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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies I-X

Star Trek Movies I-X Discuss the first ten big screen outings in this forum!

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Old July 31 2013, 02:45 AM   #16
arch101
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Always thought the crew were back on standard exploration duty. But, I like some of the thoughts expressed above.
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Old July 31 2013, 03:48 AM   #17
Lance
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Tomalak wrote: View Post
I get the impression that Starfleet used them more like galactic troubleshooters rather than have them on general duties.
This.

My pet theory, based on what we see on screen, has always been that following the Earth probe situation in STIV, Kirk and crew aren't exactly on the 'active duty' roster. On both occasions that we see the 1701-A, the crew are initially seen/said to be seperated from each other, and it's only a unique crisis situation which sees them all being recruited for a mission. I hold that this is pretty much it: the Excelsior was still undergoing tests in STIV and STV, hence why Sulu is still hanging out waiting for her to become available and is able to come back to 1701-A for the Nimbus II mission, and 1701-B is obviously on the drawing board as well. 1701-A is not an 'active ship' and incidents like the crisis at Nimbus III or the Khitomer accords see Kirk and crew being wheeled out, almost ceremonially, because they've got the peculiar skills needed for that one mission, and then afterwards they probably all go back into semi-retirement. Scotty talks about such in STVI, McCoy has no idea where Sulu is (and the others all act like they haven't seen each other in years), and Spock is away doing diplomatic stuff.

I understand the need for fandom to fill in the gaps, but I've always thought maybe the 1701-A Enterprise had at best only a small handful of "special assignments" during that period, but was otherwise a ship that just didn't get out all that much.
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Old July 31 2013, 05:33 AM   #18
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

McCoy also makes the claim of having been the ship's CMO for what, 26 years? Does that mean he was still considered to have had that role after he had resigned in the years between TOS and TMP? (I know, it is like the Meyer films don't even acknowledge TMP happened. They seem to think Kirk never saved Earth till TVH or somesuch. But even so.)

I've always figured they had another couple 5 year missions between TMP and TWOK, with Kirk stepping down or forced down toward the end of that 3rd set of 5, and then it being back to biz as usual, perhaps an openended mission, after TVH & TFF. But the 'save them for special assignment' notion does have some credibility, I'll grant you.
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Old July 31 2013, 05:35 AM   #19
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Lance wrote: View Post
I understand the need for fandom to fill in the gaps, but I've always thought maybe the 1701-A Enterprise had at best only a small handful of "special assignments" during that period, but was otherwise a ship that just didn't get out all that much.
This makes a ton of sense to me and is probably the most realistic picture of what went on, but there's just enough conflicting info to leave doubts.

I guess that's why the 1701-A has always been interesting to me; that ship could have built its own legacy, or it could just be regarded as nothing more than a vanity and a big joke.
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Old July 31 2013, 10:17 AM   #20
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

That the heroes are only "about" to retire doesn't mean they would have been spending their last active months or years in field assignments. For all we know, the ship has seen constant and demanding service, but under a variety of commanders, with Kirk being sent only when there was a special need to provocatively show off Starfleet's greatest hero.

Various offhand remarks suggesting continuity need not be taken quite so literally. "The first Enterprise without Kirk in command" is a valid statement (by newspaper tagline standards anyway), without having to mean that nobody else but Kirk ever commanded starships named Enterprise. "Been starship CMO for 27 years" doesn't mean doing 27 times 365 times 24 hours of that work, only that McCoy first became a starship CMO 27 years ago. And so forth.

There's definitely room for both the interpretations on the nature of the E-A, then. If she's kept running even when Kirk is off womanizing and Spock talks peace with Klingons, then she's unlikely to be a pariah ship. But it might still be a 23rd century fact that older ships are more expensive to operate, and best kept inactive until really needed.

As for the bunk beds, there's nothing about them that would run contrary to what was actually seen in TOS. Roddenberry didn't really have all that much influence over his very own show in the end: the ship doesn't have an all-officer crew, for example. Really, most of Roddenberry's supposed dictations were probably done well after the fact, contradicting his own original thinking.

Now, bunk beds for key officers who sleep in their service uniforms in VOY "Flashback" can be argued to be contrary to TOS. But they are also contrary to ST6:TUC (where only enlisteds had bunk beds, in which they slept in pajamas), and to common sense. Then again, that was just a dream sequence... Perhaps the most embarrassing thing a Vulcan can dream of is wearing full clothes when not appropriate?

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Old July 31 2013, 05:30 PM   #21
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Given the statements said by the crew, and reading here. I'd say if the Enterprise was still operating (and I like the idea of huge damage to explain another refit) Kirk would probably be the only constant of the. Probably Chekov too, as his stand-in CO.

Scotty bought a boat so clearly has a lot of time.
Uhuru seems to be teaching.
McCoy is... well McCoy, and somehow doesn't know about Sulu.
and Spock is off starting his diplomatic career and he and Kirk clearly haven't seen each other in a while.

Everyone but Spock and McCoy I can see doing the odd mission.
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Old July 31 2013, 07:15 PM   #22
Timo
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Scotty bought a boat so clearly has a lot of time.
...Or is preparing to having some in the future.

In any case, Kirk had time for a log cabin (but not for a family) some years before ST2, according to ST:GEN. And Kirk's cabin is on Earth and supposedly not mobile, while Scotty might have bought a boat he can try out on every planet his starship visits.

Uhuru seems to be teaching.
Umm, how so? And what subject?

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Old July 31 2013, 07:27 PM   #23
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

My impression was never that McCoy didn't know Sulu was a Captain, but that he didn't know why all the old Enterprise command crew had been assembled except for him and--as Kirk asks--Spock.
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Old August 1 2013, 04:24 AM   #24
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Roboturner913 wrote: View Post
I've always found this interesting. IIRC the events of Star Trek V occurred in 2287, with VI coming in 2293. A pretty significant gap.

Do we have any idea of what the Enterprise's mission was like in those years?
Here's my recent thread about novels in the movie era.

http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=220531

I'd love to see more novels in this era.

This is the timeline of the stories that happen between STV and STVI. Not all of them are about the Enterprise. What some of these codes mean, I'm not sure.

2287
{Stardate 8454.1} Star Trek V: The Final Frontier (ST novelization)
{Stardate 8461.7} In the Name of Honor (TOS #97)
{Stardate 8475.3 to 8501.2} Probe (TOS)
Pathways (VGR)
The Rift (TOS #57)

2288
Pathways (VGR)
“Legal Action” (TOS, SNW V)
Starfleet Academy (ST computer game novelization)
Day of Honor #4: Treaty’s Law (TOS)

2289
{Stardate 8988.2 - 9049.7} Excelsior Forged In Fire

2290
The Captain’s Table #1: War Dragons (TOS)

2291
“jubHa’” (SNW III)
{Stardate 8764.3 to 8774.8} Cacophony (ST audio)
{Stardate 9029.1 to 9029.4} Envoy (ST audio)
{Stardate 9121.4} Mere Anarchy #5: The Blood-Dimmed Tide (TOS eBook)

2292
{Stardate 9498.3} Bloodline (TOS Wildstorm graphic)

2293
Blood Will Tell #1: Against Their Nature (ST Klingons IDW graphic)
Blood Will Tell #2: Beneath The Skin (ST Klingons IDW graphic)
Blood Will Tell #3: The Order of Things (ST Klingons IDW graphic)
Blood Will Tell #4: Blood Reign O'er Me (ST Klingons IDW graphic)
Blood Will Tell #5: Losses (ST Klingons IDW graphic)
The Last Generation #1 Do Not Close Your Eyes (Myriad Universes IDW graphic)
{Stardate 9521.6 to 9529.1} Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country (ST novelization)
EDIT: You can also type in the year (2287, 2288, etc...) in the search engine at Memory Beta and it will give you a list of all published works placed in that year.
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Old August 2 2013, 04:58 PM   #25
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

FWIW, DC's comic series of the 90s had them more or less on another five-year mission. Works for me.

I believe the original TUC script contained dialog more clearly suggesting (or at least intimating) that the crew was basically puttering around before standing down. I believe the thought that Uhura was teaching comes from her mentioning she's "supposed to be chairing a seminar." That of course doesn't explicitly mean she was teaching.
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Old August 2 2013, 05:26 PM   #26
BillJ
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Praetor wrote: View Post
FWIW, DC's comic series of the 90s had them more or less on another five-year mission. Works for me.

I believe the original TUC script contained dialog more clearly suggesting (or at least intimating) that the crew was basically puttering around before standing down. I believe the thought that Uhura was teaching comes from her mentioning she's "supposed to be chairing a seminar." That of course doesn't explicitly mean she was teaching.
IIRC, there were scenes written where Kirk goes out and rounds up the rest of the senior staff for the mission.
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Old August 2 2013, 10:16 PM   #27
Mysterion
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

^^^
A version of those scenes were used in the novel The Fearful Summons. the novel was written by Denny Martin Flinn, who also had a hand in wrting the screenplay for ST6.

Not a very good novel, but if you want to know what that sequence might have been like, that's where you can find it.
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Old August 3 2013, 09:36 PM   #28
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Isn't there an even bigger gap between TMP and WROK?
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Old August 3 2013, 10:04 PM   #29
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Chrono85 wrote: View Post
Isn't there an even bigger gap between TMP and WROK?
Yes. What does that have to do with the topic of the OP?

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Old August 3 2013, 10:04 PM   #30
Timo
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Re: What do we know about the years between ST5 and ST6?

Depends. Onscreen, we can only establish that TMP can't have taken place earlier than late 2272 (because Kirk hasn't been logging star hours for 2.5 years, and Kirk's five-year mission ended during the year 2270 as per VOY dialogue). We can't establish the last possible date for TMP very well, except of course as "before TWoK".

We have indirect evidence, but not much of it. At least some starships adopted the new red wraparound uniform jackets by 2278, as per TNG "Cause and Effect", so it would be odd if Earth and the Enterprise (both central to the Federation and thus likely to receive hot new fashion very fast) continued to wear the TMP wardrobe after that date. However, TMP dialogue also says Voyager Six disappeared more than 300 years before the events of the movie, and in the real world the first Voyager was launched no earlier than 1977.

Our best bet might be to set TMP at early 2278, then, meaning there's a six-year gap to TWoK (in which a bottle from 2283 is considered old) at a minimum. If TWoK and its two sequels take place within three months, as the dialogue rather heavily suggests, and TFF follows immediately after TVH, then there's possibly a decade there until TUC - twice as long as the shortest supportable time between TMP and TWoK.

These are extreme figures, of course, and the truth probably lies somewhere in between - TMP in 2276, say, and TWoK in 2285. There's no way to be more accurate than that.

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