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Old June 28 2013, 09:40 PM   #31
iguana_tonante
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the world doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the US is.
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the US doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the world is.

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Old June 28 2013, 10:45 PM   #32
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

^Touché
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Old June 28 2013, 10:52 PM   #33
RoJoHen
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the world doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the US is.
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the US doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the world is.

I grasp that, too. I just think some people view the US as one big country where everything is the same. People unfamiliar with the states may not realize just how different things can be from one state to another, even though they're technically in the same country.

This is something I've mostly observed from posters on this board. I never claim to be an expert on the world. I live in the US, and I haven't even been to half of the states.
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Old June 29 2013, 12:23 AM   #34
MacLeod
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

But is that down to how topics are taught? The higher the level the more detailed knowledge you get. So at say High School level you might get general knowledge with more detailed information about country/area in which you live.

But don't we learn by exchanging information and ideas?
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Old June 29 2013, 01:34 AM   #35
Owain Taggart
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

MacLeod wrote: View Post
But do most of the countries regulate these ata national level or a regional level. I suspect it would be the former. So it might not be 100% accurate but that doesn't mean it's inacurate overall.

See, that's the thing. I think it's mixed. Focusing on the national level is too narrow a view. You have to be able to see both the national and federal level in order to formulate a more complete picture. There are just too many variables otherwise.
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Old June 29 2013, 02:13 AM   #36
RoJoHen
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

Owain Taggart wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
But do most of the countries regulate these ata national level or a regional level. I suspect it would be the former. So it might not be 100% accurate but that doesn't mean it's inacurate overall.

See, that's the thing. I think it's mixed. Focusing on the national level is too narrow a view. You have to be able to see both the national and federal level in order to formulate a more complete picture. There are just too many variables otherwise.
Agreed. It simply depends on the laws being discussed here. In the US, for example, the federal laws are merely a baseline, but states are free to make said laws more strict if they choose.

The legal purchasing age of alcohol in the US is 21, but there are certain "dry" counties throughout the country where alcohol is completely prohibited, regardless of your age.

Or things like minimum wage. The national minimum wage in the US is $7.25/hour. In Illinois, where I live, minimum wage is currently $8.50, well above the legal minimum.

Or states like New Jersey, where the legal driving age is 18 (I believe).
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Old June 29 2013, 02:40 AM   #37
marksound
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

If you go strictly by the US Constitution, and not by case law, local and state law should take precedence over federal law except in cases of civil rights, interstate commerce, foreign trade, and national defense. It's been turned around to be the opposite. Our basic civil liberties (i.e. the Bill of Rights) have been usurped by special interests and politicians blinded by greed and ambition.

In my opinion, of course. :/
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Old June 29 2013, 02:40 AM   #38
Spot's Meow
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

MacLeod wrote: View Post
But isn't it just giving an overview, the map is showing countries as a whole. So whilst it might vary from state to state in the US, as a whole the US has no law in place to say ban smoking in certain places.
But let's say all 50 states have a law that being naked in public is illegal. But there's no federal law that states that. Based on the way these maps are compiled, if we had a map here for nakedness, even though the entire US operates under this law, the map would show the exact opposite. An "overview" for countries with distinct provinces or states just isn't possible, in my opinion.
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Old June 29 2013, 03:25 AM   #39
Owain Taggart
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

Spot's Meow wrote: View Post
MacLeod wrote: View Post
But isn't it just giving an overview, the map is showing countries as a whole. So whilst it might vary from state to state in the US, as a whole the US has no law in place to say ban smoking in certain places.
But let's say all 50 states have a law that being naked in public is illegal. But there's no federal law that states that. Based on the way these maps are compiled, if we had a map here for nakedness, even though the entire US operates under this law, the map would show the exact opposite. An "overview" for countries with distinct provinces or states just isn't possible, in my opinion.

Yep, and therefore the maps are somewhat misleading. If someone is going to choose where to live based on what they see on these maps, they'll have surprises.
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Old June 29 2013, 03:45 AM   #40
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

The idea that smoking isn't banned in schools at least through high school in the United States - because there's "no law" - is absurd. It's damned near banned everywhere.

And we apparently have no laws in place banning employment discrimination based on ethnicity. Right.
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Old June 30 2013, 12:14 AM   #41
iguana_tonante
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the world doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the US is.
I think, and I've thought this before, that a lot of the US doesn't really have a good grasp on just how large the world is.

I grasp that, too. I just think some people view the US as one big country where everything is the same. People unfamiliar with the states may not realize just how different things can be from one state to another, even though they're technically in the same country.
No, that's exactly the point.

A lot of countries have federal subdivisions, with different laws, customs, and traditions (from the UK to Brazil, Russia, India, etc). Hell, some even have different official languages (Canada, Belgium: just two examples). Even nominally unitary nations like France or China have wildly different communities living in the same country. The US is not alone, or even peculiar, in this: it's not the largest, the most populous, or even the most diverse federal country in the world.

Generally speaking, there is no more difference between California and Ohio than between Punjab and Kerala, Bavaria and Brandenburg, Sicily and Trentino.

That's the point I was trying to make.
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Old June 30 2013, 01:53 AM   #42
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
As an American, I think nothing of the legal drinking age being 21...until I see a map and realize that pretty much the rest of the world has it set at 18.

Another thing that was interesting to me:

To be a primary school teacher in the United States, you must have a bachelors degree.
To be a primary school teacher in a lot of other countries, you must have a bachelors degree PLUS specialized teacher training.

What does "specialized teacher training" mean, exactly? US teachers have to have bachelors degrees in Education. The whole point of their bachelors degree is to learn how to be teachers; what other kind of specialized training is required?
I don't think they have to have a Bachelor's in Education. Often, the bachelor's degree in the specific field would be sufficient (for example, a history teacher doesn't have to be a history education major, they can just have a BA in history).

Anyway, interesting map. I suspect it's not entirely accurate (for example, I think some states have paid leave for mothers even if it's not at the national level. Also, how does the UK have constitutional protections?).

Admiral Buzzkill wrote: View Post
And we apparently have no laws in place banning employment discrimination based on ethnicity. Right.
I think the category there was "constitutional" protection, which is accurate - provided you're talking about private employment. The Constitution (with a few exceptions) only prevents the government from doing certain things.
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Old June 30 2013, 09:55 AM   #43
RoJoHen
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

iguana_tonante wrote: View Post

That's the point I was trying to make.
I concede your point. Again, the entirety of my international experience is from talking to people on the TrekBBS. It's just something that I have noticed from people outside the US that they treat us as if every state is exactly the same, though I suppose it's very possible that we do the exact same thing to other countries.

Alidar Jarok wrote: View Post
I don't think they have to have a Bachelor's in Education. Often, the bachelor's degree in the specific field would be sufficient (for example, a history teacher doesn't have to be a history education major, they can just have a BA in history).
Well, this could very well be another thing that varies from state to state. In my state, I'm pretty sure you have to have a BA in Education to be allowed to teach. When I was going to college, everyone seeking an education degree had to double major in something else if they wanted to teach a specific subject. Otherwise anybody with any random bachelors degree could apply for a teaching job, and that's just not how it works.
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Old June 30 2013, 02:59 PM   #44
Alidar Jarok
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

Maybe Illinois is different. Here, anyone with a random bachelor's degree very much could apply for a teaching job. Quite often, they won't get it, but that depends on what the individual school is looking for. I know someone who was a bio chem major who now teaches high school science and I don't think had any education classes (certainly didn't major in education).
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Old June 30 2013, 10:20 PM   #45
iguana_tonante
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Re: Family Friendly Countries.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
iguana_tonante wrote: View Post

That's the point I was trying to make.
I concede your point. Again, the entirety of my international experience is from talking to people on the TrekBBS.
You are young, healthy, unattached. Go abroad for a while! Working holidays are great and you won't dig into your savings too much. You'll never regret it.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post
It's just something that I have noticed from people outside the US that they treat us as if every state is exactly the same, though I suppose it's very possible that we do the exact same thing to other countries.
I think it's something we are all guilty of. It's a matter of fractal perspective: if you are outside, things look uniform and coherent, but if you are in the inside, you see diversity and complexity.
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