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Old August 17 2013, 05:55 PM   #91
publiusr
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

JarodRussell wrote: View Post

Climate change, yes. Human cause is still in debate.
Not according to that MSNBC special last night. It didn't help that they started with that "Day After Tomorrow" dreck from Communion Strieber's Coming Global Superstorm. Worse yet, Chris Hayes slimed atomic power-saying that the Savannah didn't work so well. I guess the success of the entire Rickover nuclear Navy escaped him. That is the single fastest way to reduce CO2, and wind farms may have been overestimated
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/02/2...overestimated/

Some thoughts on alternative energy:
http://cosmoquest.org/forum/showthre...80#post2059780
http://www.patentgenius.com/patent/4078747.html
http://arpa-e.energy.gov/?q=arpa-e-p...storage-system

From the ASTEN study: (big document http://www.scribd.com/doc/15362126/ASTEN-Report )

Superconducting magnetic energy storage (SMES) is superior to both flywheels and batteries inthat they are have no moving parts, no chemicals, and are over 95% efficient at storing energy. Theywork by converting the electrical energy into magnetic energy by flowing electricity through asuperconducting wire, producing a magnetic current which can be stored and harnessed at a later timeto produce electricity (Unknown, 2002). Although extremely efficient and safe, the length of superconductive wire needed can exceed 160 kilometres.

But the MSNBC special really made me mad when they compared fossil fuel use to 8 tracks. How dare they go after eight tracks! The haptics are so much easier than trying to prize CDs/DVDs out of packages without breaking them--but its all on the cloud now--until the next EMP that is.


scotpens wrote: View Post

We've been altering, modifying, manipulating, and yes, improving on the "natural order of things" (a meaningless concept in any case) ever since Homo erectus began making and controlling fire 400,000 years ago.

True, sometimes we push nature a little too far and nature comes back and bites us in the ass. (The Dust Bowl of the 1930s comes to mind.)
Agriculture is about the worst thing you can do. The plow has been far more devastating than the drill bit.

scotpens wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Resurrecting individual extinct species is only Step One. We must also build vast space habitats where we can recreate entire ecologies from past epochs.
Already been tried. The ratings sucked.

Cool ship though.

Last edited by publiusr; August 17 2013 at 06:11 PM.
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Old August 18 2013, 10:22 AM   #92
RJDiogenes
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

scotpens wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Resurrecting individual extinct species is only Step One. We must also build vast space habitats where we can recreate entire ecologies from past epochs.
Already been tried. The ratings sucked.

If at first you don't succeed....

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
If an extinct animal were to be reintroduced, our world might as well be alien to them as they've had never had exposure to some of what we've had exposure to over the span of several thousands of years since these animals walked the planet. It could be something very subtle that ends up being very critical.
The other part of this is that cloning would not recreate any symbiotic bacteria that we would have no knowledge of and no way to recreate, like stomach bacteria that aids in digestion.
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Old August 18 2013, 11:55 AM   #93
YellowSubmarine
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
The other part of this is that cloning would not recreate any symbiotic bacteria that we would have no knowledge of and no way to recreate, like stomach bacteria that aids in digestion.
We wouldn't know if anything of that sort a problem unless we try, that is make a scientific experiment to test. That's a reason to try, not a reason not to try.

That could also be a problem for space travel – what if during prolonged exposure to space, our gut bacteria go locally extinct for some reason because of the separation from the biosphere? Or evolve too fast? So the more we know about the ability of an organism to respond to unnatural changes of that sort, the better.
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Old August 18 2013, 08:06 PM   #94
Owain Taggart
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
The other part of this is that cloning would not recreate any symbiotic bacteria that we would have no knowledge of and no way to recreate, like stomach bacteria that aids in digestion.
Good point. I think what's important is what we don't know and wouldn't possibly know along with what we do know. Sometimes we simply don't have the answers. Immunization was suggested, but then where do you start? How do you know what they're affected against? Our cure could quite possibly be disastrous under possible circumstances. It'd be like if in our future, they'd use the plague to treat certain illnesses, revive someone from our time, use the same treatment on them and expecting it to work the same way, whereas they'd most likely die from exposure to it.

YellowSubmarine wrote: View Post
We wouldn't know if anything of that sort a problem unless we try, that is make a scientific experiment to test. That's a reason to try, not a reason not to try.
But then PETA would be all over you But yes, that's a good point. I just wouldn't do a first test on Dinosaurs. We all know how that turned out in the movies


That could also be a problem for space travel – what if during prolonged exposure to space, our gut bacteria go locally extinct for some reason because of the separation from the biosphere? Or evolve too fast? So the more we know about the ability of an organism to respond to unnatural changes of that sort, the better.
Another good point, and I don't think I've ever heard of anything like that, but quite philosophical.
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Old August 18 2013, 10:27 PM   #95
RJDiogenes
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

YellowSubmarine wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
The other part of this is that cloning would not recreate any symbiotic bacteria that we would have no knowledge of and no way to recreate, like stomach bacteria that aids in digestion.
We wouldn't know if anything of that sort a problem unless we try, that is make a scientific experiment to test. That's a reason to try, not a reason not to try.
Well, you'll note from all my previous posts that I'm in favor of the whole thing.

That could also be a problem for space travel – what if during prolonged exposure to space, our gut bacteria go locally extinct for some reason because of the separation from the biosphere? Or evolve too fast? So the more we know about the ability of an organism to respond to unnatural changes of that sort, the better.
That would be an excellent starting point for an SF story.
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Old August 18 2013, 11:40 PM   #96
T J
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

jmc247 wrote: View Post
T J wrote: View Post
I hope we bring back these animals. I would love to see a herd of wooly mammoths roaming the word again (horribly enough I bet they would make great steaks... after there are loads of them). If humans had a hand it eradicating them we should bring them back, I have no moral issues with it. Science rocks!
An explorers club in 1951 did dug up a frozen wooly mammoth and did in fact cook it and eat it. According to one of the people who did eat thousands of year old mammoth, "it was awful. It tasted like meat left too long in a freezer."
Of course it tasted awful, it had been dead for thousands of years... duh! A good steak must be fresh and preferable not frozen. Hilarious that was their first impulse, "Let's eat this thousands years old meat..." Just duh...
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Old August 19 2013, 06:16 PM   #97
B.J.
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

publiusr wrote: View Post
scotpens wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
Resurrecting individual extinct species is only Step One. We must also build vast space habitats where we can recreate entire ecologies from past epochs.
Already been tried. The ratings sucked.

Cool ship though.
I feel I'm missing something here....
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Old August 19 2013, 09:06 PM   #98
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

B.J. wrote: View Post
I feel I'm missing something here....
Ask and ye shall receive.
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Old August 19 2013, 10:08 PM   #99
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
But then PETA would be all over you But yes, that's a good point. I just wouldn't do a first test on Dinosaurs. We all know how that turned out in the movies
Who knows, maybe dinosaur meat is toxic, and maybe cloned dinosaurs would die immediately because the bacteria they needed for their gut flora do no longer exist either.
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Old August 19 2013, 10:18 PM   #100
Melakon
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

I think we have enough dodos in the world as it is, without bringing back the feathered ones.
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Old August 21 2013, 05:52 AM   #101
Owain Taggart
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
But then PETA would be all over you But yes, that's a good point. I just wouldn't do a first test on Dinosaurs. We all know how that turned out in the movies
Who knows, maybe dinosaur meat is toxic, and maybe cloned dinosaurs would die immediately because the bacteria they needed for their gut flora do no longer exist either.

Exactly. And reintroducing them is bound to create its own set of problems, terror not withstanding Not to mention the diseases it could introduce that we simply wouldn't be prepared for.
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Old August 22 2013, 09:44 AM   #102
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
But then PETA would be all over you But yes, that's a good point. I just wouldn't do a first test on Dinosaurs. We all know how that turned out in the movies
Who knows, maybe dinosaur meat is toxic, and maybe cloned dinosaurs would die immediately because the bacteria they needed for their gut flora do no longer exist either.
Well, given that a T-Rex is basically a large chicken, you can guess what it likely tastes like.
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Old August 22 2013, 01:07 PM   #103
bbailey861
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

Timelord_Victorious wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
But then PETA would be all over you But yes, that's a good point. I just wouldn't do a first test on Dinosaurs. We all know how that turned out in the movies
Who knows, maybe dinosaur meat is toxic, and maybe cloned dinosaurs would die immediately because the bacteria they needed for their gut flora do no longer exist either.
Well, given that a T-Rex is basically a large chicken, you can guess what it likely tastes like.
But it looks tough - season well, use a moist cooking method, and adjust cooking times accordingly .
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Old August 22 2013, 06:49 PM   #104
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Re: Resurrecting Extinct Animals

bbailey861 wrote: View Post
Timelord_Victorious wrote: View Post
Well, given that a T-Rex is basically a large chicken, you can guess what it likely tastes like.
But it looks tough - season well, use a moist cooking method, and adjust cooking times accordingly .
The rack of ribs is a doozy!

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