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Old August 4 2013, 09:21 PM   #16
Timo
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Ain't the whole thread something of a non sequitur? We have no evidence that politicians in the future would be subject to any sort of scrutiny.

I mean, yeah, Kirk calls the Federation a "democratic body" in "Errand of Mercy", but in practice we never hear of any elections apart for that of the UFP President in "Homefront"/"Paradise Lost". In "Rapture", Bajoran representatives to the Federation Council are to be "chosen", not elected; we can't tell whether there's a difference. And we have no idea who elects the President. Citizens? Council Members? A Gathering of Wise Men (Women/Others)?

Even if it were possible to affect the position of a politician with elections, that'd only work if a politician were allowed to serve more than one term to start with. Re-election has never been mentioned in any Trek context.



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Old August 4 2013, 09:22 PM   #17
Lt. Cheka Wey
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

In the 24th century, if you're a politician not having illicit sex, it's a scandal.
So, rape and that's it.
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Old August 4 2013, 09:34 PM   #18
Timo
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

You mean it guarantees re-election?

Interestingly, Spock seemed to approve of rape in "Enemy Within". If Vulcans get a vote, or are as influential otherwise as suggested in many episodes and movies...

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Old August 5 2013, 12:11 AM   #19
JirinPanthosa
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Holodecks have eliminated the need for sex scandals.

I tend to think 24th century people are very progressive about any sort of consensual sex, so people have basically stopped caring.

@Timo

The Federation is a democratic body, but Starfleet is not.
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Old August 5 2013, 12:19 AM   #20
LobsterAfternoon
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Holodecks probably help keep sex scandals to a minimum.
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Old August 5 2013, 01:43 AM   #21
The Wormhole
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible. The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is deltan.
Except he did have hair, even if it was just an "old man's fringe" around the back. Deltans are completely bald.
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Old August 5 2013, 03:47 AM   #22
Shawnster
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Lt. Cheka Wey wrote: View Post
In the 24th century, if you're a politician not having illicit sex, it's a scandal.
So, rape and that's it.
Well, there is also adultery. Previous posters have commented that consensual sex between consenting adults is nobody's business but the parties involved. Is the innocent mate involved? Perhaps what is meant that it's not the voting populace business if a 24th century politician cheats on his or her spouse.

Some may disagree with this, however. If a politician is not able to keep to the vow he or she swore to a spouse, and if said politician feels the need to lie and be deceitful about the extra-marital relationship, then how can that politician be trusted to stay faithful to any other vow that is taken? If a politician can feel that his marital vow can be broken, what is to stop him from likewise breaking his vow to the people he represents?

Or, what happens if some third party chooses to use the marital affair as a source of blackmail? A politician that is actively hiding or covering up some form of conduct that he doesn't want revealed is opening himself up to possible blackmail or coercion if an outside source discovers the secret. This can be disastrous to a government official.

Or, you have the whole Baltar from NuBSG storyline where the unscrupulous outsider uses sex as a means of manipulating a political leader into compromising state security. We're not so much concerned about the politician boinking the hot blonde, but we're concerned that the politician allowed the hot blond to manipulate him in exchange for said boinking.

I don't see how the 24th century is above and beyond such problems.
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Old August 5 2013, 03:55 AM   #23
Nerys Myk
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

LobsterAfternoon wrote: View Post
Holodecks probably help keep sex scandals to a minimum.
Till the tabloids find out your favorite program is "Vulcan Love Slave".
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Old August 5 2013, 05:06 AM   #24
TorontoTrekker
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible. The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is deltan.
Except he did have hair, even if it was just an "old man's fringe" around the back. Deltans are completely bald.
Not necessarily: Ilia was bald, but Jedda was not.
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Old August 5 2013, 06:22 AM   #25
Mr. Laser Beam
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible.
Deltans do that so that they won't take advantage of others. Remember, sex is involved in literally every facet of Deltan society. When a Deltan interacts with a lot of non-Deltans, there are bound to be problems, unless the Deltan takes precautions.

The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is deltan.
No, he's human. His name is Hiram Roth.
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Old August 5 2013, 01:48 PM   #26
Shaka Zulu
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible. The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is Deltan.
Bald, and with a beard? He's human. Deltan men don't have facial hair.

Kirk's behaviors in the new movies would be grounds for scandal in Starfleet alone (especially his amorous pursuit of Chapel).
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Old August 5 2013, 01:50 PM   #27
Shat Happens
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

TorontoTrekker wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible. The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is deltan.
Except he did have hair, even if it was just an "old man's fringe" around the back. Deltans are completely bald.
Not necessarily: Ilia was bald, but Jedda was not.
So maybe Deltans, unlike Terrans, grow hair as they age. Or maybe Deltans, being Deltans, have a condition analogue to Earth's legendary "hairy palm", but there it's called "hairy head" and very much celebrated. That would explain Ilia being celibate, young and bald. What about this theory?
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Old August 5 2013, 01:59 PM   #28
The Wormhole
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

TorontoTrekker wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Shat Happens wrote: View Post
Some feds citizens (at least some Starfleet officers) have to take and record a oath of celibacy so it is possible. The Fed Pres in IV is bald, maybe he is deltan.
Except he did have hair, even if it was just an "old man's fringe" around the back. Deltans are completely bald.
Not necessarily: Ilia was bald, but Jedda was not.
Interesting, didn't realize he was meant to be Deltan. I based my comment on the novels of today (yeah, I know, not canon) stating that all Deltans are bald. Which I guess means they're either unaware Jedda was meant to be Deltan or they're just ignoring it since it wasn't canonically stated. Indeed, I believe there was even a line on Enterprise describing Deltans as bald. Although, that conversation was only about their women. So I guess if we count Jedda as a Deltan, we could theorize that perhaps Deltan men grow hair but the women do not.
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Old August 5 2013, 02:00 PM   #29
Shawnster
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Did we see any other Deltan women besides Illia? Maybe she chose to shave her head for some reason. Perhaps the shaved head is part of the oath of celibacy?
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Old August 5 2013, 02:32 PM   #30
Timo
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Re: Are Federation politicians immune to sex scandals?

Or the result of a silly bet.

There's a lot of background on the little details of the TOS movies, especially ST:TMP which was grossly overthought and really represented something of a 90/10 split of material left out and material included in the actual film. We aren't really obligated to believe all of it, though, not if we confess to the canon faith. In onscreen terms, Ilia's baldness is not explained as being species-typical, species-atypical or anything else. Her oath of celibacy is not extrapolated on, either - perhaps she was a notorious sex offender who was all over the news before she reformed and joined Starfleet?

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