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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Doctor Who

Doctor Who "Bigger on the inside..."

View Poll Results: 'Who' is John Hurt
The original incarnation of The Doctor (pre-Hartnell) 9 9.09%
The 9th Doctor, the one who ended the Time-War 57 57.58%
The Doctor's final incarnation, the 13th Doctor 3 3.03%
Something else entirely 30 30.30%
Voters: 99. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 23 2013, 04:36 PM   #211
Emperor-Tiberius
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Re: One particular SPOILER from The Name of the Doctor

Christopher wrote: View Post
diankra wrote: View Post
Says the chap whose ingenuity in sorting out the times when Trek writers said the same is legendary!
Well, that's different. Trek has usually made some effort at consistency and credibility, even though it often falls short. Who has generally been more unrepentantly a fanciful tall tale, a ripping yarn where believability is not a priority. It's tended to have a much more improvisational approach to its worldbuilding, and that's part of its charm. I feel that trying to discipline it into a cohesive, logical continuity is doing it a disservice.
I dunno, I think RTD's years had a pretty tight continuity within the stories themselves, and with what came before, especially in regard to the Tom Baker years, whose Genesis of the Daleks was the unofficial beggining of the Time War.

Can't talk about the Moffat years because I've only just finished RTD's run, and am muling over the Tom Baker years as we speak.
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Old June 23 2013, 05:36 PM   #212
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Re: One particular SPOILER from The Name of the Doctor

Emperor-Tiberius wrote: View Post
I dunno, I think RTD's years had a pretty tight continuity within the stories themselves, and with what came before, especially in regard to the Tom Baker years, whose Genesis of the Daleks was the unofficial beggining of the Time War.
That was, what, five or six years out of over thirty? And I felt RTD was as revisionist as any previous Who producer, reinventing the laws of time or rewriting past and future cosmic history as it suited him. For instance, the fate of Earth in "The End of the World" didn't bear any resemblance to its other far-future fates in stories like "The Ark" or "The Mysterious Planet." By contrast, "The Beast Below" in Moffat's first season did implicitly tie into the solar-flare cataclysm from "The Ark in Space"/"The Sontaran Experiment." Moffat's been heavier on the past-continuity nods than RTD was, but he's also been quite cavalier about rewriting the continuity, even explicitly incorporating the mutability of time into his storytelling.
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Old June 23 2013, 08:58 PM   #213
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Re: One particular SPOILER from The Name of the Doctor

Well think about it - all the meddling with time and space and other things probably changed things here and there and y'know hey... that was the same thing people complained about Trek was all the continuity to have to keep straight - even more confusing is when not everything from the past 50 years - even the past 40 years isn't really completely available. So I'll give Moffat some props for actually TRYING to tie in things to the past more so than RTD did and still think that this 'new series' should almost be accepted as a quasi-reboot - for all we know the Time War fucked a lot of things right up the ass and the 'future' as seen from any of the previous 8 Doctors is totally up for grabs as are events from the past. That COULD be what the Hurt Doctor's 'crime' was - he tried to 'fix' things too much.
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Old June 23 2013, 10:37 PM   #214
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Re: One particular SPOILER from The Name of the Doctor

^Well, sure, it's pretty much a given in-story that the Time War rewrote history. But what needs to be understood is that the original series was anything but a consistent timeline. It contradicted itself and rewrote its rules all the time, because so many different people wrote and produced it for different generations of viewers, and past episodes were seen as disposable, something not expected to be seen again (the mentality that led to the erasure of so many of them). So its continuity was a mess. Atlantis was destroyed in three contradictory ways. Earth was destroyed/devastated in a few different ways, at least a couple of which were incompatible. The future development of Earth's technology was portrayed quite inconsistently as well -- one story gives them transmats (teleporters) by 2100, but many later stories show no sign of the technology hundreds or thousands of years further forward. Mars was home to the Ice Warriors in the Second Doctor era, but they weren't mentioned at all in "The Pyramids of Mars." The Daleks and Cybermen met their final ends multiple times, and updated Cyberman designs were used in place of older designs no matter where the stories were set in time. UNIT stories were presumed to be set nearly a decade in the future, the late '70s and early '80s, while they were being made, but when the Brigadier returned in "Mawdryn Undead" it was assumed that the UNIT era had happened in real time, with the Brig retiring in 1976. And the show was blithely unconcerned with the kind of time paradoxes that so intrigue Moffat; every time the Doctor met his former selves, the question of whether he should remember living through the same events was completely ignored.

So while I can analyze and nitpick the heck out of other SFTV shows, I've rarely seen the point with Doctor Who. It's more the sort of show where you just roll with the absurdities and don't worry about how it holds together.
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Old June 23 2013, 11:02 PM   #215
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Re: One particular SPOILER from The Name of the Doctor

Basically, the MST3K "mantra".

Sincerely,

Bill
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