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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old June 29 2013, 12:15 AM   #31
Captain Kathryn
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

R. Star wrote: View Post
Bry_Sinclair wrote: View Post

I also think it would've been nice to have had a reveal after her death, that Tora Ziyal was actually Kira Ziyal--Nerys' half-sister who Dukat fathered.
That would've been so awesome just for the excuse of Dukat to say "You may call me daddy" to Kira.
EWWWWIES!!!!
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Old June 29 2013, 01:53 PM   #32
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

I like Ziyal but I find it unfortunate they had to go through three actresses. That's it for me.
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Old June 29 2013, 05:19 PM   #33
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Belz... wrote: View Post
I like Ziyal but I find it unfortunate they had to go through three actresses. That's it for me.
Yeah.

Am I the only one who preferred Actress #3? The one who had the relationship with Garak, I believe.

Seems like most people prefer #1.
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Old June 29 2013, 05:27 PM   #34
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Captain Kathryn wrote: View Post
Belz... wrote: View Post
I like Ziyal but I find it unfortunate they had to go through three actresses. That's it for me.
Yeah.

Am I the only one who preferred Actress #3? The one who had the relationship with Garak, I believe.

Seems like most people prefer #1.
Melanie Smith was my favorite of them all too.
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Old June 30 2013, 06:17 AM   #35
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Cyia Battem (Ziyal the First) was good in the role, though she did make the character look to be in her teens--when you think of what they had in mind for her she did need to be a little older (the last thing you want is a creepy old man leching over a young girl...you know like they did with Neelix/Kes).

Tracy Middendorf (Ziyal the Second) was pretty awful in her one appearance. I don't know what it is but she just didn't do anything for the character.

Melanie Smith (Ziyal the Third) was my favourite actress in the role. She really gave Ziyal a strength and charm that made her very endearing, so that when she was killed off it was a shock to lose her.
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Old June 30 2013, 11:50 PM   #36
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Bry_Sinclair wrote: View Post
Cyia Battem (Ziyal the First) was good in the role, though she did make the character look to be in her teens--when you think of what they had in mind for her she did need to be a little older (the last thing you want is a creepy old man leching over a young girl...you know like they did with Neelix/Kes).

Tracy Middendorf (Ziyal the Second) was pretty awful in her one appearance. I don't know what it is but she just didn't do anything for the character.

Melanie Smith (Ziyal the Third) was my favourite actress in the role. She really gave Ziyal a strength and charm that made her very endearing, so that when she was killed off it was a shock to lose her.
Agreed.

Ziyal #1 and Ziyal #3 looked very different age-wise.
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Old July 2 2013, 11:49 PM   #37
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

I thought Ziyal was rather dull. The writers could have named her Plot Device. Things would have been much more interesting had she taken after dear old dad.
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Old July 3 2013, 01:31 AM   #38
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Mirror Kira wrote: View Post
I thought Ziyal was rather dull. The writers could have named her Plot Device. Things would have been much more interesting had she taken after dear old dad.
If she had been "evil" she wouldn't have been much more than Dukat's lackey and Damar pretty much had that role filled.
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Old July 7 2013, 10:19 PM   #39
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

I think she brought Kira and dukat closer . I also liked the scene where dukat tells ziyal that he forgives her and loves her. It shows that he can love someone else. I find it very powerful. However, it only lasted for moment before he went over the edge.
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Old July 7 2013, 10:34 PM   #40
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

I prefer Ziyal 3, and I was sad when she died. Because I find her scarily too attractive :I
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Old July 8 2013, 05:58 PM   #41
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Why is it scary? She's pretty cute.
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Old July 8 2013, 06:06 PM   #42
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

She really is
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Old July 12 2013, 05:33 AM   #43
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Mirror Kira wrote: View Post
I thought Ziyal was rather dull. The writers could have named her Plot Device.
This, I think, is the most accurate description of her, sad to say. While I like the idea of Ziyal (and how she reflects Dukat's character), her character was treated so clumsily that I found it hard to really connect with her.

That TPTB kept recasting her so much certainly points to her being not much more that a walking, talking plot point to them, but there are other things that gives me whiplash when I think too much about her.

There are a couple of hints in Return To Grace that she and Damar were friends at the time (she says he taught her the knife trick that Kira easily counters - why would he teach her a knife trick unless he was concerned about her safety?)

Yet a year or so later, he hates her and she hates him. There's no reason given. All we're shown is that Damar's such a deeply patriotic Cardassian that he decided to hate Ziyal just because she's half-Bajoran. While I think that's perfectly plausible of Damar at that point in Sacrifice of Angels, there's that the big, happy grin he gave her after they transport onto the Klingon ship in Return To Grace that I find difficult to forget.

Thus the whiplash!

I think of Ziyal's arc as sad and tragic, but that tragedy was caused just as much by the writers as by the stories they included her in. Considering how interesting Ziyal could have been, she - and we - deserved better.
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Old July 12 2013, 02:26 PM   #44
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Re: Ziyal - good addition or better left out?

Didn't care for her at all. The Garak thing was creepy, silly man working out his redemption with innocent flower wanting a better daddy.

There was nothing about the character that seemed like she just spent 6 years doing hard labor as a prisoner of the Breen. There was no connection.
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