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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old August 5 2013, 12:33 AM   #31
iguana_tonante
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

NuFan wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
I project that by 2027 all Internet boards will be the electronic equivalent of yelling "get off my lawn, you damn whippersnappers!".
They already do that. And try to convince each other the 90s are coming back any day now.
Hey, the 90s were my teenage years! I swear I never had a flannel shirt, tho.
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Old August 5 2013, 01:07 AM   #32
Set Harth
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
Actually, I think you missing much more here. For example, how is having unmarried parents equated with "parents not having anything to do with their children"?
I did no such equating. I only asked why not having anything to do with their children would be considered a good thing.
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Old August 5 2013, 01:15 AM   #33
M'Sharak
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Set Harth wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
Actually, I think you missing much more here. For example, how is having unmarried parents equated with "parents not having anything to do with their children"?
I did no such equating. I only asked why not having anything to do with their children would be considered a good thing.
I'm really not seeing where anyone's said that they did consider it such. Why not just let it go?
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Old August 5 2013, 01:32 AM   #34
iguana_tonante
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Set Harth wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
Actually, I think you missing much more here. For example, how is having unmarried parents equated with "parents not having anything to do with their children"?
I did no such equating. I only asked why not having anything to do with their children would be considered a good thing.
Well, since of course it wouldn't, I didn't feel like it needed a reply.

I was replying to CommishSleer who clearly made a connection between the two circumstances.

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
But 30 years ago it was more shocking to see unmarried people having children and not having anything to do with their children.
I guess the clauses ("unmarried people having children" and "not having anything to do with their children") could be read as independent, but as proposed, they read as related (if not outright connected by implication). I reject that premise.
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Old August 5 2013, 01:51 AM   #35
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Didn't a Vulcan character in Voyager go through Pon Farr without being married/bonded? Vorik?
Yes I remember Vorik hassling B'Elanna. I can't remember the resolution, was it a fight or a holodeck creation like Tuvok?
IIRC, B'Elanna fought and defeated Vorik, which seemed to ease things. (Vorik had declared a ritual Vulcan marriage proposal to her when he first started going through the condition.)
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Old August 5 2013, 06:07 AM   #36
Lt. Cheka Wey
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Weren't there other Vulcans on Voyager?
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Old August 5 2013, 06:20 AM   #37
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

^ The only ones we ever saw were Tuvok and Vorik.
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Old August 5 2013, 07:49 AM   #38
CommishSleer
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

To answer the original question, I would like to see an ummarried couple, or triad or Denobulan type family etc with children as much as I would like to see the same family with married parents. Not at all unless it has something important to do with the plot. Were the little girl's parents in STID married? I don't know and I don't care.

I'd rather them spend time showing a woman captain/commander who wasn't someone's girlfriend or Admiral's daughter. And only that too if it adds to the plot of the movie.
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Old August 5 2013, 02:11 PM   #39
The Wormhole
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Lt. Cheka Wey wrote: View Post
Weren't there other Vulcans on Voyager?
In addition to Tuvok and Vorik there was also this female officer.
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Old August 5 2013, 02:26 PM   #40
Timo
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

One should note that when Vorik and B'Elanna fought, it was because both were Vulcan males, or were deluded into thinking they were. We know from "Amok Time" already that a suitably violent fight clears the heads of males. Rules dictate a fight to the death, but rules can be waived, and the VOY episode shows that neither side really needs to see the other dead in order to come out of the haze.

Once the heads are cleared, there doesn't seem to be any immediate urge for mating, either in the bride-choosing sense or the bride-mounting sense.

Despite a variety of episodes tackling pon farr and plak tow from the male and female angles, we still don't really know what it is all about, down deep. Back in "Amok Time", sensibilities of the time dictated describing it as an urge to "find" a mate, and there was no talk about actual copulation or any such physicality. Intriguingly, later episodes have taken perhaps too much for granted and have never actually verified the role of sex in all this, nor have they laid in canon stone such beliefs as a continuing seven-year cycle for Vulcans who have already married; a seven-year cycle for females; or a relationship between the seven-year male cycle and the bearing of children (or indeed having of sex).

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Old August 5 2013, 10:21 PM   #41
Clancy_s
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

LobsterAfternoon wrote: View Post
On the topic of Spock/nu Vulcan having arranged marriages/breedings - that seems short-sighted. If anything, Vulcans should be encouraged to breed with humans. We've seen that Spock, a vulcan/human hybrid, seems to be, from a physiological standpoint, almost completely Vulcan. Given that he was able to succeed in Vulcan society, to the point where he was offered a slot at the Vulcan Science Academy, there seems to be no intellectual downside either. If Vulcans can get over their superiority complex, they'd see that the logical choice is to have more relationships with humans, not fewer.
IMO it's unlikely the Vulcans would drop their superiority notions - logic doesn't seem to take them that far. Even if it did human - Vulcan interbreeding would only work if such unions were naturally fertile and produced fertile offspring. Until and unless canon states otherwise to me Spock was the result of painstaking genetic engineering and is infertile.

CommishSleer wrote: View Post
To answer the original question, I would like to see an ummarried couple, or triad or Denobulan type family etc with children as much as I would like to see the same family with married parents. Not at all unless it has something important to do with the plot. Were the little girl's parents in STID married? I don't know and I don't care.

I'd rather them spend time showing a woman captain/commander who wasn't someone's girlfriend or Admiral's daughter. And only that too if it adds to the plot of the movie.
Absolutely! If I wanted soap opera I wouldn't be watching Star Trek.
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Old August 5 2013, 11:04 PM   #42
LobsterAfternoon
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Is there any reason to think that vulcans and humans need genetic engineering to mate? Lorian from Enterprise was a hybrid and he was the child of a human and a vulcan on a 22nd century starship without any mention of any help. We also had Sela and Simon Tarses, who were Romulan/Human and again, no mention of genetic engineering. Hell, Klingon/Trill was even possible, just with a few weeks worth of research by one doctor.
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Old August 6 2013, 03:23 AM   #43
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

LobsterAfternoon wrote: View Post
Is there any reason to think that vulcans and humans need genetic engineering to mate? Lorian from Enterprise was a hybrid and he was the child of a human and a vulcan on a 22nd century starship without any mention of any help.
Phlox has stated that it was his help that enabled Lorian to exist. Vulcans and humans were thought to be unable to procreate - I think Phlox was the first to make a treatment possible.
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Old August 6 2013, 05:08 AM   #44
LobsterAfternoon
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

Ah, forgot that bit. Perhaps in the 22nd century, it's a bit more work. Perhaps by the 23rd century, especially in the nu-verse with its higher tech, it might be a relatively simple trick, similar to the rogam shots that some pregnant women need to get now?
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Old August 6 2013, 01:36 PM   #45
Bry_Sinclair
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Re: Marriage in Nutrek

The Prime Kirk and Marcus weren't married and had a son.

People will opt to marry/no marry in Trek for the same reasons they do now. The best thing is there won't be any narrow-minded bigots who think they know what love is and who should marry.

For example, I don't see Spock and Uhura marrying, as he'll soon come to his senses and realise what a pain in the neck she is.
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