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Old August 9 2013, 02:06 AM   #31
Star Wolf
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Yminale wrote: View Post
DarthTom wrote: View Post
Damon is another hot button in terms of the 'Hollywood Hypocrites,' with conservatives. Damon is a big time advocate for public education yet sends his own children to private schools.
It would be hypocrisy if he didn't pay his local taxes which support public schools. I can afford to use FedEx and UPS, that doesn't mean I'm a hypocrite for supporting the Post Office.
Yeah, given that he is a celebrity sending his kids to public school would be kind of reckless so I can't blame him for using private schools.

So that brings us to the political controversy of the movie. In effect what makes his kids special? Because he is part of the 1 percent?

His kids are in Elysium Middle School while the rest of us have ours in 18th Street('s) School
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Old August 9 2013, 02:10 AM   #32
Yminale
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Star Wolf wrote: View Post

So that brings us to the political controversy of the movie. In effect what makes his kids special? Because he is part of the 1 percent?

His kids are in Elysium Middle School while the rest of us have ours in 18th Street('s) School
His kids aren't "special". They are lucky. Public services exist so people don't become victims of bad luck. I have no problem with the 1% spending money, its the hoarding of wealth and privilege that is the problem.
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Old August 9 2013, 02:14 AM   #33
Star Wolf
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Yminale wrote: View Post
Star Wolf wrote: View Post

So that brings us to the political controversy of the movie. In effect what makes his kids special? Because he is part of the 1 percent?

His kids are in Elysium Middle School while the rest of us have ours in 18th Street('s) School
His kids aren't "special". They are lucky. Public services exist so people don't become victims of bad luck. I have no problem with the 1% spending money, its the hoarding of wealth and privilege that is the problem.
Just as any resident born into, married into or however they got into Elysium. They are specialy serviced because they were lucky
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Old August 9 2013, 02:20 AM   #34
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Star Wolf wrote: View Post
His kids are in Elysium Middle School while the rest of us have ours in 18th Street('s) School
That's a false equivalency. Everyone's child has access to education (granting the quality of that education can vary depending on the area you live in.) Damon has chosen to send his kids to a private school likely for security reasons -him being a celebrity and all- but he still pays taxes to fund private education and supports it in principle. It's just not suitable for HIS situation. I wouldn't blame him for cruising around town in a $100,000 Mercedes while I'm in a $17,000 Ford Focus.

The "idea" in Elysium seems to be that the "other 99%" DON'T have the basics of life and civilization and the 1% DOES. (Again, citing the trailers showing Matt Damon's character close to death from a treatable illness while people in Elysium have access to cancer-ridding machines in their living room.)

So it'd be more equal to say that if the only way you can get your kid an education is by paying out the nose for private school. If you can't afford it then you kid goes uneducated.

Which speaks to the larger problem we have in society when it comes to the "1%" getting away with all sorts of things and having access to things that the rest of us don't. The economy was crashed 5 years ago because the other 99% dicked around with the rules so much. What happened? By and large a stern talking too, a slap on the wrist, and tax-payer money to go and fix things, resulting in huge bonuses to the very men who ruined things in the first place.

You or I cheat on our taxes? We get huge fines and go to prison. Those elite do it or do insider trading they get slapped on the wrist. It's a disparity.

Going back to Matt Damon he's not saying "Public schools are for suckers and my kids are going to get a good, wholesome, QUALITY education of private school" he's just saying, "look I can afford it and my kids would likely be a disability to a learning environment in public school. It's a great service for people to use but it doesn't work for my situation."

Again, I can see the argument the movie wants to make and I also think I mostly agree with it as the whole 1%/99% think I see the argument behind. It's a huge disparity and half our country and elected officials have been fighting against people getting something as simple as health care.

It is a big problem we have in society.

Do I think the movie is trying to make the argument? I'm not sure. I'm also not sure "District 9" was a commentary to Apartheid.
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Old August 9 2013, 02:20 AM   #35
Yminale
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Star Wolf wrote: View Post
Just as any resident born into, married into or however they got into Elysium. They are specially serviced because they were lucky
Special implies a unique trait hence justified being set apart. Luck is not a trait. You can't earn it, give it, receive it, or hold on to it.
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Old August 9 2013, 02:32 AM   #36
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

I'm am not sure when wanting basic rights and privileges for everyone in society became a part of the socialist agenda. Wanting a basic standard of living for everyone does not equal everyone having the same standard of living.
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Old August 9 2013, 04:51 AM   #37
Yminale
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

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I'm am not sure when wanting basic rights and privileges for everyone in society became a part of the socialist agenda. Wanting a basic standard of living for everyone does not equal everyone having the same standard of living.
When: Since the dawn of time. Social justice has always been part of liberal/progressive/socialist agenda. Conservatives believes in "rugged individualism" and "I've got mine, screw you-ism"
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Old August 9 2013, 04:57 AM   #38
davejames
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

theenglish wrote: View Post
I'm am not sure when wanting basic rights and privileges for everyone in society became a part of the socialist agenda. Wanting a basic standard of living for everyone does not equal everyone having the same standard of living.
Well said. The millions of poor people out there aren't asking to live in mansions or drive expensive cars or anything. They just want basic access to services, the ability to support their families, and to not have to send their kids to bed hungry every night.

And yeah I know, "capitalism doesn't work that way, yadda yadda," but at a certain point corporations and the rich are going to hoard so much of the money there won't be enough people left who can afford to keep the machine going, and it'll just grind to a halt.
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Old August 9 2013, 02:01 PM   #39
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

theenglish wrote: View Post
I'm am not sure when wanting basic rights and privileges for everyone in society became a part of the socialist agenda.
Probably around the same time the Supreme Court said the states couldn't keep black kids out of white schools.

I'd like to be interested in the movie and support its obvious agenda, but much like In Time, I'm having difficulty with the concept. Surely it'd be far easier, and much more appealing, to construct and defend a colony for the super-rich on some tropical island paradise than to construct and maintain an orbital facility. Granted, then you wouldn't have the literal top-to-bottom visual metaphor, but...
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Old August 9 2013, 02:56 PM   #40
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Unrelated to the social issues on this film - I'm noticing a pattern regarding what appears to be decent films e.g. Pacific Rim and others that have failed this summer [ which potentially is also Elysium] and IMO there seems to be a lack of creativity in the marketing departments to promoting these films.

Trek, World War Z, Obvilion and others were promoted well across several media platforms.

Pacific Rim and After Earth were promoted very badly.
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Old August 9 2013, 03:13 PM   #41
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

Saw the movie last night and loved it. It was the prospect of seeing a realistic-looking ringworld for the first time on the big screen that piqued my interest, but I ended up getting a pretty good movie to go along with it. The whole thing looked very much like District 9 and I thought that was Sharlto Copley I saw. Sure enough it was him and the movie even came from the same director who made District 9. I wasn't expecting all that going in. Amazing how many of the same elements it had, right down to the exosuit. Excellent cinematography, by the way. I like Blomkamp's style. I do have one minor nitpick though. Future L.A. looked great as an appropriately impoverished dystopia, but I didn't feel like I was watching something that took place in L. A.

I give the movie an A. Lots to debate and think about. I downgraded it a bit because it's a movie that has it's heart in the right place but its attempt at a workable solution to the problems presented is pretty weak. Didn't downgrade it too much though because the entertainment value and spectacular visuals made up for the few weak spots that were there.

Jodie Foster loved District 9 and wished that she had directed it, so she was happy to get onboard with this. Reminds me of Jet Li doing Hero after having passed on Crouching Tiger.
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Old August 9 2013, 03:28 PM   #42
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

I saw the movie last night also and I think I will give it an A- or B+. I don't know how you could watch this movie and feel....i dunno something.....the movie does not try to hide its themes and they really are right in front of you to digest. Movies and books that cause me to think really stay with me for a while and I am still mulling over this movie and the world that Blookamp (sp?) created.

The one weakness of the movie though was I felt the 'Kruger' character and his assorted goons were very one dimensional and cartoonish. I dunno for some reason , I like to root for my villains or at least see where they are coming from. Jodie Fosters character was cold, but she at least had a couple of lines where you could see where she was coming from.

Honestly,it is good the movie ended when it did as I felt the last 20 minutes the movie was starting to fall apart for me. That being said I would highly recommend it.
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Old August 9 2013, 03:40 PM   #43
Agent Richard07
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

NX74205 wrote: View Post
The one weakness of the movie though was I felt the 'Kruger' character and his assorted goons were very one dimensional and cartoonish. I dunno for some reason , I like to root for my villains or at least see where they are coming from.
Between this and District 9, it looks like Blomkamp likes to mix it up a bit... Real drama and a hot button issue along with some fun stuff thrown in.

NX74205 wrote: View Post
Jodie Fosters character was cold, but she at least had a couple of lines where you could see where she was coming from.
I was surprised by the blatant use of the name "Homeland Security". They certainly didn't try to hide that.
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Old August 9 2013, 04:28 PM   #44
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

When are conservatives not whining about Hollywood or crapping their pants about some imaginary red threat?

This is a common theme throughout sci-fi anyway, a number of dystopic books and films centre around the idea of capitalism and wealth disparity spinning out of control. Just from last year the Total Recall remake had a very similar setup where the rich all live in Great Britain, and the poor people have all been exiled to Australia and spend their time working to support the rich.

It's hardly an unimaginable concept. I mean just take right now, for example.
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Old August 9 2013, 05:38 PM   #45
EyalM
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Re: Elysium - grade/review and spoilers - also controversy

I saw it. I'd say it's a B, I enjoyed it, but have no urge to see it again anytime soon.

There are some points I wish the movie was more clear about:
Like, what exactly was the legal standing between Elysium and Earth? In some cases it looks like Elysium is a sovereign separate nation (one of the charterers mentions having embassies down on Earth). In others, it seems like Elysium is ruling the world with only the rich having citizen status.
I'm guessing the movie chose to be vague on this point since it wanted to focus on more on the issue of access to health care.

One spoiler nitpick:
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