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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

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Old June 18 2013, 02:04 PM   #1
Charles Phipps
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So what characters do you think have changed the most?

An interesting question given the Novelverse has gone on a pretty long time.

Which characters have 'evolved' in your opinion to someone entirely new.

I'd love to hear.

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Old June 18 2013, 05:04 PM   #2
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Picard is close to completing his journey.

He is married to the woman the show set up as then resisted using as his probable romantic interest and he has overcome his dislike of children via Wesley.

His priorities have changed - he has allowed himself to be conflicted in his career by his relationship with Beverly and he has become a father. He is now considering leaving Starfleet for his families sake.

I'd say that's change...
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Old June 18 2013, 05:06 PM   #3
Charles Phipps
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Good call. In a very real way, Picard realized he's not ONLY a starship Captain. He's made the transition Kirk couldn't. It also seems possible the Borg and Dominion War "ruined" being a Captain for him.
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Old June 18 2013, 06:51 PM   #4
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Other Characters that have changed a lot Benjamin Sisko and Kassidy yates certainly have in the last few typhon pact novels .Also Will Riker Riker&Deanna Troi and the struggle to have their daughter that certainly changed their characters priorities.
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Old June 18 2013, 08:29 PM   #5
Sran
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Charles Phipps wrote: View Post
Good call. In a very real way, Picard realized he's not ONLY a starship Captain. He's made the transition Kirk couldn't. It also seems possible the Borg and Dominion War "ruined" being a Captain for him.
I don't know that they ruined being a captain so much as they helped him redefine his priorities. He's realized that his career isn't everything and that there are other things in a person's life that can be worthwhile. I agree that he's a more complete character than Kirk at this point: Kirk could never let go of the Enterprise, the biggest reason why he was never able to settle down and have a normal life. I suppose he was never meant for that sort of thing, but it would have been nice to see him finally find peace somewhere else besides a command chair.

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Old June 18 2013, 08:40 PM   #6
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

I heard an interview with David mack that he had written the perfect death for Jean Luc Picard but that it will never see the light of day. I kind of wish we will see the end of his journey. i don't want Admiral or Ambassador Picard.
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Old June 18 2013, 08:48 PM   #7
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

^I wouldn't mind it as long as Riker doesn't tell him to shut up.

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Old June 18 2013, 10:28 PM   #8
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Khan Harrison wrote: View Post
I heard an interview with David mack that he had written the perfect death for Jean Luc Picard but that it will never see the light of day. I kind of wish we will see the end of his journey. i don't want Admiral or Ambassador Picard.
I will have to disagree there - with the loss of Spock, Treklit has an opening for a senior statesman/ambassador... Picard would be fantastic !
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Old June 18 2013, 10:38 PM   #9
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Relayer1 wrote: View Post
I will have to disagree there - with the loss of Spock, Treklit has an opening for a senior statesman/ambassador... Picard would be fantastic !
I'd vote for Odo. He's older, and he's a Changeling.

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Old June 19 2013, 12:45 AM   #10
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Chakotay.

End of thread.
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Old June 19 2013, 01:00 AM   #11
Charles Phipps
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Sran wrote: View Post
I don't know that they ruined being a captain so much as they helped him redefine his priorities. He's realized that his career isn't everything and that there are other things in a person's life that can be worthwhile. I agree that he's a more complete character than Kirk at this point: Kirk could never let go of the Enterprise, the biggest reason why he was never able to settle down and have a normal life. I suppose he was never meant for that sort of thing, but it would have been nice to see him finally find peace somewhere else besides a command chair.
I always felt that was an interesting element to Star Trek 1, 2, 3, and 4. That Captain Kirk, yes, is still worthwhile a Starship Captain (and may be why Picard is able to continue operating one well into his seventies) who was "kicked upstairs" way too soon and may have been a lousy Starfleet Chief of Operations--it still was treated him as being grossly immature in places. Seeing the Peter Principle in play for Captain Kirk, of all things, is darkly humorous.

Having Picard deliberately not go that route works for me and helps further contrast the already distinct Captains.

Khan Harrison wrote: View Post
I heard an interview with David mack that he had written the perfect death for Jean Luc Picard but that it will never see the light of day. I kind of wish we will see the end of his journey. i don't want Admiral or Ambassador Picard.
Maybe he can throw it in one of his books using time travel or a vision of the future.

I actually think Admiral Picard would be better than in Kirk's case. Then again, I think Kirk would have been fine if Starfleet had "mobile Admirals" commanding the fleet "in the field." Sadly, Starfleet just wasn't large enough for that way back when.
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Old June 19 2013, 01:14 AM   #12
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Thrawn wrote: View Post
Chakotay.

End of thread.
Yeah, he's gone through some pretty dramatic changes in Kirsten MF Beyer's Voyager novels. And Seven has gone through some pretty big changes in those same novels too.
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Old June 19 2013, 03:00 AM   #13
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Charles Phipps wrote: View Post
Then again, I think Kirk would have been fine if Starfleet had "mobile Admirals" commanding the fleet "in the field." Sadly, Starfleet just wasn't large enough for that way back when.
Interesting you should say that, because I think that's what his position was supposed to be, in theory. The novels paint the picture of Kirk being offered something of a troubleshooter position that's within the admiralty but still allows enough action that someone like Kirk could be satisfied. In reality, the position turned out to be him flying a desk for two years while Enterprise was in drydock.

Later, he was commandant of Starfleet Academy, which he probably took because it let him work with Spock and McCoy. By the time TWOK rolled around, he was going through a sort of midlife crisis and didn't think he was capable of commanding a ship any longer, but Spock and McCoy convinced him that it was what was best for him.

As an aside, I don't think Kirk was incompetent as an admiral. Recall that Marrow called him his "best officer," which I'm sure speaks at least somewhat to his performance as a flag officer. He just didn't like it and was clearly better suited for field duty. In the end, the decision to demote him as "punishment" for disobeying orders was the right move, one that I'm sure Starfleet never regretted.

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Old June 19 2013, 07:19 AM   #14
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

I'd say Ezri Dax, but as she's a Dax it means she's bound to change. Anyone who read The Lives of Dax knows this.

So I'll have to settle for T'Pol. From being a royal pain to actually establishing a family with a human to vulcan transspecies convert.
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Old June 19 2013, 12:47 PM   #15
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Re: So what characters do you think have changed the most?

Thrawn wrote: View Post
Chakotay.

End of thread.
This. Very much this.
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