wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
The only difference between Beltran and some of us would be the money involved. Lots of people complain about their employer, some even quit.
Yep, I've gone home and called my best friend and whinged about my job. I've come close to quitting. I did quit a job when I just didn't fit in with the management style at a place.

What I have never done and will never do is trash the place in public. Unless the employer is doing something illegal, that is simply unprofessional--in any field.

ETA: And no, Beltran could not have drawn unemployment. Actors are private contractors. They don't get unemployment when a gig ends.
I was unemployed for a while and went on several job interviews. I worked with agencies to prep myself and the number one thing they always say is to NOT say anything negative about your previous employer. That's just common sense.....if you ever want to be hired by any job again
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Old August 28 2013, 06:05 PM   #143
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

Melakon wrote: View Post
The only difference between Beltran and some of us would be the money involved. Lots of people complain about their employer, some even quit. But if Beltran had quit, he stood to lose a few hundred thousand dollars a year possibly, as well as a suit for breach of contract. If they had fired him instead, mission accomplished and he could draw unemployment. The only time I tried to draw unemployment, I was turned down. They said I didn't look for work hard enough when there was a foot of snow on the ground and I had no car.
yeah, I might post on facebook that I had a rough day at work, or I might complain to my husband about my boss, but would you go on the radio and trash your company especially when everyone listening knows the name of the company? would you expect to be treated well back at work after that?
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Old August 28 2013, 06:08 PM   #144
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

Melakon wrote: View Post
Or maybe he was taking a cue from Marlon Brando, who was notorious for not memorizing his lines. He'd leave index cards hidden all around a set with his lines on them, believing that allowed a fresher delivery than memorization.
A Beltran comparison to Brando. You, sir, just accomplished the impossible.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:12 PM   #145
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

I try.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:33 PM   #146
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

KaraBear wrote: View Post
I was unemployed for a while and went on several job interviews. I worked with agencies to prep myself and the number one thing they always say is to NOT say anything negative about your previous employer. That's just common sense.....if you ever want to be hired by any job again
Right now, there's a number of people in another department whose jobs are being eliminated by technology. Meanwhile my department is growing because of technology. So we're keeping our eyes open for intelligent, diligent, detail-oriented people we can train. Our training would provide them with job security for life and the ability to work at any healthcare institution in the country. All they'd have to do is follow-up with the required education & certification.

Well, one guy we had our eyes on decided to toss us under the bus and blame a mistake he made on us--because, you know, he is perfect and knows all and doesn't ever make mistakes.

He is in a serious panic now because they've just had a series of layoffs in his department and more are coming. He's always coming around my office & kissing ass, looking desperate.

I think he realizes that there's no chance in hell we'll hire him now. He done burned his bridge.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:39 PM   #147
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

The one time I got caught in a layoff, I'd had my leg injury, went back to work too soon, was in too much pain to concentrate on the work. Had my worst review in 8 years. Since I was paid by the hour and making more than a first level supervisor, my head was sticking up pretty high when they came by with the axe.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:45 PM   #148
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

teya wrote: View Post
KaraBear wrote: View Post
I was unemployed for a while and went on several job interviews. I worked with agencies to prep myself and the number one thing they always say is to NOT say anything negative about your previous employer. That's just common sense.....if you ever want to be hired by any job again
Right now, there's a number of people in another department whose jobs are being eliminated by technology. Meanwhile my department is growing because of technology. So we're keeping our eyes open for intelligent, diligent, detail-oriented people we can train. Our training would provide them with job security for life and the ability to work at any healthcare institution in the country. All they'd have to do is follow-up with the required education & certification.

Well, one guy we had our eyes on decided to toss us under the bus and blame a mistake he made on us--because, you know, he is perfect and knows all and doesn't ever make mistakes.

He is in a serious panic now because they've just had a series of layoffs in his department and more are coming. He's always coming around my office & kissing ass, looking desperate.

I think he realizes that there's no chance in hell we'll hire him now. He done burned his bridge.
Hey can I come interview for you? and my husband, his last job was outsourced out of the country


I've actually been flat out asked if there were things I didn't like about my previous job in an interview which I thought was a tricky question, like when they ask you what you're weaknesses are
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Old August 28 2013, 06:48 PM   #149
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

Melakon wrote: View Post
The one time I got caught in a layoff, I'd had my leg injury, went back to work too soon, was in too much pain to concentrate on the work. Had my worst review in 8 years. Since I was paid by the hour and making more than a first level supervisor, my head was sticking up pretty high when they came by with the axe.
that sucks. I was laid off from my last job after 5 years. they called me into HR one day and said my job was moving out of state and I could go if I wanted(they weren't offering any assistance or compensation of any kind), if not I had 60 days left.
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Old August 28 2013, 06:55 PM   #150
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Re: What happened to Jennifer Lien?

The company I worked for didn't give us that much warning. The summer before, they had acquired another company with 5000 employees. Those people were assured of a job for the next year, so the rest of us knew we were potentially doomed. I went into work one morning at 8:30, was immediately pulled into the manager's office and given the severance package, and ordered not to talk to anyone about it on the way out. I was out the door by 9:15am. It was an across the board 15% reduction, not even managers were safe.
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