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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Voyager

Voyager There's coffee in this forum!

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Old June 6 2013, 05:02 AM   #511
teacake
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

It is pretty stodgy watching series after series of a room with a big chair in the middle and some smaller chairs in front of it and everyone pushing buttons on their desks.
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Old June 6 2013, 05:53 AM   #512
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Voyager can run on a hundred people.

They were fine.
Voyager can run on Seven, Janeway, and the Doc.
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Old June 6 2013, 05:54 AM   #513
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

But who will do the cooking?

Oh that's right, Janeway and 7 will have candle lit ration packs in her quarters and the Doc doesn't need to eat.
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Old June 17 2013, 04:33 AM   #514
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

I felt there were a number of plot ideas that could have been better developed. Also, not only did the Starfleet and the Maquii crews became buddy-buddy too fast. They also befriended some of the new aliens too fast. Most notably, the species 8472. These guys started out at being quite terrifying to meet up with. And that idea lasted just a few episodes. Then they befriend the species when the Voyager crew finds a replica of Starfleet headquarters set up by this alien. That was a huge disappointment as it immediately killed off new plot ideas for this species to make life difficult for Voyager. But the real thing that did me in was Voyager's series finale. For 7 years, I was nursing a strong feeling of suspense in wondering if Voyager would reach home. Kind of like the "who shot JR" plot of Dallas (Dallas did a great job of keeping its audience in suspense and they had the whole world watching.) But not with Voyager. In the finale, not even 5 minutes into the show, it is revealed that Janeway and most of the crew was already home, safe and sound. No more fun suspense.They completely killed it. That was it.
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Old June 17 2013, 04:42 AM   #515
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Well to be fair, they were unlikely to end the show with the crew not getting home. Not having the crew get home would have been a risky move, but if they had gone that route it might have been one of the more memorable endings for a TV show.

But overall in the show you never really got the impression that it might take them decades to get back to Earth.
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Old June 17 2013, 06:06 AM   #516
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Jeez. Is this thread still going? VOYAGER was awesome! Sure, it had flaws. Sure, the bad episodes were the worst in Trek history. Sure, the most inventive characters: EMH and 7, were overused. Every Trek series had flaws. VOY remains one of my favorites. Plus, Janeway was awesome.
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Old June 17 2013, 12:06 PM   #517
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Overused? I never got sick of them. Long may they shine.
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Old June 17 2013, 04:25 PM   #518
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Vulcan Logician wrote: View Post
Jeez. Is this thread still going? VOYAGER was awesome! Sure, it had flaws. Sure, the bad episodes were the worst in Trek history. Sure, the most inventive characters: EMH and 7, were overused. Every Trek series had flaws. VOY remains one of my favorites. Plus, Janeway was awesome.
Yes it is true all TV shows/Films have flaws. But if as you say VOY had some of the worst Trek episodes in the history of Trek, couldn't that mean it's bad vs good/great is reduced.

Now I could say I say

Bad vs Good/Great for ST shows

TOS 40 vs 60
TNG 40 vs 60
DSN 20 vs 80
VOY 70 vs 20
ENT 50 vs 50

So based on that VOY had the poorest ratios of number of good or better epsidoes vs number of bad episodes. But others might have a different view, as we all look for different things in the shows we watch.

Some people who critise VOY do so because they feel it could have been so much more.
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Old June 17 2013, 06:03 PM   #519
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

MacLeod wrote: View Post

Some people who critise VOY do so because they feel it could have been so much more.
And also because they mostly don't realize how constrained the writers were, both by UPN and by the premise of the show.
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Old June 17 2013, 06:18 PM   #520
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

^They might have been constrained by UPN, but as for the premise the only way in which they were constrained was perhaps by the network wanting an episodic show, when the premise seemed to indicate a more heavily serialised format was needed.

There was nothing fundamentaly wrong with the premise, the problem was they wrote basically VOY as TNG v2.
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Old June 17 2013, 10:48 PM   #521
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

Structurally, Voyager was The Odyssey. The books of the Odyssey are not the serial story of the crew. There isn't even any seriality to Odysseus' adventures. You could rearrange their order or omit one or more as you wish.

No, there is no inherent storyline in the premise that Voyager betrayed. I know this may sound shockingly categorical, but it is simply an error to think so.

Anwar is right. The only way that the premise would have demanded serialization of the crew conflicts is if they were profoundly inimical to each other, such as Cardassians or Rommulans. And given the tech shown previously, a survivalist epic was a self-contradicting premise.
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Old June 18 2013, 03:26 AM   #522
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

MacLeod wrote: View Post
There was nothing fundamentaly wrong with the premise, the problem was they wrote basically VOY as TNG v2.
IMO, there were some conceptual problems with the series. They chose the wrong people to have conflict with (The Maquis just did not have enough differences with the Feds for it to work) and them knowing exactly how to get home drastically undercut the potential of the series. If you want a "Lost Ship" story you should be willing to go all the way and make them truly LOST.
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Old June 18 2013, 09:56 AM   #523
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

JoCat wrote: View Post
I felt there were a number of plot ideas that could have been better developed. Also, not only did the Starfleet and the Maquii crews became buddy-buddy too fast. They also befriended some of the new aliens too fast. Most notably, the species 8472. These guys started out at being quite terrifying to meet up with. And that idea lasted just a few episodes. Then they befriend the species when the Voyager crew finds a replica of Starfleet headquarters set up by this alien. That was a huge disappointment as it immediately killed off new plot ideas for this species to make life difficult for Voyager.
Yeah, but isn't that what Star Trek is about?
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Old June 18 2013, 10:13 AM   #524
Guy Gardener
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

There are different Governments in charge of different eras of Federation History.

Sure, it's the same type of government, sitting in the same building, and the Vulcans, as well as a few others may hang around for Centuries, but it's literally completely different administrative bodies deciding how to rule the Federation.

And by that, I mean what drugs are put in the food, water and recycled air to control behaviour.

Sometimes they may want Zombies in times of peace, but gearing up to war, the guy in charge wants spunk and pep from his, or her, or it's citizen soldiers.
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Old June 19 2013, 01:02 AM   #525
Vulcan Logician
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Re: When did voyager go wrong?

teacake wrote: View Post
Overused? I never got sick of them. Long may they shine.
Hear! Hear! I share your love of these characters, but maybe a few Kim, Torres, or even Chakotay episodes mixed in there a bit would have helped even things out. (In the final 3 seasons I mean). As much as I liked 7 and the Doctor, they were too much in the front and center near the end of the show.
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