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Old August 16 2013, 04:01 PM   #31
Christopher
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
I wish they'd made some of these.

Rock-a-bye Baby or Die
We're really better off that they didn't make that one. Here's the summary:

http://www.orionpressfanzines.com/articles/rock.htm
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Old August 16 2013, 04:37 PM   #32
CommishSleer
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Christopher wrote: View Post
CommishSleer wrote: View Post
I wish they'd made some of these.

Rock-a-bye Baby or Die
We're really better off that they didn't make that one. Here's the summary:

http://www.orionpressfanzines.com/articles/rock.htm
That was hysterical.
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Old August 17 2013, 12:31 AM   #33
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
I wish they'd made some of these.

Rock-a-bye Baby or Die
George Clayton Johnson released this treatment in a hardcover collection, "All of Us are Dying and other stories". I have it.
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Old August 17 2013, 03:29 AM   #34
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

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Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Seems, from the comments I just read, that the dispute is with the guy who supplied to the publisher/author what was assumed to be commonly known pics in the public domain, but not knowing that they had actually been lovingly restored by others.

Hopefully they can come to an understanding before the book is due to go live.
Thanks, Therin, you are right, but... the publisher is aware of this and the pictures keep getting posted.
Now the publisher is sounding legal-nasty in response to my calling this issue out for attention in the Amazon comments.
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Old August 17 2013, 04:04 AM   #35
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Indeed. Any positive feelings I had about this release are fading rapidly.

Gurian's arguments on the Amazon page strike me as rather specious. Because someone had to further alter the photos so they could be reproduced in black and white, this somehow nullifies the restoration work of Star Trek History, birdofthegalaxy, and others initially done to the photos? Not to mention his bizarre claim that in some cases it took "in excess of an hour" in the case of some images to prepare them for inclusion in the book. I don't know who is being paid to do this restoration work, but that doesn't strike me as the completion time of a professional.

EDIT: Never mind the fact that most of the Amazon reviewers have never posted another review before, and at least one is in charge of what appears to be a website with links to the author.
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Old August 17 2013, 04:48 PM   #36
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

It's unfortunate that the actions of the publisher/editor(s) are damaging the book (assuming it was they, and not the author, who inserted the offending pictures) because it's a pretty amazing book. Maybe they could strip out the pictures in a future edition (or come to some sort of accommodation with the restorers) so those put off by the controversy would give the book a chance.

They might also take the opportunity of cleaning up the egregious typos. I know I said earlier that the text was fairly clean, but that was only in the first 50-75 pages. Later on, it's kind of a mess. Maybe they only had time/money to closely line-edit the beginning?
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Old August 17 2013, 07:35 PM   #37
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

I am in the photography industry and for your information StarTrekhistory.com does NOT own the said pictures. The only person who owns any of the pictures are the original photographer. Period! StarTrekhistory.com has illegally altered and posted online pictures they have not gotten written permission from the photographer in the first place. So they have no legal claim. It happens that Gerald Guiran and StarTrekhistory.com acquired their pictures from the same source years ago (Lincoln Enterprises), who was illegally distributing those pictures. Restoration of a negative cannot and does not give you any rights whatsoever to that picture. Never will! I wish everyone would quit making an issue over something that is not the real content of the book. Cushman was a personal friend of Gene Roddenberry and has the endorsement of his son. What more does he need?

Kevin
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Old August 17 2013, 08:08 PM   #38
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Star Trek History, as I understand it, isn't asserting ownership of the pictures their contributers purchased from Lincoln Enterprises. Where they draw exception is the use of their restorations of these images to promote the book on Facebook and in the book itself, which the publisher did without asking permission or (in all the cases I have seen so far in the book, which I have not finished) giving credit to the site.

Gurian has asserted that the images are either his (purchased from Lincoln Enterprises) or that he can't remember their source. Star Trek History has asserted that the "digital fingerprints" of their restoration can be found on the images which continue to be posted on Facebook to promote the book.

I am no expert on photographic restoration, but I trust Star Trek History in this matter. Considering that they would have likely provided their restorations for free (and at much hire quality) if the publisher had simply asked, the behavior of Jacobs Prown Press hardly strikes me as noble.
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Old August 17 2013, 09:11 PM   #39
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Harvey wrote: View Post
I am no expert on photographic restoration, but I trust Star Trek History in this matter. Considering that they would have likely provided their restorations for free (and at much hire quality) if the publisher had simply asked, the behavior of Jacobs Prown Press hardly strikes me as noble.
The opposite can also be said. StarTrekhistories restoration of images they do NOT own is also questionable. As I stated above photographs belong only and exclusively to the photographer who took the picture. If you have pictures taken by a photographer of your family, even if you have purchased the pictures, you do NOT own the pictures. You only own the right to reproduce them for personal use only. The photographer always retains the rights to photos they took by copyright law. So technically StarTrekhistory is just as much in the wrong here.

Kevin
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Old August 17 2013, 09:59 PM   #40
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

I think it's worth mentioning that the authors of the licensed, CBS-approved book Star Trek 365 approached Star Trek History about using their restored images in the book (and did use them, with credit and permission). To me, this suggests that CBS doesn't mind the website's display of behind-the-scenes images from the original series. But I don't run the site, so I wouldn't know.
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Old August 17 2013, 11:13 PM   #41
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Ktrek wrote: View Post
Cushman was a personal friend of Gene Roddenberry and has the endorsement of his son. What more does he need?
This explains alot. Roddenberry never had any issue with withholding credit and payment for the work of others. Seems Cushman is simply following his lead.

It's not about whether it's illegal or not. Just because an action may be purely legal, doesn't make it right. If this guy is using images that were refurbished by TrekHistory and others, then he should give them credit for their work.

It's as simple as that in my book.
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Old August 17 2013, 11:54 PM   #42
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Harvey wrote: View Post
Daddy Todd wrote: View Post
OK, now THIS is interesting. There's a list of story assignments made during Season One. It includes a number that were abandoned and never produced (at least, not under the given name).

So, in some alternate universe, TOS Season One included:
Warrior's World by Stephen Kandel
The Machine That Went Too Far by A.E. van Vogt
Chicago II by George Clayton Johnson (an early attempt at A Piece of the Action?)
Alien Spirit by Norman Katkov
Untitled by Jack Guss (I'm willing to bet that wouldn't have been the final title)
Journey to Reolite by Alfred Brenner
Rites of Fertility by Robert Sheckley
From The First Day To The Last by John D.F. Black
Sisters in Space by Robert Sheckley
Portrait in Black and White by Barry Trivers
Rock-a-Bye Baby or Die! by George Clayton Johnson
The Squaw by Shimon Wincelberg
Accident of Love by Allen Balter & William Woodfield
Dreadnaught by Alf Harris & Jeeli Jacobs
World of Warriors/Tomorrow the Universe by Paul Schneider(another attempt at Kandel's earlier Warrior's World?)

In all, there were 45 assignments handed out for the 29 episodes produced in Season One (several stories turned up in later seasons, like The Omega Glory, Amok Time and Friday's Child)
From The First Day to the Last was the title of John D.F. Black's version of the envelope for the first pilot. Credit for the final episode went to WGA arbitration; Black didn't submit a statement (believing the script drafts stood for themselves) and was denied credit.

Probably in the book, but thought it was worth pointing out.
Would love to read a treatment of what Black's envelope story and how different it was to what actually aired.
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Old August 18 2013, 12:00 AM   #43
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

BillJ wrote: View Post

It's not about whether it's illegal or not. Just because an action may be purely legal, doesn't make it right. If this guy is using images that were refurbished by TrekHistory and others, then he should give them credit for their work.

It's as simple as that in my book.
I see a lot of claims about these pictures belonging to StarTrekhistory.com but I have not seen one bit of hard evidence that that is the case. Have any of you even seen any comparisons that prove images were gleaned from their site without credit? I have looked and cannot find it. It seems all unsubstantiated so far. I think StarTrekhistory.com probably wishes they had published the book instead.

Kevin
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Old August 18 2013, 12:02 AM   #44
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

Ktrek wrote: View Post
BillJ wrote: View Post

It's not about whether it's illegal or not. Just because an action may be purely legal, doesn't make it right. If this guy is using images that were refurbished by TrekHistory and others, then he should give them credit for their work.

It's as simple as that in my book.
I see a lot of claims about these pictures belonging to StarTrekhistory.com but I have not seen one bit of hard evidence that that is the case. Have any of you even seen any comparisons that prove images were gleaned from their site without credit? I have looked and cannot find it. It seems all unsubstantiated so far. I think StarTrekhistory.com probably wishes they had published the book instead.

Kevin
Which is why I put "if".
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Old August 19 2013, 12:52 AM   #45
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Re: Print-on-demand retrospective TOS book forthcoming

middyseafort wrote: View Post
Would love to read a treatment of what Black's envelope story and how different it was to what actually aired.
Sadly, there's no details about it in the book. There's mention of Black's WGA action against Roddenberry over "The Menagerie" wrap (which Black lost) but no details at all about what was in Black's version. A curious oversight. And if Black (who was interviewed for the book) asked him not to reveal any details, then Cushman should've said so. Instead, it appears he just "forgot" to include it. There are details of every other purchased treatment and/or teleplay that could be found, as well as details of some that were never even purchased (like unsolicited treatments from Philip Jose Farmer) but nothing of Black's final work as Star Trek story editor. Perhaps it's lost forever.
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