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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old August 22 2013, 10:47 PM   #16
Tomalak
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

R. Star wrote: View Post
Given Sisko was allowed to quit during the middle of the Dominion war to go home, mope and peel potatoes.... I'm hard pressed to find a reason anyone's resignation would be rejected.
He clearly had some kind of breakdown. Even the US military doesn't keep flogging soldiers suffering from PTSD.

There's also no suggestion he ever resigned, it was a leave of absence. He was allowed to keep a personal Runabout with him after all.
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Old August 22 2013, 10:51 PM   #17
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

So why is Sisko's friend dying so much more traumatic than anyone else losing a friend during any given day of that war? I wouldn't even call it a breakdown. More a sense of depression and loss of direction. Kira did say she wasn't sure he was coming back at all when he took the baseball. Resignation/leave of absence... only difference is he didn't burn a bridge.
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Old August 22 2013, 11:06 PM   #18
sariel2005
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

So he didn't leave Starfleet after all, except for some sort of a leave of absence...

We are never given any story on him leaving in a huff and slamming doors behind him, or some scandal forcing him out, or anything like that. There's no "He's no longer in Starfleet" aspect to it in the movie.
Can remember off hand whether Spock is specifically stated to have left Starfleet, however he was "On Vulcan, apparently to stay" and had no intention of returning. Spock is certainly too methodical to have not properly resigned given that was his intention. look at how he put his affairs in order before going to Romulus.
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Old August 22 2013, 11:28 PM   #19
JirinPanthosa
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

I think the average person who resigns would have trouble being reinstated, but Starfleet celebrities get special treatment.

So, if Starfleet refused to let Worf reinstate, Picard could just be like "Okay Admiral, I understand. I owe you one after you saved me from insect parasites. Oh wait, do I have that backwards?"

Didn't Sito Jaxa try to resign in Lower Decks?
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Old August 22 2013, 11:44 PM   #20
R. Star
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Sito asked for a transfer if Picard wouldn't stop punishing her for what happened at the academy.
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Old August 23 2013, 01:13 PM   #21
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

[QUOTE=Timo;8541973]
Is there any real-world equivalent to this "inactivation/reactivation of commission" thing?

Timo Saloniemi
In the 17th and 18th centuries, the Royal Navy (and several others, iirc) would often put officers on 'half pay' and beach them when there wasn't a position open on a ship. They'd basically be free to do whatever they want until recalled, including taking positions elsewhere. Of course, this often wasn't voluntary but because the Navy was downsizing at the moment and the officer in question didn't have enough friends in high places to get a paying posting.
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Old August 23 2013, 09:30 PM   #22
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

^That was more to do with whether there was a war on at the time. If you're not currently fighting the French, there's no reason to keep all those ships staffed and their crews paid to sit in port. For the sailors in the Napoleonic era, those short-lived treaties and truces put their livelihood at stake.
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Old August 23 2013, 10:16 PM   #23
Timo
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Very interesting! Starfleet's motivations for supporting a similar system would be different, of course, but perhaps no less practical or valid.

Odds and ends:

Can remember off hand whether Spock is specifically stated to have left Starfleet, however he was "On Vulcan, apparently to stay" and had no intention of returning.
To Kirk's knowledge, yes. But Spock might see no obstacle to returning to active duty once he got rid of those pesky emotions for good, whereas humans might take the going-to-monastery thing the wrong way due to cultural bias...

There's also no suggestion he ever resigned, it was a leave of absence. He was allowed to keep a personal Runabout with him after all.
Indeed. The only thing that makes the leave of absence unusual is that Sisko says he doesn't know how long he will be gone. But that may simply mean "I don't know if my quest will take all of my allotted leave, or be completed in a few days already".

It's a bit funny that Starfleet allows its personnel to use runabouts for civilian errands, but there's plenty of precedent. The O'Briens did that in "Tribunal" for one. And Sisko was on a holiday trip in "Jem'Hadar". And never mind the times Sisko used the runabouts or the Defiant for missions of his own making (such as sorting out Dax' past in "Equilibrium").

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Old August 23 2013, 10:50 PM   #24
sariel2005
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Can remember off hand whether Spock is specifically stated to have left Starfleet, however he was "On Vulcan, apparently to stay" and had no intention of returning. Spock is certainly too methodical to have not properly resigned given that was his intention. look at how he put his affairs in order before going to Romulus.
Ummmm. my complete statement with regard to Spock.

Timo, I think you may have misquoted me.
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Old August 23 2013, 11:44 PM   #25
Makarov
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

I'm not familiar with military stuff in general but one thing I don't get is that crew member in "The Drumhead" who didn't want to wait 4 years to become an officer. Does that mean despite serving on the enterprise he would always be stuck at a low level position because he skipped ahead?

I'd like to think Starfleet didn't make that guy resign just because of his half-romulan deal
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Old August 23 2013, 11:57 PM   #26
Timo
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Timo, I think you may have misquoted me.
I hope not... Yes, I left out half the paragraph, but only because I was going to speculate along opposite lines while agreeing with the hard facts in the part that I retained.

Spock would naturally do things properly if he were to actually resign, but my interpretation was that Kirk jumped to conclusions there, and misread Spock's intentions, and no resigning had actually taken place...

Does that mean despite serving on the enterprise he would always be stuck at a low level position because he skipped ahead?
I doubt it - why should he be stuck at any specific position? But unless he takes the academic studies at some point, he can't get the commission to officer rank. He can only become a higher-ranking enlisted man.

It's relatively rare for anybody who enlists to actually pursue the studies needed for getting a commission. The very point there is that the person didn't want to become an officer, a line of work very different from those available to enlisted personnel! But long-serving enlisted men may be "mustanged" into commissioned rank on occasion; this seems to have happened to Janice Rand, who was enlisted until ST4 at least, and then was seen wearing the insignia of a commissioned junior Lieutenant in ST6. (The actress also played a character with Commander insignia in between, but that probably wasn't Janice Rand, as such a career development would make no sense.)

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Old August 24 2013, 12:00 AM   #27
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Makarov wrote:
I'd like to think Starfleet didn't make that guy resign just because of his half-romulan deal
The problem is Simon Tarses knew he was half-Romulan, rather than half-Vulcan. He lied on his application to Starfleet. That's why he would have been punished.
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Old August 24 2013, 04:29 PM   #28
The Librarian
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

Melakon wrote: View Post
Makarov wrote:
I'd like to think Starfleet didn't make that guy resign just because of his half-romulan deal
The problem is Simon Tarses knew he was half-Romulan, rather than half-Vulcan. He lied on his application to Starfleet. That's why he would have been punished.
While he certainly would have gotten some kind of reprimand, I doubt they booted him out. For one thing, Starfleet has let people get away with a lot worse, up to and including attempted (and even successful!) murder. Lying on an application about something that is completely irrelevant to his suitability for the job is a small blemish on what looks like an otherwise good career record. We even see another character with exactly the same crime who gets off scot free - Julian Bashir.

For another, it would look absolutely horrible. Picard would make as stink and under the circumstances his desires would have quite a bit of weight. I imagine that if Tarses fought the discharge his lawyer and the press would have a field day. "My client hid his heritage because he feared illegal discrimination based on race, and then the moment a witch-hunting admiral and her mind-raping minion discovered the truth poor Crewman Tarses was immediately thrown out because of that very reason!" Maybe that explains Starfleet's willingness to sweep the Bashir case under the rug as well.
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Old August 24 2013, 05:22 PM   #29
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

RE Sisko's Runabout... Is there anything in season 7 to suggest it's what he came to Earth in and it's just been sitting in the Star Fleet long term car park for three months?

I'd have assumed he came to Earth via other means (or if he did come in a DS9 Runabout it would have been either sent back or put into the general car pool), then when he had his big vision he went through usual channels to hire a Runabout for an Official Mission (possibly using a bullshit reason so as not to get refused on grounds of being a crazy man. Maybe claiming he needed transportation back to DS9? Or even getting Dax to requisition it on some spurious reason?).
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Old August 24 2013, 07:23 PM   #30
The Librarian
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Re: Resigning from Starfleet

To be fair, having visions does not make you a crazy man in Starfleet, especially when godlike aliens have previous caused you to have accurate visions. There's probably a field on the requisition form where you can put things like, "the aliens who saved our asses by making the entire enemy reinforcement fleet disappear into the ether are asking me to go dig around in a desert."
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